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Heroes Community > Heroes 7 - Falcon's Last Flight > Thread: Limbic read this balance thread to be updated
Thread: Limbic read this balance thread to be updated This thread is 2 pages long: 1 2 · NEXT»
Kayna
Kayna


Supreme Hero
posted October 10, 2015 04:18 AM
Edited by Kayna at 21:39, 20 Oct 2015.

Limbic read this balance thread to be updated

This is my balance thread to be updated constantly. Please take note. Updates will always be in this first post.


Gameplay suggestions


I suggest a fog of war update ; you lose vision if you haven't visited a place for 2 week straight or something. It would be roleplay and strategic both. Perhaps even an on and off option on map creation. What would be ideal is a fog of war on town control areas, but no fog of war on neutral ground.

Customizing our own Heroes for duels and multiplayer games would be very good and fun. More strategic too. Select a hero starting stat template, then create an empty panel in which we can drag and drop our 9 chosen abilities. But perhaps too much freedom would allow overpowered heroes. At least we need more than 12 heroes per faction, and we also need to lvl up our own heroes for Duels, along with a more varied army selection.

Archers needs to be able to move and attack in melee. Once again, for more strategy.

We need a better view of the map when we rearrange our troops before battle. We can't see the obstacles near our enemy's army.

I would strongly suggest a minimum of half the hero's movement points to cast town portal ; just like in Heroes 6. Otherwise, people can duck each other too easily.

An extra option at map creation to limit the quantity of Heroes per player would be fun. From 1 to 20.

Change the xp rate. I would half the xp from all fights. Perhaps readjust the lvling up rate as well, lower lvls takes too little xp to gain a lvl.

Why can we only create caravans from creatures we can hire, and not from creatures already hired and sitting in town?

We need an ingame friend list! Also the ability to invite them to games.

During simultaneous turns, it would be better for us to see the main map rather than the fight screen. So we can look at the map, even build things in town, just lock our heroes in place?

A dragon vein ( restore full mana ) usable once per day is too powerful. It should be once per week. Need to check those that double mana. Or is it once a week when it's written on the tooltip once a day?

A button to fully transfer units from 1 hero to another instead of individually dragging them over would be nice.

Don't you find it weird that perfect offense and perfect defense is better for mage heroes than might ones? Mage heroes end up with a bigger offense and defense gap than might ones after all.

Choosing which direction our creatures would be facing after guarding or moving ( without attacking ) would be more strategic.

Is it really roleplay to see our opponent's fights during their turn? It's akin to spying. I understand it can be boring if we can't watch them however. Perhaps an option during game creation to allow watching enemy heroes fight or only allied ones? Or even better, be allowed to move while others fight. The game would be so much faster.

I would like to see the maximum number of a stack when I examine a stack ( example : 50 / 100 skeletons after they lost 50 of them ).

The air magic mastery sure is powerful. It allowed me to creep almost anything on heroic difficulty with just 1 stack of gnoll marauders and 6 stacks of upgraded harpies ( with hero spells ). It's damage seems to be twice that of the fire or water magic mastery, perhaps even more, considering it's AoE attribute.

Damage spells are very powerful at the beginning of a game, and not so in bigger, longer maps. Perhaps you guys should include the hero level in the damage and effects formula of spells and warcries to smoothen spells and abilities. Or perhaps a multiplicator based on the enemy's current army size ; nothing crazy, something along the line of x 1.05 or 1.10 if the enemy's army power is bigger than X. Damage spells shouldn't be that powerful though, because this is a strategy game ; the most complex strategy should win, and casting direct damage spells isn't the most complex of strat.

A small amount of XP points after killing heroes without any army would be nice. The XP should be related to the hero's level; think of a mage hero with one super high initiative unit that casts chain lightning on your army to soften you up. Heroes are dangerous, they deserve xp when killed.

Why is the barbarian "elite" sand wyverns having such low attack and defense stats? A bunch of core units got better stats than them lol.

A wall HP system like in Heroes 6 would be better than this. Along with units able to attack walls.

The gnoll hunter combo with 6 stacks of harpies is just too strong. You guys gotta nerf it somehow ; I would suggest cap it at three times per turn. Or lower it's damage to a quarter, or a third.

Necromancy is too powerful in big maps. You guys gotta nerf it in a way that affects long term gameplay, but not short term gameplay. Perhaps a hard cap, or a soft and a hard cap. Raising over 75 skeletons per fight is just ridiculous.

As with above, stacking tons of heroes with economist is kind of OP. I suggest making the economist skill ( gold per day and etc ) only applicable if they are the governor of a town.

I would like the ability to NOT specialize in a school of magic, so I get only 1 spell of 1 school and the rest random when building the lvl 1 mage guild.

Would be nice if we could double clic to end turn rather than a single click. Toggle on and off in the game options.

Random obstacles would be better than maps with already determined obstacles.

I would like to walk with my units like it is in King's Bounty ; let's say you can move 5 squares, then your unit can walk 2 squares, wait, then walk 3 squares and attack at the end of the round, or walk 2 squares in 1 direction, then 2 in the other, then 1 in another and finally attack. This would increase the strategic part of this game dramatically.

A certain penalty for people that hires too many heroes should be considered. In previous heroes, the more heroes you hire, the higher their price gets. This needs to be in game.


Spells I find overpowered


Firewall upgraded : it's in my opinion the best spell to use if you're a mage against a might hero. Stopping units dead in their track along with damage is already powerful, but being able to cast it every round is crazy. 5 square long and 3 rounds makes it very hard to avoid. Not to mention it's a lvl 2 spell. I would rather see it as a lvl 3 spell rather than lvl 2, pull down the fireball to lvl 2, make the fireball a bit less damage just to compensate and change the "stop units entirely when entering firewall" to a loss of movement points ( between 1 to 3 ). Increase the firewall damage if needed be.

Implosion : insert text here

Summon elemental : When the enemy hero only has summoned units left, he should lose the battle automatically, like in Heroes 6.

Cyclone : Another very powerful spell against other humans, but only at specific moments. While I agree that some spells should be good at beating the "turtle" type of players, I find that one very damaging and screws up all archer formations. I would reduce it's damage, and also make the normal version work only on small units, the upgraded version work on big units. Either way, most air spells are direct damage, this one doesn't need to do damage equal to the others in it's school.

Tsunami : It's range is a bit ridiculous lol. Perhaps reduce it to 4 or 3 column.

Sylvanna's Bounty and Ylath's Clairvoyance : Too easy to mass spam once you get 3 + heroes. Those spells need a cooldown.


Bug list :


The tooltip says that a Minotaur will not retaliate, when in fact it will. Because of the minotaur's preemptive retaliate skill?

The firewall spell doesn't always cast where I target it to. it is also incredibly powerful with it's "stop creatures that passes through it" upgrade.

Sometimes, the half shot of the upgraded gnolls doesn't proc. I'm not sure why, considering that they proc or don't proc in seemingly similar situations.

The enemy hero, after attacking and defeating a hero of mine, apparently reattacked the empty air where my defeated hero was ; the game is now eternally loading a bogus battle.

The upgraded cyclone spell ( 3x3 and double damage versus small units ) indicates the double damage even against 2x2 units in the tooltip, but the damage itself is applied properly.

The upgraded cyclops fiery eye fire damage beam attack damage is not mitigated on units with fire or all magic resistance.

The text detailing the economy skill got a %ICON_GOLD in it.

the spell "instant reinforcement" doesn't seem to work. We never get to select a unit to port.

When we rehire a dead hero, he revives with an army.

The academy golems take poison damage from the dungeon assassin's poisoned daggers? They should be immune.

Sometimes, after charging with the upgraded wolves, I get morale, and sometimes, my attack will not be retaliated even if it should be.

The game crashed when I tried to upgrade a hero exploration skill that grants governor 10 % faster speed. The hero was already governor of a town.

Water elementals are immune to some fire spells, also immune to fog shroud, which is an air spell, even if they are vulnerable to air and resistant to water?

In the warcry tree, the open fire upgrade "vicious shot" is supposed to grant my shooters the ability to back stab and flank with their arrows. Nothing happens, the tooltip in battle and in my spell list does not mention anything at all.

I found myself unable to deploy certain troops from the town's guards. 2 stacks wouldn't deploy while 2 others would. Perhaps you can only deploy troops that appears on the grid when you rearrange troops?

After teleporting a unit with the spell, I found myself unable to wait with said unit. Attack, more or defend only, even though it was at the start of the battle.

Sometimes, units do not retaliate even though they should; I think it's related to the use of various hero spells and unit abilities.

The gnoll hunter support attack after another melee attacked seems to be like a normal attack, but at half damage ; it does a quarter damage from far, half when within shooting range, and you can make it half damage all the time with a no range penalty attribute. Fine as it is or bug?

I stumbled upon an academy Hero with 2 arcane birds ; several debuffs were applied on some units on my army ( Hero special or academy building while on his turf, not sure ), then I moved with my first unit and the game crashed. Rather, the fight was in an eternal wait as my unit that was supposed to move never did.

I took the warfare upgrade so my ballista shoots 3 times, and also the sylvan upgrade to shoot an extra time against enemies that are marked, but when I tried it out, the total shots was only 3 instead of 4 or 6.

Stone spike is buggy like firewall ; doesn't always cast where I want it. It once even considered another unit like 5 squares away to be it's second target.

My unit buffed with the spell "ice strike" applied 4 elemental damage ; 3 ice and than the fourth earth damage. I was playing sylvan?

The elder druid ability "thorn" does a 2x2 damage and root debuff ; supposed to be applied when a unit start its turn in it, yet it seems to work only once. A unit that can only move 1 square and still in it the next round doesn't get double damage when it should.

Is the Sylvan treant root on strike supposed to be when they shoot as well or only when they attack in melee? Because I can't attack in melee with my shooters.

Tsunami didn't knockback small units by 2 squares last time I tried it.

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Pavijan
Pavijan


Adventuring Hero
posted October 11, 2015 11:58 AM

No cool-downs ever again. That killed Heroes 6 for me the most of everything.

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natalka
natalka


Supreme Hero
Bad-mannered
posted October 11, 2015 12:44 PM

creeping with one spell should be fine. If the map is good you will have to conserve mana and not cast every round unless you took renewal but you lost one skill slot this way.

XP gain is horrendous they should increase level requirements and at the same time decrease XP gain from creatures and remove LEVEL CAP..

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Bubbles
Bubbles

Tavern Dweller
posted October 11, 2015 02:30 PM

Cooldowns wouldn't be of much use in a system where you can have access to a lot of different spells without having to unlock them with skill points.

There's really nothing wrong with just spamming one or two preferred spells for creep fights, as long as the harder fights still require a diverse arsenal.
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PROJ
PROJ


Known Hero
posted October 11, 2015 02:49 PM

If your hero gets defeated in combat, you can re-recruit him/her at reduced cost with their initial army, which can lead to a lot of abuse.  

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Kayna
Kayna


Supreme Hero
posted October 11, 2015 04:31 PM

PROJ said:
If your hero gets defeated in combat, you can re-recruit him/her at reduced cost with their initial army, which can lead to a lot of abuse.  


I did notice that too. Didn't include it because I assumed it was a bug.

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Conduit
Conduit

Tavern Dweller
posted October 11, 2015 07:03 PM
Edited by Conduit at 19:03, 11 Oct 2015.

We need the ability to look at our enemy hero's statistics by right clicking on him during battle.


You can actually right click the hero portrait on the bottom right side and see the Hero attributes and what skills they have affecting their army just in case you didn't know

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DIEGIS
DIEGIS


Supreme Hero
power of Zamolxis
posted October 11, 2015 09:32 PM


Multiplayer Sim Turns is simply NOT!
When players are doing their turns, if one of them enter battle, then the opponent need to watch a picture!!! Is that all Ubi can do about multiplayer??? really??
____________
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-knowledge itself is power-
www.cabinet-dentaire-malaunay.fr

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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
posted October 15, 2015 07:56 AM

Kayna said:
The firewall spell doesn't always cast where I target it to.

Seems to be related to large units. It always appears on the back row, even if you target their front.

Speaking of which.. Don't you think it is too much to deal damage the moment you cast it AND when the unit's turn comes up?
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Map also hosted on Moddb

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted October 15, 2015 08:51 AM

Start having a closer look to the damage that IS dealt, versus the damage that SHOULD BE dealt - I tried the game yesterday and found it faulty.
Example: a Djinn was left with 34 damage. 30 guys doing 30-60 base damage. no abilities or spells involved. attack/defense advantage including hero +10, which means, damage should have been 45-90 (killing the gal), but what happened was, 32 damage dealt, which means, gal was NOT killed and the reason why I noticed it, because I had made sure it would.

There was a nother instance when things didn't work as expected.

My current theory is, that Ranged attacks are not influenced by Hero's Might stat.

So keep an eye on your ranged attacks.

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hermes
hermes


Famous Hero
posted October 15, 2015 09:06 AM

Hm, that is really strange. Maybe it was due to Djinns resistance to prime?

Might definitely affects Ranged attacks.. I just decimated everything with High level Wysloth and his hunters.

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted October 15, 2015 09:56 AM

That's no point, they would decimate everything anyway.

No, start making random checks: when you have decided on an attack,
1) check the PREDICTED damage;
2) make the math yourself and compare that;
3) look whether the result is in keeping with the expectation.

2) is pretty easy because everything translates into easy modifiers.

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hermes
hermes


Famous Hero
posted October 15, 2015 10:12 AM

I will try tonight, but my point is I had the same number of hunters and their power grew exponentially.

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted October 15, 2015 10:28 AM

Maybe my theory is wrong, but SOMETHING is wrong with damage.
The point is, you wouldn't notice very often, accepting predictions and battling without looking too often, but it may make sense to keep a close eye on things.

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gomaki
gomaki

Shaper of Lore
Community Manager, Limbic Ent.
posted October 15, 2015 11:38 AM

JollyJoker said:
Maybe my theory is wrong, but SOMETHING is wrong with damage.
The point is, you wouldn't notice very often, accepting predictions and battling without looking too often, but it may make sense to keep a close eye on things.


Hi JJ.

Could you provide some further information of this issue if you feel damage is sometimes not calculating at all. If you manage to reproduce it a savefile and game log sent to my email would be ideal.

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Maurice
Maurice

Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
posted October 15, 2015 11:50 AM

Elvin said:
Kayna said:
The firewall spell doesn't always cast where I target it to.

Seems to be related to large units. It always appears on the back row, even if you target their front.


Strange, that's not what I am seeing. Whenever I cast it on one of the four tiles of a large unit, the center of the Fire Wall will be placed on the tile on the front-right in the facing direction of the unit. Never on the back row. That was a nasty surprise the first time, when I wanted to catch another ranged stack on the back row as well.

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted October 15, 2015 12:33 PM

It's an issue of the game calculating damage wrong (in some instances). I just have to find the reason for the miscalculation, so I have to pinpoint the instances which may take some time beause a miscalculation becomes obvious only if the actual damage is outside of the correct damage range. If the correct damage range is, for example 35-70, but the game works with 30-60, you'll notice only, if you get a damage result of 30-34.

I just tried to find something - and sure enough I DID find something, although it's not the issue I stumbled upon yesterday.
It's a

Bug with morale turn damage:

This is what happened: I've got 49 Stalkers, base damage 1-2, hero has Novice offense ability giving +1 to ranged, so right-clicking on stalkers in battle shows them at 98-147 base damage for the stack and 2-3 for the single unit. Everything is fine, correct damage prediction, damage is in range - until the Stalkers get a morale turn: in that instant the base damage suddenly switches back to 49-98 damage and 1-2; prediction correctly show HALF damage modificator (1.7 before, now 0.85 for +14 attack/defense and halved damage during a morale turn), but morale turn ignores hero ability, so instead of predicting 84-125 damage, the game predicts and does only 42-84 damage.

More to come.

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Maurice
Maurice

Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
posted October 15, 2015 12:35 PM

JollyJoker said:
prediction correctly show HALF damage modificator (1.7 before, now 0.85 for +14 attack/defense and halved damage during a morale turn), but morale turn ignores hero ability, so instead of predicting 84-125 damage, the game predicts and does only 42-84 damage.


I am not entirely sure it just ignores the Hero's ability. I've seen Sentinels dropping to -1 as minimum damage on a Morale boost.

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted October 15, 2015 12:52 PM

Yup, it ignores hero abilities, but if that was deliberate it was complete nonsense, because hero stats aren't ignored either - it's pretty illogical as well: why would hero abilities be ignored in a morale turn? Would make morale turns rather ineffective, the longer the game lasts. Makes no sense whatsoever.

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zhukaSS
zhukaSS


Hired Hero
Dark Ronin
posted October 15, 2015 04:43 PM
Edited by zhukaSS at 16:48, 15 Oct 2015.

Talking about balance - I find some spells highly unbalanced
To mind comes basically all aoe buffs spells, inner fire being one of most obvious spells.

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