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| Thread: Can people change? |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · NEXT» |
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted December 20, 2015 08:26 PM |
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Can people change?
Corribus said:
People don't change, not really.
This is actually one of the questions that occupied my mind ever since I can remember having a busy one. Can people change? Even if they can, they seldom do, that's for sure. But is it really impossible to genuinely change in the true sense of the word or is it something most people are too unwilling to go through or lazy about? If they can't change, when exactly can we know that their personality sank in? If a guy is a jerk around 19, are we supposed to cross him off as a person cause it's certain that he'll be that way when he's 65, too? And if they can change, is it just a matter of will, motivation, dedication? Or is it about life experience, things that will astonish or traumatize you; things, positively or negatively, that have a great impact on your journey? How about those born-again religious types, or those extremely nice people who suddenly snap one day and go berserk (this is not exactly to change according to the context above but still...), or those who actually mature when having a child, or those who go to war and come back as an empty shell. The list goes on...
When does it count as actual change and do you people think we are capable of change?
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted December 20, 2015 08:34 PM |
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Certainly. As long as we keep curious and open, we remain very suggestible to what we admire in others, then we create mental idols, be them writers or other kind of communicators. The problem with such changes is that they are the slow result of a maturity process, so they aren't so visible as when you get a beard or boobs growing. But certainly we are capable of endorsing several personalities during our life journey.
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OhforfSake
Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
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posted December 20, 2015 09:03 PM |
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I am of the opposite opinion. People change all the time, whether they like it or not.
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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted December 20, 2015 09:54 PM |
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Edited by Corribus at 21:54, 20 Dec 2015.
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Preferences, habits, and knowledge change, of course, but I'm of the opinion that basic emotional conditioning usually does not.
Of course there's a difference between the questions "Do people change?" and "Can people change?" Likewise, there's a difference between changing who we are and changing how we act. Only the latter is directly observed by outsiders.
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted December 20, 2015 10:09 PM |
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Edited by artu at 22:14, 20 Dec 2015.
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According to you, what does that emotional conditioning determine? If our preferences and habits change, what's the perpetuation that emotional conditioning affects? Is it how we feel when we put our head in the pillow? How we behave to others when we don't feel the need to pretend? How intimate we can get with our spouse?
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Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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Drakon-Deus
Undefeatable Hero
Qapla'
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posted December 20, 2015 10:19 PM |
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Please define "change" in a clear manner.
What does "who we are" mean anywyay ? I'd say pain is what makes people change the most, in life.
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blizzardboy
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
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posted December 21, 2015 01:59 AM |
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The dendrites of the brain will physically change/grow/shrink as a person's habits, knowledge, and diet change, so yeah, people can change. A person that reads 8 hours a day will have a physically different brain than somebody that's drunk 8 hours a day. Even habits/mannerisms that are non-chemically addictive, certain neuropatterns will grow into place and they will shrink over time when neglected. For a person that sits around doing nothing, there won't be very many dendrites. If their brain is a galaxy, there's not a lot of commerce going on in it. It's loosely analogous to a muscle, except far more dynamic. You can have neurological atrophy with social skills but be a beast at math, etc. Experience will expand these connections and vastly increase automaticity and improvisation. Certain actions/attitudes will become increasingly more difficult to abandon because they become streamlined 'programs' that are easy to trigger. Pessimism/optimism/cynicism are, in a certain sense, addictive. The examples could go on and on.
But no, your DNA isn't going to change. You're not going to wake up with a photographic memory or a music prodigy or a psychopath or a clinical klepto or a comedian. Humor is actually a good example and possibly the single most enigmatic attribute of a person: how do you teach somebody to be humorous? The ability to do so is extremely, extremely limited. Next Generation spent a lot of time with Data on the subject of humor and how it eluded him.
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Drakon-Deus
Undefeatable Hero
Qapla'
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posted December 21, 2015 02:09 AM |
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Good for me blizz. Technically true, the best kind.
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Svartzorn
Known Hero
Dead struggling with death.
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posted December 21, 2015 02:46 AM |
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I can say for myself that I have changed a bit, due mostly to me becoming christian. And the change are still operating.
But still there are thing in me I can't get rid of. I just agregate and accomodate the new stuff with the old stuff, balancing it properly.
People never really change fully, but they are capable of change, yes.
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Death to the world.
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Drakon-Deus
Undefeatable Hero
Qapla'
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posted December 21, 2015 03:42 AM |
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Yes, they are capable of some change for sure, maybe even big changes, but being capable of something and not doing it... makes no difference from my POV.
Actions do speak louder than intentions, words, and anything else.
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Tsar-Ivor
Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
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posted December 21, 2015 04:40 AM |
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Interesting question, I'm absolutely certain that people can and do change, but it's a pretty deep subject, I'm also certain that most of that change comes not of our own volition (although it is the most effective way).
I'm battling this problem myself, I feel like I need to mold and change myself, but I am totally lacking any direction. I think it has a lot to do with the need for role models, people that we admire and want to aspire to be like, or at least adapt certain qualities that we find pleasing and attractive. Trouble with me is, I go through phases, one second I'm very fervantly for one thing, but come a week or a month and I'm lost again until I find the next thing I want to be.
As for our core, in theory yes we can change it, but it's ridiculously hard, I think you need some massive epithany or something to change your core thought process.
Then there's language and culture, I have been tormented for almost 12 years now with my inability to fully organise my thoughts and feelings, my transition to English from Hungarian has been an absolute catastrophe to the extent that I am essentially neither, Hungarian culture and language is all but alien to me (I can speak it fluently and understand everything, but the structure and I simply can't replicate any of the fine sentence structures or the thought process behind them). English is simply not sufficient for my needs, I still struggle with it, and it's not necessarily anything to do with the language but merely to my inability to change and become English (change the way I think and organise thoughts and speech).
Just my random 2 cents.
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"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny
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Drakon-Deus
Undefeatable Hero
Qapla'
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posted December 21, 2015 04:42 AM |
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Yes we do need direction; but finding a direction sometimes seems to me harder than actually following it. Working on that now.
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TD
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted December 21, 2015 06:46 AM |
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It really depends how the change is defined. Our tastes(likes and dislikes) develop and change all the time. Personality doesn't really change in general(traumatic or life changing events aside), but may be altered by your values which shows in your actions. Values on the other hand are tied to who we are and who we see ourselves as part of(nationality, ethnicity, gang, family, work, etc.).
If we talk about change as in you saw somebody as a kid and later as an adult as very different person I wouldn't really call it change. As young people are still trying to find/form their identity. They may not be conscious of why/how they act only to later understand that better(if ever).
From my perspective people don't really change. They can wear different masks, but underneath it all there is still the same guy always despite what they show to public. People can change, they just mostly don't.
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Drakon-Deus
Undefeatable Hero
Qapla'
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posted December 21, 2015 06:48 AM |
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From my perspective, pain makes people change. And so does love. Most of all pain.
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markkur
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
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posted December 21, 2015 08:44 AM |
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Drakon-Deus said:
From my perspective, pain makes people change. And so does love. Most of all pain.
Those are a couple of biggies.<g> With severe chronic pain, I've been forced to change almost every aspect of my life and because of that, much about my awareness and focus has followed suit.
I think the powers of human-will & spirit are not appreciated near enough.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted December 21, 2015 09:24 AM |
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Is that a serious question?
Of course people can change, they change all the time. See it as a process; an empty board called "personality" is eagerly filled in the development phase of becoming a "grown-up", and once a person is "settled", only new and, well, major experiences will leave imprints and may lead to a change or addition on the meanwhile rather filled board. Becoming parent, fighting in a war, losing a deeply beloved person, a massive accident or sickness, and so on.
Sure, from a certain age on, people don't change without necessity or pressure - personality has a certain inertia that tends to keep itself on course for certain reasons, but that doesn't mean people cannot change.
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Drakon-Deus
Undefeatable Hero
Qapla'
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posted December 21, 2015 09:28 AM |
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Life's about changes. All things need to change and they do change whether we like or want it or not, but not to the extreme, that I don't like.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted December 21, 2015 11:25 AM |
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People tend to be resistant to change from the point they fully develop their sense of identity - Nobody likes to challenge their own sense of identity. But there is a brilliant quote relevant to the discussion:
[...] it is that many things may change the nature of a man. Whether regret, or love, or revenge or fear - whatever you believe can change the nature of a man, can.
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Homer171
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted December 22, 2015 01:50 AM |
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For me there has been 3 major events that has changed my identity. Changed how i see the world and other people atleast.
First was in my teenager years, when young man is really searching his own identity. What really stopped me then was my uncle who said: "Good to see you're not that as*hole anymore." I did not know my uncle very well, but when I realised adults might see me as 'jerk' who does not respect anyone, parents, teachers what ever. I started constantly thinking, what did I do in the past wrong and how aim supposed to act. Basically I matured early and 'killed the little teenager' inside me. Own personality would do that eventually but I really forced the change. I was probably embarassed about the whole phase and quickly wanted to be adult. I was a real brat back then but that line from my uncle, really started everything.
Second major event was in the army. I was 18 then, when they called to my barracks that my sister was dead. I totally lost 'it' for a while. When the first change was called for, this was not. My personality stayed the same but when somebody in you'r family dies, you feel like something inside of you died whit her. This is harder to descripe than it is to feel and experience. Changed my innerself, can't really say it any better.
Third one, was this born-again life. Clearly drastic when all you'r life priorites changes completely. Never been a cold person but dang these pink sunclasses makes you see world differently. Again something died, my old life. Maybe there can't be BIG changes, unless something you have hold dear loses it's meaning or given up on. God being n.1 sure rocks you'r world 
Even marriage and kids has not changed me so much. Being 'dad' or 'husband' is like a bonus to you'r identity. Truly great lifetime experiences but they grow on you, rather than changin you completely.
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PandaTar
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posted December 22, 2015 02:09 AM |
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Homer171 said:
Even marriage and kids has not changed me so much. Being 'dad' or 'husband' is like a bonus to you'r identity. Truly great lifetime experiences but they grow on you, rather than changin you completely.
That's how I perceive and expect (I'm not a dad or husband yet) it to be. Being dad or husband, adding new things, not really changing yourself. I think that's an added feature, for a lack of a better word, where you simply awakens something you had dormant and now you have simply to adjust here and there to you.
On the first post basis, I think people change and I don't see why outside and inside changes should differ in conception either, given that all we are might be the collective elements from all around us. I do believe that whenever we act or think in a way that's different, we caused a change. Speaking for myself, I changed a lot through the years, inside and outside, and sometimes, certain behaviors went inside out, from what I show and what I don't show and think.
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"Okay. Look. We both said a lot of things that you're going to regret. But I think we can put our differences behind us. For science. You monster."
GlaDOS – Portal 2
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