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Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: I cannot believe this passed!
Thread: I cannot believe this passed! This thread is 7 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 · «PREV / NEXT»
OhforfSake
OhforfSake


Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted December 25, 2016 07:42 PM
Edited by OhforfSake at 19:46, 25 Dec 2016.

Salamandre said:



Why didn't train, combat sport, anything that can make the difference and end it. Waiting 6 years and doing nothing sounds crazy to me.


Well I should probably have changed school.
The funny thing was that due to other circumstances I had the chance to change school just around the time it started, but choose not to mainly because of a girl I fancied.
I probably wouldn't even have had to move to another city to study had I changed school at that time.

Edit:
Also the first bunch of kids who were after me changed school 3 years after it started so I thought I was home free, sadly this was around the time everyone started growing and I was the smallest one already and those who used to be my friends were the next in line to target me.

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted December 25, 2016 07:58 PM

A story of passion, war, betrayal and hope!
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OhforfSake
OhforfSake


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Legendary Hero
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posted December 25, 2016 08:09 PM

Pretty much.

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Blizzardboy
Blizzardboy


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Elvin's Lightside
posted December 25, 2016 08:54 PM
Edited by Blizzardboy at 21:03, 25 Dec 2016.

Kayna said:
I got beat up at school before, and I approve of this law. The destiny of a child depends a lot on good parenting. Maybe we should tell parents to do their jobs along with such a law.

If anything doesn't fit with an absence of law, it's an enormous quantity of parents that thinks their children will learn everything on their own. If only they understood that putting food on the table and sending them to school isn't all there is to it.


The needs of the many surpass the needs of the few, but if we let jail be the next step to violence, the chances of these anti-human students becoming healthy people goes from slim to slimmer.

Although I don't know what 'jail' entails. Some sort of center for children that are unmanageable in a regular classroom is needed, but again, the budget and staff need to be there to make it happen, and they would need to document that the facilities are getting results.

Children going from completely ****ed up to good are rare, but they can go from ugly to just plain bad. Most parents in this situation have destroyed their child's life by the time they've reached the age of 10, creating a monster rather than  a teenager. Neuro pathways of etiquette and interaction are imprinted very heavily upon a person in youth and while possible to undo, is very difficult. While the parents might legally and numerically be adults, they are for behavioral purposes children with children.  
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OhforfSake
OhforfSake


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Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted December 25, 2016 09:43 PM

My thoughts exactly.

Beside don't you have institutions for criminal youth in the US? Here we have a lowest age where you can go to prison, it was 15 when I turned 15, it may be lower now, but if you do something jail worthy, perhaps repeatedly, and are below the minimum age for jail, you can still go to an institution for criminal young.

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Gryphs
Gryphs


Supreme Hero
The Clever Title
posted December 25, 2016 09:47 PM
Edited by Gryphs at 21:47, 25 Dec 2016.

Yeah, we have those, though, I do not blame you for thinking the US doesn't.
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Lexxan
Lexxan


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Unimpressed by your logic
posted December 25, 2016 10:46 PM

So, if I understand this correctly, if you commit any misdemeanor as a schoolgoing teenager, you could end up in PRISON???

This is unbelievably stupid. Education is the only thing which stands between those teens and a life of crime. Take that away, and take away their future.

The Law exists to protect civilians and crimes have to be punished in some way, but surely they can come up with a better solution than prosecuting and jailing on the basis of small misdemeanors?  
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Blizzardboy
Blizzardboy


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Elvin's Lightside
posted December 26, 2016 06:17 AM
Edited by Blizzardboy at 06:41, 26 Dec 2016.

OhforfSake said:
My thoughts exactly.

Beside don't you have institutions for criminal youth in the US? Here we have a lowest age where you can go to prison, it was 15 when I turned 15, it may be lower now, but if you do something jail worthy, perhaps repeatedly, and are below the minimum age for jail, you can still go to an institution for criminal young.


They're called juvenile detention centers here. They're separate from prisons but if a minor is out of control they could go there and be assigned a case worker. You're not considered an adult until youre 18, but the courts can bend these rules depending on the case. Don't ask me the finer details. I'm a squirrel, not a lawyer.

I'm not sure if they adequately cover the country. Missouri is a Midwestern state that had a population spike and I wouldnt be surprised if the budget & facilities were playing catch-up. In my state, which relies heavily on oil and natural gas to pay educators, we have the facilities but not so much the structure. Staff upheavals and turnover has been high, leaving random asshats like me to be on leadership committees.

For those outside the States, Missouri (St Louis in particular) was where protests over police shooting of unarmed blacks first went to national news.  
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Kayna
Kayna


Supreme Hero
posted December 26, 2016 03:44 PM

Blizzardboy said:


The needs of the many surpass the needs of the few, but if we let jail be the next step to violence, the chances of these anti-human students becoming healthy people goes from slim to slimmer.


And? If we let kids being bullied by the stronger ones at school, the same result can happen as well. Both sides are usually the same age. Both sides can potentially give to the society later on. Both sides are roughly equal on most aspects. Why would you side with the bully more than the victim of bullying? Sad truth is, violence at school is a good thing to deal with, because as it currently stands, kids can do quite a disgusting amount of violent acts and nothing happens to them. And a good deal knows it.

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Blizzardboy
Blizzardboy


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Elvin's Lightside
posted December 26, 2016 08:49 PM
Edited by Blizzardboy at 20:55, 26 Dec 2016.

Lexxan said:
So, if I understand this correctly, if you commit any misdemeanor as a schoolgoing teenager, you could end up in PRISON???

This is unbelievably stupid. Education is the only thing which stands between those teens and a life of crime. Take that away, and take away their future.

The Law exists to protect civilians and crimes have to be punished in some way, but surely they can come up with a better solution than prosecuting and jailing on the basis of small misdemeanors?  


I agree with the what youre saying, other than the belief that beating up somebody's child is a small misdemeanor. It's much more than that. I don't think the child or the parents of the child would think it's "small".

When I was a kid I didn't witness that or experience it. We were teenagers so of course there was drama here and there,  but we more or less got along with each other and I don't recall habitual bullying going on or seeing kids getting teased. But maybe that's partly because the system had a swift response to it. It's not like that everywhere, and everybody that did experience it, such as those in this thread, seem to agree that it leaves a lasting impression.
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tSar-Ivor
tSar-Ivor


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♀ DEUS VULT!!! ♀
posted December 26, 2016 09:49 PM
Edited by tSar-Ivor at 21:49, 26 Dec 2016.

Idk I have 8 brothers so we used to get the crap beat out of us, bruises, bumps and scabs were the norm, we were lil snows at times tho, most kids are. I don't support malicious gang attacks at schools, but one on one dispute over something relatively minor is not only fine, but perfectly natural and acceptable. As Artu said, this rule is simply not enforcable.
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AlHazin
AlHazin


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Tutto possibile
posted December 26, 2016 10:04 PM

I swear, it's mostly because the USA are getting traumatized with repeated agressive behaviours that had bloody subsequent repercussions, but like in most countries, instead of acting directly on the problem -Guns- they rather take indirect, illogical and inefficient measures.
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Gryphs
Gryphs


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The Clever Title
posted December 26, 2016 10:11 PM

This is not about school shootings that is an entirely different problem. This is more about the persistent bullying that is inherent to America's poor schooling system.
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AlHazin
AlHazin


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posted December 26, 2016 10:24 PM

Well actually bullying exists in every country's schools, yet this kind of drastic measures is rarely taken outside USA.

Also chronic bullying is what leads the bullied to come one day with a gun at school and shoot everybody for bullying/not defending him.
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Gryphs
Gryphs


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The Clever Title
posted December 26, 2016 10:44 PM
Edited by Gryphs at 22:49, 26 Dec 2016.

School shooters also attack because they could not get a date, no, most parents who voted this drivel through were probably thinking of bullying. Now I really do not know how bad bullying is in other countries school systems but America's is pretty bad, hospital visits kind of bad. I personally blame this on how underfunded and disorderly many US schools are nowadays.
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markkur
markkur


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Once upon a time
posted December 26, 2016 10:59 PM

Gryphs said:
I personally blame this on how underfunded and disorderly many US schools are nowadays.


Second that. Another tangible and related difference I have noticed between my early years and today is; ALL authority is dung-canned and demonized upfront. Only to then have serious tyranny come in by the back-door.

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AlHazin
AlHazin


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Tutto possibile
posted December 26, 2016 11:02 PM

You can tell better than me for that. Then bullying must have reached insanely high degrees to get such laws to be voted for.
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Blizzardboy
Blizzardboy


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Elvin's Lightside
posted December 27, 2016 01:34 AM
Edited by Blizzardboy at 03:36, 27 Dec 2016.

tSar-Ivor said:
Idk I have 8 brothers so we used to get the crap beat out of us, bruises, bumps and scabs were the norm, we were lil snows at times tho, most kids are. I don't support malicious gang attacks at schools, but one on one dispute over something relatively minor is not only fine, but perfectly natural and acceptable. As Artu said, this rule is simply not enforcable.


I think the kind of violence between you and your brothers wouldn't have the same effect as a kid with predator behavior targeting another kid.

Violence between siblings still isn't good, but it's generally more spontaneous and usually quickly forgiven. Unless there's some sort of really serious rivalry, it won't affect your confidence and social skills years down the road. Bullying in school (I mean real bullying, not two kids getting into an argument over something stupid and then telling their parents that theyre getting bullied) will do that.  
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Blizzardboy
Blizzardboy


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Elvin's Lightside
posted December 27, 2016 01:39 AM
Edited by Blizzardboy at 03:38, 27 Dec 2016.

Gryphs said:
School shooters also attack because they could not get a date, no, most parents who voted this drivel through were probably thinking of bullying. Now I really do not know how bad bullying is in other countries school systems but America's is pretty bad, hospital visits kind of bad. I personally blame this on how underfunded and disorderly many US schools are nowadays.


If you look up funding, it's actually more than most other (or all) 1st world countries. Charter schools in the US have significantly higher results than public schools and they do it with grossly less money. Charter schools are competitive and often force improvisation out of teachers.

Some schools might be underfunded,  but many have personal laptops / tablets for students, labs, huge gyms, commonly updated curriculum programs with lots of supplementals, etc. Boatloads of stuff gets thrown away.
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tSar-Ivor
tSar-Ivor


Legendary Hero
♀ DEUS VULT!!! ♀
posted December 27, 2016 03:43 AM
Edited by tSar-Ivor at 03:49, 27 Dec 2016.

Quote:
Violence between siblings still isn't good, but it's generally more spontaneous and usually quickly forgiven.


I was giving context to my views, I had plenty of fights in England (only versus bros in Hungary I was a wee lad afterall) now that I look back I would've made a great fighter, but only turned to it when defending personal honour lel. Idk I mostly got into fights over minor things like someone insulting my mother, my woman or my homeland. Others were so silly not even worth remembering, I'd be in jail for something I wouldn't even remember in a couple of years that's a scary thought (if I was in the US that is).


Meh, I get that we love those horror stories of predator school bullies and whatnot, I had a really dumb mofo at my second-secondary school (moved schools due to moving to a diff-town), just avoid him and yer solid, when he gets bored he turned on his own minions, even smiled at his own brother's funeral so you know he's edgy af. But even if the child is morally bankrupt, if it's some school scrape you can't exactly charge them for felony it's simply dumb, kids say and do a lot of things that they don't mean, not only that other kids are also much likelier to take offence than adults, why? Discipline, children today lack the discipline needed to sustain the new law, it would be a miracle if the law itself would be enough, but can you really imagine kids restraining themselves from hitting one another?!

The most logical outcome would be the school officers just not reporting the incidents and to resolve them unofficially.
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