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Heroes Community > Heroes 5 - Modders Workshop > Thread: [MOD] Might & Magic: Heroes 5.5
Thread: [MOD] Might & Magic: Heroes 5.5 This Popular Thread is 435 pages long: 1 50 100 ... 121 122 123 124 125 ... 150 200 250 300 350 400 435 · «PREV / NEXT»
Wakke
Wakke


Hired Hero
posted February 03, 2016 10:58 PM

Can paladins become death knights through necromancy?

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matod
matod


Adventuring Hero
posted February 04, 2016 07:44 AM

I dont think it should be resistance to be hones what if you got chain lightning it will be the same.. and if i got artefact to resist maybe i would win .. so generaly the might hero vs mage is allways looking for some resistances , i just tought in mine game you would prefer light magic so i take shatter light but i was just wrong.. but what i suggest is to maybe reduce the boost of +50 damage of artifact to 35 % and resistance artifact too , so they dont affect game so much

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matod
matod


Adventuring Hero
posted February 04, 2016 08:11 AM

devilfire i agree it need boost nobody takes it.

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dredknight
dredknight


Honorable
Supreme Hero
disrupting the moding industry
posted February 04, 2016 08:50 AM

I think that necromancy is pretty OK as it is now.
The base skill is quite good, the perks just make it a bit better from here and there.

Basically necromancy help you gather a lot of army, eternal servitude improves that by cutting losses here and there, haunting mines increase ghost production, lord of necreomancy is pretty self explanatory, unholy crusade is half defensive half offensive for the +1 speed bost.

The bottom perk tree help you convert the raw HP you have gathered into passive damage (chilling bones) and also adds some additional damage to the undead units (frozen blade) which due to their overall low initiative and poor mobility do not hit that often.

Regarding Inferno and resistance.
After Magno reminded me that Shatter light has 50% fire resistance perk I am willing to change my mind a bit.

Basically Inferno are one of the few factions which can make a mage to pieces if you know what and how to chose. Combining shatter light + fire resistance with shatter destruction (this is for might heroes) will most certainly bring and dwarven mage on his knees.

Plus the elementals will really help out with grinding which is a bit of an issue with inferno.

I have something very interesting in mind for inferno but before I test it is possible I wont tell .

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matod
matod


Adventuring Hero
posted February 04, 2016 10:38 AM

Well i think it was possible for me to win that map , but i should take less agresive approach and didnt make that bet you will have mostly light magic.. but i still think that +50% damage artifict is too op dont you think?

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devilfire
devilfire


Adventuring Hero
posted February 04, 2016 11:07 AM

Nothing will change with the Necromancy, it would keep all of its current traits.

This change will make you find a tactic that involve losing only one kind of troops. That way Necropolis will be all about reviving after battle instead of in battle like the others.

The game already have the concept, it just need to be improved.

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Belisarius
Belisarius


Promising
Known Hero
posted February 04, 2016 11:32 AM
Edited by Belisarius at 12:22, 04 Feb 2016.

As magno and dredknight pointed out, it is precisely Shatter Light that has perk with 50% resistance to fire. Which makes it a good choice for this game.

What brings us to this situation you guys are discussing, as my view, is the following:
In order to achieve a much more competitive game, for expert players, Game Settings are adjusted accordingly. Very strong monsters with a scarce map. Two towns only, no underground, starting with minimal resources.
This settings have many "positive" effects on game-play, mostly filtering out "not-so-dood" players, while allowing experienced ones to really shine.
But at the same time, the devil is in those same details. Details that become decisive on this game settings. One relatively small detail, one perk, artifact, spell/skill, etc, becomes game-changer.

I believe this is because overall game balance is achieved trough game's richness with options. Not trough scarceness. And those options are reduced to a minimum with this setup. So at any one particular time, at any precisely one situation, what is a detail becomes decisive, overwhelming. The game-experience in this settings has a "zoomed in" effect.
Statistically, to reach overall balance, a lot of samples, a big number of games need to be played with this game settings. So on great number of games played, valid conclusions about balance can be made.

This one game, although, I'm sure, very interesting to play, and of course, enjoyable to watch, can not give any meaningful conclusions for game balance, on it's own. Only if taken as part of many games played, as one of a bigger number of samples, then it can provide useful info for balance tweaks.
So you need to play more games.

Anyhow, it is my observation that game settings are very much important when talking about balance. On scarce maps settings, like this one, big number of games needs to be played. With richer game settings, that number of games can be somewhat smaller. Cause there would be more options realized in any one particular game.

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dredknight
dredknight


Honorable
Supreme Hero
disrupting the moding industry
posted February 04, 2016 11:44 AM

matod said:
Well i think it was possible for me to win that map , but i should take less agresive approach and didnt make that bet you will have mostly light magic.. but i still think that +50% damage artifict is too op dont you think?


I think that any % number is not a fit because it is % based on the damage. And damage changes.
If you do weak damage the artifact wont help much, if you do loads of damage it will make the spell even stronger.

Late game 50% wont help that much nevertheless what kind of damage you just because creature stacks become huge in numbers, so you mostly rely on the effects (half defense, stun, freeze).

Actually I can agree on 30% boost but this is just pure gut feeling.

I think that I would have won the battle even without the artifact. I got empowered fireball and you placed all your troops on one place so basically one blast is enough to do huge damage even without the artifact.

Plus if we include some some minor readjustments so horned demons couldnt hit on round 1 my hero would have had more time to cast fireballs.

Basically all that has to be done by a mage is maneuver in order to survive while casting the spells and killing enemy stacks.


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magnomagus
magnomagus


Admirable
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
posted February 04, 2016 12:18 PM
Edited by magnomagus at 12:19, 04 Feb 2016.

Quote:
Can paladins become death knights through necromancy?


If this is a gamemechanics question then: no

Quote:
and you placed all your troops on one place


there is not necessarily a balance issue if a loss is caused by a tactical mistake


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dredknight
dredknight


Honorable
Supreme Hero
disrupting the moding industry
posted February 04, 2016 01:23 PM

@Besalius I also believe that a 2-town-per-player map will be optimal for the current game mechanic.

At this point both Might and Magic will be equal in strength when players meet + a lot of economy bargain will be made to optimize benefits which is just as important as how you fight.
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Belisarius
Belisarius


Promising
Known Hero
posted February 04, 2016 01:52 PM

dredknight said:
@Besalius I also believe that a 2-town-per-player map will be optimal for the current game mechanic.

At this point both Might and Magic will be equal in strength when players meet + a lot of economy bargain will be made to optimize benefits which is just as important as how you fight.


+1

I agree.
Previous setup for PvP (the one you played) is fine. Excellent for high end play. But as long as a big number of games are played; and, of course, IF the players are very close to each other on a scale of their heroes knowledge. So only small details will decide. And when those details decide they do so in a way that is overwhelmingly decisive.

2 town-per-player map will give better results with smaller number of games played, together with better balance per game. Every game would be richer in options, while at same time, a high end player will do as good as in the previous setup.

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matod
matod


Adventuring Hero
posted February 04, 2016 02:57 PM

yes moar games , but i still think a small tournament maybe with new mod realease can be fun , but we have to set rules and template i prefer M it dont take that much time

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magnomagus
magnomagus


Admirable
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
posted February 04, 2016 02:57 PM

Quote:
I also believe that a 2-town-per-player map will be optimal for the current game mechanic.


It is not about the amount of towns, but the amount of random events occurring before 2 players meet. The more random events have occurred the more equal will be the avg result of those events.

Same as in poker, good players need to play many hands to distinguish themselves from bad players.

This is fundamental feature of any randomized game. A map with 2 towns but more distance like Belt templates have similar effect.
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dredknight
dredknight


Honorable
Supreme Hero
disrupting the moding industry
posted February 04, 2016 03:14 PM

@Magno, yes this is correct.  I was refering to the balance with 1 castle where players meet too early and Magic heroes (summoning/destruction) are just too strong, where the might hero has no army to utilize his skills with it.
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magnomagus
magnomagus


Admirable
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
posted February 04, 2016 03:20 PM

Quote:
I was refering to the balance with 1 castle where players meet too early and Magic heroes (summoning/destruction) are just too strong, where the might hero has no army to utilize his skills with it.


with regards to this issue I'm starting to believe a lot of low level spells are just too cheap. especially because magic heroes will often get arcane training. for example I think weakness(4) and slow(5) are better priced as 5 and 6 and stone spikes/ lightning = 6, eldritch arrow = 5.


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Skeggy
Skeggy


Promising
Famous Hero
posted February 04, 2016 08:15 PM
Edited by Skeggy at 20:18, 04 Feb 2016.

Wouldn't it be better, if it's possible, that Fire Resistance perk, under Shatter Light Magic, gives only 50% damage reduction from all fire spell attacks.
Perhaps, just the immunity alone, of armor damaging effects of Master of Fire ability, should be given to Shatter Destructive Magic, instead of Mana Burst, and Mana Burst could replace Resistance in Shatter Dark Magic.


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Wakke
Wakke


Hired Hero
posted February 04, 2016 10:14 PM

magnomagus said:
Quote:
Can paladins become death knights through necromancy?


If this is a gamemechanics question then: no




Sorry if I was not clear. Is it in the power of this mod to make it so that paladin casualties are resurrected to death knights after combat by necromancy?

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magnomagus
magnomagus


Admirable
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
posted February 04, 2016 10:29 PM

Technically that is possible, but not a feasible option as you won't be able to maintain a sufficiently large enough population to make them useful.
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Forsberg
Forsberg


Adventuring Hero
posted February 04, 2016 10:51 PM

Please add skill-wheel to the window where you pick the next level up.
It may be skill wheel like well known FLash version or something else.

I see there are buttons I II III but inside this there is no explanation, just plain icons. Some kind what a skeleton hand means would be nice

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thGryphn
thGryphn


Promising
Famous Hero
posted February 05, 2016 09:47 AM

Forsberg said:
Please add skill-wheel to the window where you pick the next level up.
It may be skill wheel like well known FLash version or something else.

I see there are buttons I II III but inside this there is no explanation, just plain icons. Some kind what a skeleton hand means would be nice


I was thinking about this too.
Would it be possible to add tooltips that popup on mouse-over on the icons?

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