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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: Is Hypnotize spell totally useless in late game?!
Thread: Is Hypnotize spell totally useless in late game?! This thread is 3 pages long: 1 2 3 · «PREV / NEXT»
Drakon-Deus
Drakon-Deus


Legendary Hero
posted November 27, 2015 10:41 PM

I felt that all level 3 spells were not really worth the price, they should have been optional or something. Very situational...

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted November 27, 2015 10:55 PM

Anti magic, Forgetfulness, Force field, Teleport, they are indeed situational: when battle is unwinable, they save your ass.

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Gryphs
Gryphs


Supreme Hero
The Clever Title
posted November 27, 2015 10:59 PM

Salamandre said:
Forgetfulness
Love that spell. I mean who wants archers shooting.
____________
"Don't resist the force. Redirect it. Water over rock."-blizzardboy

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Svartzorn
Svartzorn


Known Hero
Dead struggling with death.
posted November 27, 2015 11:08 PM

Useless spell.
Came to like Force Field just recently
____________
Death to the world.

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted November 27, 2015 11:29 PM

Drakon-Deus said:
I felt that all level 3 spells were not really worth the price, they should have been optional or something. Very situational...

I once considered level 3 spells pretty bad, but now I consider a lot of them good. Hypnotize remains bad though, compare it to Berserk which is only one level higher, has no hp cap and affects several stacks. Berserk is too good and Hypnotize is too bad.

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OhforfSake
OhforfSake


Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted November 28, 2015 12:15 AM

Depends on the magic school I guess.

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Drakon-Deus
Drakon-Deus


Legendary Hero
posted November 28, 2015 09:43 AM
Edited by Drakon-Deus at 09:53, 28 Nov 2015.

Well, I don't disagree, in some... situations they are useful, but never as useful to me as the other level spells, no matter the magic school.

I guess I just didn't encounter those situations like having to cast Force Field on a shooter and winning a fight with that Ammo Cart, already a trope in user-made maps.

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted November 28, 2015 12:30 PM
Edited by phoenix4ever at 12:32, 28 Nov 2015.

You don't cast Force Field on shooters, you cast it to block Behemoths, Hydras and other units from getting in your face.

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Drakon-Deus
Drakon-Deus


Legendary Hero
posted November 28, 2015 01:02 PM

Yeah, I meant near a shooter, you know what I meant... I never cast it, lol.

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted November 28, 2015 01:20 PM

Alright then.

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bloodsucker
bloodsucker


Legendary Hero
posted November 28, 2015 03:33 PM
Edited by bloodsucker at 15:57, 28 Nov 2015.

Hypnotize the remainings of a stack to suck the retaliation from another also works, I'm surprised noone brought it yet (but open gate is even better, ofc).

@Drakon-Deus But you cast Earthquake and Forgetfullness, right?
Me, I cast a lot of Destroy Hundead and Animate Dead too.

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RoseKavalier
RoseKavalier


Honorable
Famous Hero
posted November 28, 2015 03:57 PM

Whaat? Hypnotize can be pretty good!

*Use an hypnotized creature to close the gap protecting your last creature from certain doom.

*If you have an AoE spell, the AI will also not want to bring his other creatures next to an hypnotized stack.

(Nautilus/Biobob)

*And then there's this:

(Richard Chen)

*An easy way to figure out the amount of HP hypnotize will control is: look at the damage of Lightning Bolt, they have the same formulas

I think Salamandre already hit the nail on its head. All spells are situational.

Same with some "useless" skills, First Aid can be your best friend in some situations. One could even cook a map where you actually need Learning

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bloodsucker
bloodsucker


Legendary Hero
posted November 28, 2015 04:00 PM
Edited by bloodsucker at 16:07, 28 Nov 2015.

RoseKavalier said:
One could even cook a map where you actually need Learning

Good luck on that.

Weren't you suposed to summon Water Elements in that fight?

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RoseKavalier
RoseKavalier


Honorable
Famous Hero
posted November 28, 2015 04:12 PM
Edited by RoseKavalier at 16:13, 28 Nov 2015.

Yes, the "original" solution was to fill the garrison with Water Elementals. But this solution should work as well unless he cooked the spell points, I haven't tried it.

After finishing Metataxer's Revenge I looked for some info and found this file from Biobob showing the hypnotize trick so I kept it in mind.

re Learning:

Say I give you a map where there is a finite amount of experience available and you need the extra 15% from Learning to achieve a certain level to pass a border guard?

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bloodsucker
bloodsucker


Legendary Hero
posted November 28, 2015 04:34 PM

RoseKavalier said:
Say I give you a map where there is a finite amount of experience available and you need the extra 15% from Learning to achieve a certain level to pass a border guard?

Unless you set every neutral creature to "not grow" is just to wait for another week or two, bad players will have it without thinking.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted November 28, 2015 04:38 PM

Maps where areas passability is based on experience/levels are more than often a disaster. Kingslayer designed such map (Art of War I think is the name) and if you play faster than his tests, the growth is less, less AI invaders to defeat, then you have to wait and wait while doing nothing but waiting heroes to come in and get killed. That's the worst way to force someone to do exactly same and same moves every game.

If a few areas asking this, could be okay, but all his map was designed around this quest: get experience.

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bloodsucker
bloodsucker


Legendary Hero
posted November 28, 2015 05:10 PM
Edited by bloodsucker at 17:13, 28 Nov 2015.

@Sal Yeah, I'm having that problem right now in King's Dream. I have the map in my hands and enemies are weak but I have a quest for level 60 and I'm on 52. The only way to get that level is to wait for banks to restock, while killing lesser heroes or visit a bunch of Trees quite early for my taste. On the other hand, if I didn't script the Black Market to buy prims and played with the Arcane Tower script, I would have overflowed my main's attack right now.

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Drakon-Deus
Drakon-Deus


Legendary Hero
posted November 28, 2015 11:41 PM

bloodsucker said:
Hypnotize the remainings of a stack to suck the retaliation from another also works, I'm surprised noone brought it yet (but open gate is even better, ofc).

@Drakon-Deus But you cast Earthquake and Forgetfullness, right?
Me, I cast a lot of Destroy Hundead and Animate Dead too.


On situations when they are needed sure, but not in every game because there is no real use, except maybe Forgetfulness, but it doesn't even work on titan

These spells are useful, but not as often as many of the other spells.

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Biobob
Biobob


Famous Hero
the Bobler
posted January 31, 2016 06:53 PM

Thank you, RoseKavalier, for looking at my heroes 3 tactics booklet! Indeed, hypnotize can be used in the above way, but it won't work in Metataxer's Revenge since I gave too little spell points to kill dragons (at least that should be the case). I wanted to include such a fight in my next map, but im not sure if I'll ever finish it...

I think it is quite interesting that the AI knows which spells you have in your book and acts accordingly to it...if you didnt have Meteor shower in the above scenario, it wouldnt work!

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted May 23, 2016 07:58 PM

I don't know if anyone else know about this, but I found good use for Hypnotize:
When fighting enchanters hypnotize them and they will cast mass spells on YOU instead of the enemy. When they have their turn, use them to hit the most dangerous stack of the enemy, to take away their retaliation.

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