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lotihoti
Famous Hero
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posted July 03, 2015 07:21 AM |
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Edited by lotihoti at 07:22, 03 Jul 2015.
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You can set base stats of heroes in MapObjects/faction.
But you are going to cripple might heroes then. A master of magic can eliminate much more enemies then a might then can - if he gets no attack.
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magnomagus
Admirable
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
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posted July 03, 2015 07:46 AM |
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@Elessar:
Hi I'm starting to repeat myself but,
I agree, the pace of combat is too high and I'm planning to reduce it in next version of MMH5.5 because I made it even worse compared to TOE by increasing offense secondary to 20% (although that in itself is a justified balance change)
The problem is the damage multiplier from attack primary skill = 1+0.05*(A-D). In King Bounty the Legend it is 1+0.033*(A-D). That's why that game has slower paced combat!. In H2 & 3 it is also 0.05. In H3 it is even worse actually because defense is only half as effective 1+0.025*(D-A). I have not yet decided what is the best setting for MMH5.5, but I'm leaning towards 0.04 for both A&D, I want better balance but also keep the feeling of a traditional HOMM game.
I think haste/slow then can be adjusted likewise by 0.4% per SP instead of 0.5%
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dredknight
Honorable
Supreme Hero
disrupting the moding industry
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posted July 03, 2015 08:19 AM |
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Magno, I have one thing I want you to test.
Can you do a battle where both heroes use haste.
It doesnt matter to be equal for both sides.
Then check the pace of the battle (excluding heroes).
Then reduce the haste/slow by 50% in the config files and do the same battle again.
Do you feel any loss of pace?
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magnomagus
Admirable
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
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posted July 03, 2015 08:51 AM |
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dredknight
Honorable
Supreme Hero
disrupting the moding industry
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posted July 03, 2015 11:51 AM |
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after numerous battles that did not give me any solution I say we seal this and dont touch anything.
We have to test sylvan and fortress against other factions.
Basically if Sylvan plays good and cast haste fortress is always on the losing side.
though i won all the battles with fortress today.
They were very very close, very close....but you dont get any edge on what and why is happening.
Basically lets seal this tests for now.
Something which I want to see now is inferno vs fortress and inferno vs sylvan.
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magnomagus
Admirable
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
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posted July 03, 2015 12:17 PM |
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@dredknight:
That's ok, but my answer to elessar was not related to this issue (not sure if you were referring to that)
tests vs iferno will no doubt be interesting, also I'm still hoping to see that old sylvan vs stronghold again with new index to see how the changes to earth daughters and hero combat work out.
In any case nice job!
EDIT:
Also last thing about inferno, I recently played and noticed difference in stats between pit lord and pit spawn is excessive. Pit lord quickly become useless with all XL action going on. My current plan is to make pit lord stats meet half way +10Hp +1speed.
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dredknight
Honorable
Supreme Hero
disrupting the moding industry
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posted July 03, 2015 02:05 PM |
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I really like them as casters and I want them to be such.
Unfortunately I dont know how to keep that on XL maps.
btw when I wanted to find (asked Deflactor) the creature ability power formula, my idea was to adjust it a little bit more gradually - a bit not so fast damage improvement in the begining and a little bit higher results in the end.
I still think this is a good idea to be found for later uses BUT it will be adjusted only after we have found good enough spell balance for the heroes  . thats it.
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magnomagus
Admirable
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
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posted July 03, 2015 02:39 PM |
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Quote:
I really like them as casters and I want them to be such.
I agree and that was not into question, I was just saying meteor shower does not pay off +8 skills, +2 speed, +1 initiative, +20HP and +50% magic proof after only a few months. I think it pays off ~ +3 skills, +1 speed, +1 initiative, +10HP and +50% magic proof.
The SP with creatures is the way it is because the formula is logarithmic. It would need to be completely rewritten to get what you want, it is not a matter of increasing/decreasing a number.
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dredknight
Honorable
Supreme Hero
disrupting the moding industry
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posted July 03, 2015 09:20 PM |
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zmudziak22
Supreme Hero
Heroes 3 Fan
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posted July 03, 2015 11:27 PM |
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It is possible to make haste/slow affect also creature speed? Did you balance creature banks? In beta 1 hundred of creatures is too many. At start game banks consists original toe numbers and increase by time like neutrals.
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klosarmicko
Hired Hero
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posted July 04, 2015 12:24 AM |
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Just finished toe gotai campaign on heroic. Compared to necros this one was easyyy. Magic hero is nothing compared to mighty one. I managed to clear all 4 maps, completely. ^^
btw, at world's end:
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magnomagus
Admirable
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
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posted July 04, 2015 11:29 AM |
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@zmudziak:
The speed thing is not possible, but I'm working on those banks.
@klosarmicko:
Thank you for your report, good to know this campaign doesn't have issues.
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zmudziak22
Supreme Hero
Heroes 3 Fan
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posted July 04, 2015 03:24 PM |
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@klosarmicko
What skills have both Gotai and Kujin?
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heloooo
Tavern Dweller
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posted July 05, 2015 03:00 AM |
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Hello
I had an idea to submit that this is the starting point:
finally, before lvl 25 or so, getting caugh outnumbered with a main hero leaves two choices:
-Fight and flee at the last moment; the ennemy hero takes 1 or 2 level directly ahead, and then 1 or 2 other by killing neutral monsters cause he have more troops, troops that will be alive for the next battle.
-flee quickly to avoid giving him experience and he will take a large lead troupe that will enable him to take 4or5lvl ahead or directly land in the castles and fold the game
In 2 cases the game is almost always won for the winner and I think it slows down much fighting in the first levels, the beginnings of parts is too prone to all look the same, getting XP on monsters for several months ... and that's it
I think we should give to the runaway the XP he deserve for the creatures he killed, so try to fight, to test his opponent early in the game or just reduce its ranks gonna be a valid choice. Giving different amout of xp for fighting a hero, depending his class and lvl, also when he escape, can prevent the magic spam abuse.
And if you can control the overcrowding of creature you are able to be usefull as magic all game long. Balancing (basic spell dmg and ratio, the exp for a hero killed ect) the game in this case would be very hard, but i think its worth.
Tell me what you think about this, hope you like that idea like me and if so whether it is feasible. Thx!
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dredknight
Honorable
Supreme Hero
disrupting the moding industry
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posted July 05, 2015 01:10 PM |
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@Hello I disagree with you.
If you want easy PvP rules first negotiate them with your opponent.
For example : I have a colleague who doesnt like dirty tactics.
So what we basically do is develop and when we meet at some point we give each of us a week to get all troops we can and then fight.
One of the good things about heroes (one that makes a real player masterful) is looking strategically no only on faction development but on PvP development.
Basically you need to expect when the enemy will appear based on the information from taverns and thief guilds.
It is also a must to send scouts ahead to reveal fog of war.
A lot of people dont buy scout because they prefer spending those 3-4 K gold on town development or getting more army.
In PvP one should find the balance between thinking about the future and figuring out the current situation because you may not live long enough to see the future you fight for  .
I really love to play dirty it adds another dimension to gameplay.
It makes the game not so straight forward and always keeps you on the edge that going on too much in the shroud may be your last mistake!
Now covering your points:
- overrun by numbers
If you are overrun by enemy strong hero + big army this means 2 things. Either your development is poor so you lose anyways or you have not bought most of your army. This means that fleeing is actually not so bad choice.
- flee quickly I dont get that. You can flee anytime it is your hero/creature turn which can be even in the very beginning of the battle depending on initiative differences.
- game is always won by the winner yes... anything besides that will be quite ambiguous, dont you think?
Basically losing on the first weeks doesnt mean an end. you can always go to castle an replenish with next week population and you can always defend against stronger enemy if you are behind castle towers.
Losing on month 2-3 well basically this is when your town development finish on most maps and you gather some 70-80% of your army. Actually heroes 5.5 gives the ability to increase that period to 5-6 months!!!
Because if you develop faster you have the strategic choice to grind the good areas first or to charge your enemy gates. though doing the first can backfire if you are not careful .
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zmudziak22
Supreme Hero
Heroes 3 Fan
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posted July 05, 2015 03:03 PM |
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I played demo map on beta 1 version fortress vs stronghold.
I used the dvarves and Hangvul. The AI had Crag Hack main Hero. My key to win against orcs were Lava Dragons + Armageddon and High SP.
In open fight i lose using full amry even with all runes, but after chasing in castle it was piece of cake. He only sit on ass and defend.
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magnomagus
Admirable
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
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posted July 05, 2015 03:29 PM |
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@heloooo:
This would be very complex script using lots of resources for little gain. above lvl 25 the experience is not going to make much difference. the experience gain/dead ratio vs enemy hero is terrible, you can get the same much easier by attacking a treasure building.
@zmudziak:
How about updating to BETA 2 ?!
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etore
Adventuring Hero
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posted July 05, 2015 07:07 PM |
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Hall of Intrigue
I played some maps, TOE and random 5.5 maps, and this building did not provided +1 knowledge to the Warlocks in none of them. Beta 2.
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Psatkha
Promising
Known Hero
H5 MODder
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posted July 05, 2015 07:17 PM |
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Edited by Psatkha at 19:32, 05 Jul 2015.
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Hello magnomagus!
Do you know that LUA_Script functions is not supported?
Sincerely, Psatkha.
P.S. This support is needed because the project NHF
This project also adds new characters but it not using new classes - only LUA_Script functions!
P.P.S. I think it makes sense to use the new heroes of the project NHF and add them to Heroes 5.5!
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lotihoti
Famous Hero
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posted July 05, 2015 07:39 PM |
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