Heroes of Might and Magic Community
visiting hero! Register | Today's Posts | Games | Search! | FAQ/Rules | AvatarList | MemberList | Profile


Age of Heroes Headlines:  
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
6 Aug 2016: Troubled Heroes VII Expansion Release - read more
26 Apr 2016: Heroes VII XPack - Trial by Fire - Coming out in June! - read more
17 Apr 2016: Global Alternative Creatures MOD for H7 after 1.8 Patch! - read more
7 Mar 2016: Romero launches a Piano Sonata Album Kickstarter! - read more
19 Feb 2016: Heroes 5.5 RC6, Heroes VII patch 1.7 are out! - read more
13 Jan 2016: Horn of the Abyss 1.4 Available for Download! - read more
17 Dec 2015: Heroes 5.5 update, 1.6 out for H7 - read more
23 Nov 2015: H7 1.4 & 1.5 patches Released - read more
31 Oct 2015: First H7 patches are out, End of DoC development - read more
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
[X] Remove Ads
LOGIN:     Username:     Password:         [ Register ]
New Server | HOMM1: info forum | HOMM2: info forum | HOMM3: info forum | HOMM4: info forum | HOMM5: info forum | MMH6: wiki forum | MMH7: wiki forum
Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: Worst skill (HOMM3)
Thread: Worst skill (HOMM3) This thread is 10 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 · «PREV / NEXT»
Homer171
Homer171


Promising
Supreme Hero
posted November 26, 2015 02:03 PM

Eye is gamble and i don't like the odd's. Easy pick 4 me
____________
Don't be too proud of this technological terror you've constructed. The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of the Force.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted November 26, 2015 02:34 PM

phoenix4ever said:
Could'nt ERM work with HotA though? Like for example having 9th and 10th skill?  


But this is the point of closed code: not having every guy here and there mess with code, add whatever he likes, create bugs then say "is hota". Is similar to what happened to me years ago: released TEW4 but with commanders OFF, as I dislike those pesky hulks. Chinese modders swear only on commanders, so they modified my mod to work with commanders. Obviously, this is a major change so map started to bug, battles to crash, then who received angry emails, half chinese, half korean? ME, as they left author email in.
____________
Era II mods and utilities

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Svartzorn
Svartzorn


Known Hero
Dead struggling with death.
posted November 26, 2015 02:48 PM

How can people dislike learning? It amounts TONS of XP, you can level up a hero easier.
Now scouting has its uses, evejn though I think it's pretty useless. First aid is, by far, the more useless skill I've ever seen, theere's probably something I*'m unaware of.
____________
Death to the world.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted November 26, 2015 02:50 PM

You didn't look closely at learning. Concept is great, but check the maths about: how many exp points you need to get to expert learning, then how many of those points are returned and from what level exactly you start to receive bonuses.
____________
Era II mods and utilities

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted November 26, 2015 03:13 PM
Edited by phoenix4ever at 15:19, 26 Nov 2015.

Svartzorn said:
How can people dislike learning? It amounts TONS of XP, you can level up a hero easier.
Now scouting has its uses, evejn though I think it's pretty useless. First aid is, by far, the more useless skill I've ever seen, theere's probably something I*'m unaware of.


I'll just post this again:

I made a little test the other day about Learning and a hero gaining 500000 xp will be level 30. Then I made the same test with the hero starting with EXPERT Learning meaning he got 575000 xp making him level ...30 meaning he gained nothing! Actually he lost something because instead of Learning he could have used 3 skill levels for Expert Earth, Wisdom, Logistics, Offense, Armorer etc.
Just to be clear I made the same test with lower amounts of xp too and if the hero was lucky he would be one level above normal. But this was even starting with EXPERT Learning, which no hero does.

Here are my results if anyone cares. First is without Learning, second is with Expert Learning.
2500  (Level 3)  > 2875  (Level 3)
5000  (Level 5)  > 5750  (Level 5)
10000 (Level 8)  > 11500 (Level 8)
15000 (Level 10) > 17250 (Level 10)
20000 (Level 11) > 23000 (Level 12)
25000 (Level 13) > 28750 (Level 14)
50000 (Level 17) > 57500 (Level 18)
75000 (Level 19) > 86250 (Level 20)
100000 (Level 21) > 115000 (Level 21)
175000 (Level 24) > 201250 (Level 25)
250000 (Level 26) > 287500 (Level 26)
375000 (Level 28) > 431250 (Level 29)
500000 (Level 30) > 575000 (Level 30)
750000 (Level 32) > 862500 (Level 33)
1000000(Level 33) > 1115000(Level 34)

So I still don't see how Eagle Eye is worse than Learning...

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Galaad
Galaad

Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
posted November 26, 2015 03:25 PM

phoenix4ever said:
So I still don't see how Eagle Eye is worse than Learning...


Because it isn't.
____________
Even Italian restaurants seemed to betray me. -Neraus

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted November 26, 2015 03:30 PM
Edited by phoenix4ever at 15:32, 26 Nov 2015.

According to my poll people find Eagle Eye to be the worst skill.
Eagle Eye is at least fun, last timed I played with an Eagle Eye specialist I managed to learn 6 spells including Slow and Armageddon. That is much better than getting 0-1 levels with Learning.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Galaad
Galaad

Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
posted November 26, 2015 03:32 PM

This is because most people in your poll are wrong.
____________
Even Italian restaurants seemed to betray me. -Neraus

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted November 26, 2015 03:33 PM

Seems so.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Svartzorn
Svartzorn


Known Hero
Dead struggling with death.
posted November 26, 2015 04:15 PM

Salamandre said:
You didn't look closely at learning. Concept is great, but check the maths about: how many exp points you need to get to expert learning, then how many of those points are returned and from what level exactly you start to receive bonuses.


That's just pessimism. With the skill you're literally boosting XP out of nothing. It will amount a great deal late game and in early game you'll just have a beefier hero.
I do like it.
Either way, you can't just say it's a worse deal than First Aid PP
____________
Death to the world.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Drakon-Deus
Drakon-Deus


Legendary Hero
Quién Sabe?
posted November 26, 2015 04:18 PM

First Aid = no aid most of the time

Learning = little reward


And both use up a slot.  

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted November 26, 2015 04:19 PM

Testing the maths side and getting a scientific conclusion is not pessimism.
____________
Era II mods and utilities

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted November 26, 2015 04:31 PM

Svartzorn did you look at my math? Learning IS the worst skill in the game.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Svartzorn
Svartzorn


Known Hero
Dead struggling with death.
posted November 26, 2015 04:50 PM
Edited by Svartzorn at 16:52, 26 Nov 2015.

Sorry Phoenix, didn't see that before.
Are you telling me heroes actually take more XP to level up once they got learning?
Is that skill literally a placebo? Because if so, that just means it's broken.

Edit: snow, I get it now. Can't believe that it's just innocuous.
____________
Death to the world.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted November 26, 2015 04:54 PM

I'm afraid so, I don't know what the developers where thinking when they thought of the skill. Rememeber it is only 5, 10 and 15% increase to XP, which translates to 0-1 level. You also use one precious skillslot where you could have had something actually useful. So my advice would be to stay far away from Learning and heroes starting with it.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted November 26, 2015 04:56 PM

Learning is great skill in Might and Magic 6-8, where the amount of experience you get from kills is hundred times bigger than in Heroes, then there is no cap on levels, while in Heroes after 74 you are screwed. Moreover learning in MM series can be upgraded up to 62% extra experience, not a pitiful 15% as in Heroes.
____________
Era II mods and utilities

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Svartzorn
Svartzorn


Known Hero
Dead struggling with death.
posted November 26, 2015 04:56 PM

@Sal Yeah, I edited to express my understanding.

In that case, that's the worst skill in the game. It pretty much handicaps your hero by taking one of his slots with a skill that basically DRAINS your XP, since more XP goes nowhere.
It's just useless, Jeez.
____________
Death to the world.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Supreme Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted November 26, 2015 05:04 PM

@Sal Yeah Learning would be much better if it was like Might and Magic 6-8, 62% might even have been too much.

@Svartzorn Glad that I learned you Learning is a skill which needs not to be learned.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
OhforfSake
OhforfSake


Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted November 26, 2015 05:23 PM

Salamandre said:
Moreover learning in MM series can be upgraded up to 62% extra experience, not a pitiful 15% as in Heroes.


Where did you get 62% from? I thought learning gave (rank*skill+9)% more xp, so at basic level 1, it'd be 10%, gm level 10 49% and at the maximum, gm level 60, it'd be 249%? Haven't played the game for a long time now, but I recall after not finding any more need for heroism and bless npc's I'd e.g. go for +25 Learning from NPC's.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted November 26, 2015 05:31 PM

I only remember about having to invest 62 points into learning, and the first one said 1%, but uts been a long time. If it is 249%, then even better.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Jump To: « Prev Thread . . . Next Thread » This thread is 10 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 · «PREV / NEXT»
Post New Poll    Post New Topic    Post New Reply

Page compiled in 0.0478 seconds