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Heroes Community > Heroes 7+ Altar of Wishes > Thread: Let's make our OWN HOMM game! "Heroes Infinity"
Thread: Let's make our OWN HOMM game! "Heroes Infinity" This thread is 5 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · «PREV / NEXT»
Mediczero
Mediczero


Famous Hero
Warlord of the sea
posted February 20, 2017 11:25 AM

Galaad said:
Mediczero said:
You make it sound like we are going to make an epic, fully 3D, with the most modern of modern graphics game.


No, I only replied to your question.

Fair enough, but I still stand by the possibility to make a game with less people than you described, especially if we aim for the "indie" mark.

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NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Famous Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted February 21, 2017 09:11 AM

People think you can only make Heroes as a (fake) AAA game... how many super team people you think Erwan had?

From what I recall, Erwan team was just about 5 people, not many more and they didn't do anything else than to direct and write the lore (well, marketing).

All development was outsourced and they didn't want to pay much for it either.

NWC was also a small team. Professional, yes, but small. We have lots of more people in the community than they ever had making their games...

When I proposed an H4 big mod, everyone also said I was daydreaming and it could never get done,. You can see the thread at "Outline for the Greatest..." at the H4 forum here.

Everyone said "it's fantasy so I just stopped reading", "H4 can't realistically be modded", etc.

I had never modded an Heroes game before.
A few months later, the mod was released. ANd it continues in development to fullfill the rest of the goals. With community help. Many things were done that had been called "Impossible".

I showed that thousands of indie projects exists with Unreal Engine 4, not only FPS, also RPG, and Platformers. Many of them are just a 1 person team.

Assembling a game is just putting parts together. Engine + programming + coding + assets.

You don't need "business people direction" here since we aren't releasing it as a "business game". That point is completely moot... which of the mods and maps were made for profit? WoG programmed for free...

The only thing we need is people with the will to do it.

That will sadly for some seems to be lacking however

Sad

There's millions of ideas and monsters and factions and artifacts that we could implement with an open-ended community-developed game...


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kiryu133
kiryu133

Hero of Order
Highly illogical
posted February 21, 2017 10:00 AM

It's certainly possible. Problem is dedication, engagement and a central base of sorts. If you people can make a solid group/place to discuss and start from I'd be more then happy to join up but first I'll need proof that it's serious.

I can help with game design and story but I'm not one for coding or creating assets or music or anything like that. Show me that there is something for me to help with and I'll do it.
____________
It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that the cis are at it again.

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Lord_Immortal
Lord_Immortal


Famous Hero
posted February 21, 2017 10:07 AM

You managed to mod Heroes IV and that is a really huge thing. If anyone could make at least a basic layout of a new game, that's probably you. But, from my experience from modding other games, no one is going to join your team unless you show some work first.

Unreal Engine 4 is free and it's easy to learn due to visual programming, so I suggest you start from there.

I have seen the UE4 just a little (even though I don't have time to learn to work in it due to real life issues) and I would advise you to build a general blueprint first (with the standard UE4 dummies).
Just show the Hero running around the map and entering in a battle and stuff like that (i.e. working heroes game mechanics)

Then you might have more luck finding people who are ready to advance programming or create assets for you.

On the earliest versions don't bother yourself too much with details about factions and creatures, build the mechanics first and foremost (include factions and creatures just as placeholders to show the gameplay mechanics functioning). You might, after that, open a brainstorming thread about what material to include in the mod.

However, (for general orientation) if it is going to be a HC mod, either Enroth or Axeoth would be the perfect settings, with no less than 7 or 8 factions each with 7 or 10 creatures(see below) and 2 Hero Classes. No alternative upgrades, just creature+upgrade like in H3.

The Core/Elite/Champion system adds more value to tactical aspects rather than the standard Lv1<Lv2<Lv3<Lv4<Lv5<Lv6<Lv7. Ideally, there would be 1 core, 1 elite and the Champion creature the player would have to choose from 2 options (like H7 champion or H4), making 10 creatures in total (even though for me it's still ok 7 creatures).

Magic, I suggest, Air,Earth,Fire,Water and Light and Dark schools, each of these inspired from H3, MM6-8. Skills go up to Grandmaster Level like Heroes IV and have perks like Heroes V.

Leave these for a little later, the first teaser would be more appealing with more "action" and less details such as skills and spells.

I really wish you good luck on this mod, I will surely keep an eye on this thread!

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Mediczero
Mediczero


Famous Hero
Warlord of the sea
posted February 21, 2017 10:22 AM

Good point, Lord_Immortal, I agree that would be the best way forward. One minor detail is that we might not be allowed to use the old setting, depending on who actually holds the rights to it. It would be safer to make our own setting, perhaps based of some faction suggestions by the community. And allow for greater creative freedom.
Though we would probably take inspiration from the old era's settings regardless.

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Baronus
Baronus


Famous Hero
posted February 21, 2017 12:37 PM

I think that making new game is 1 year work 8 hours NON PAYED for 25 people = 250 * 8 * 25 = 50.000 hours.
And It would be game looking like present top games! It is work 500 workers now in 2 years!

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MattII
MattII


Legendary Hero
posted February 21, 2017 12:58 PM

Mediczero said:
Good point, Lord_Immortal, I agree that would be the best way forward. One minor detail is that we might not be allowed to use the old setting, depending on who actually holds the rights to it. It would be safer to make our own setting, perhaps based of some faction suggestions by the community. And allow for greater creative freedom.
Though we would probably take inspiration from the old era's settings regardless.
A new setting would allow new backstories, new factions, and for those factions that remain new themes. Perhaps the human town is a mix of the traditional medieval western Europe and Imperial Rome, or even Hellenic Greece.

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Mediczero
Mediczero


Famous Hero
Warlord of the sea
posted February 21, 2017 01:29 PM

MattII said:
A new setting would allow new backstories, new factions, and for those factions that remain new themes. Perhaps the human town is a mix of the traditional medieval western Europe and Imperial Rome, or even Hellenic Greece.

That would be cool. A medieval/roman human empire could be quite the interesting spin on the classic human faction
As for new factions, one concept I would love to see is a beastmen faction. While similar in concept to stronghold and the swamp fortress, I believe it could add an interesting element to the faction rooster. It would also be nice for the various beastmen races to have a faction of their own than to shift in between all matter of different factions.

Speaking of faction when/if this gets so far, I suggest we hold a popularity vote between the various options for factions to find out a handful, probably between 2-4, which would make for the initial rooster. It can always be expanded later on.

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LizardWarrior
LizardWarrior


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Age of erwins is over
posted February 21, 2017 04:01 PM

Salamandre said:

but no one capable to materialize that. Making concepts isn't hard -we have billions of such speculations through forums, designing and technically completing games from scratch, no one in this forum proved he is able to, yet.


BUT WE WERE SO CLOSE, SO CLOSE  

Unreal engine? Fan game? Oh God, so many memories, good and now they're bittersweet . Sit down kids, it's story time, ol' Lizzy has to tell you a story from back when he was young.

It was the summer before h7 release. And we had big plans, we wanted to troll heroes 7 so hard before release that Erwin itself would roll his 8 spidery eyes after being shocked by it.

It was a plan of the Enrothian Conservative Party: me, Galaad, Verriker, Sempai and later Neraus and Frosty joined (the original cool frosty) and we were concocting the most epic game of all time, code-named, Project Erwin. The assets were made by us with a few exceptions because we were too lazy to animate enemies so we used modded h7 ones instead (now some of them are in Ashan to the trashcan mod, may they rest in peace).

We used C++, not visual graphs to make it, because C++ is about 15 times faster and more efficient that those, we used our nobbish skills to make textures and 3d models, to bake normals and plan the game. We were putting heart and soul into it (and hatred of Ashan ofc), with our skills, the ones we had we worked on this game. But as you know, games are hard to make, 3d models are hard to make, programming is hard to do. And we couldn't make it before h7 release, real life was a b1tch and we couldn't dedicate as much as we wanted to the game.



The story was set in Ubi's headquarters, aka Erwin's palace, we had planned 5 levels, only the 1st, the dungeon level is somewhat ready. The cowardly ubi kidnapped Galaad and he had to reach Erwin's office. His main weapon was a fork, but there were more weapons to get (it was a fps)

Now, let me present you some screens from what we had done:







And of course, our main villain (courtesy of Neraus):



The forces of the universe stopped us, because the sheer concentration of trolling would have collapsed the universe.

Bonus, a more "isometric" perspective that could be used for a heroes game:


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Galaad
Galaad


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Enrothian Conservative Party
posted February 21, 2017 04:10 PM
Edited by Galaad at 16:12, 21 Feb 2017.

LizardWarrior said:
It was the summer before h7 release. And we had big plans, we wanted to troll heroes 7 so hard before release that Erwin itself would roll his 8 spidery eyes after being shocked by it.


Lol yeah, I actually spent quite some time on this, modelling and texturing, and endless chats with Lizzy.

I was also in charge of music but was waiting for a playable alpha to fit the mood.

kiryu133 said:
It's certainly possible. Problem is dedication, engagement and a central base of sorts. If you people can make a solid group/place to discuss and start from I'd be more then happy to join up but first I'll need proof that it's serious.


Pretty much this, dreams always look reachable but reality is different. If we could be around 50 dedicated people, with a minimum of decent knowledge in respective areas, then, maybe, we can make an FPS.

This is all extremely time consuming, and while it is possible to do it with a small team, it might also take a while. I mean, a several years while.
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#Give JVC Might and Magic rights back!

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Baronus
Baronus


Famous Hero
posted February 21, 2017 04:32 PM

GREAT! You should finished it maybe with not so crazy story!

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Mediczero
Mediczero


Famous Hero
Warlord of the sea
posted February 21, 2017 04:53 PM

I honestly think that... "sarcastic" attitude of yours really only makes things worse. You make the community look like a bunch of Erwin hating crybabies. Ever stopped to think about that?

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Lord_Immortal
Lord_Immortal


Famous Hero
posted February 21, 2017 05:24 PM

Mediczero said:
Good point, Lord_Immortal, I agree that would be the best way forward. One minor detail is that we might not be allowed to use the old setting, depending on who actually holds the rights to it. It would be safer to make our own setting, perhaps based of some faction suggestions by the community. And allow for greater creative freedom.
Though we would probably take inspiration from the old era's settings regardless.


But it would be a Free-to-Play game much like Renegade-X. Renegade-X had no problems, I don't see why this game should have. Besides, wasn't there a Chinese Heroes of Might and Magic Online set in Erathia?

Still i think we should be able to use visual concepts from Heroes I-IV.

As for the factions, I will start working on some general concepts right away. Castle, Sylvan, Stronghold, Dungeon and Necropolis must certainly be included.

As for the 3d art, why don't you contact the "New Upgrades VCMI" mod team. They have some very good 3d models based on Heroes III. Here. See it for yourself.

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verriker
verriker


Honorable
Legendary Hero
No Use Crying Erwin Spilt Milk
posted February 21, 2017 05:42 PM

Mediczero said:
I honestly think that... "sarcastic" attitude of yours really only makes things worse. You make the community look like a bunch of Erwin hating crybabies. Ever stopped to think about that?


we all stopped to think about it for twenty minutes and came to the conclusion that Mediczero sounds like yet another of the many shrill drama queens who stick up for Team Erwin we have encountered and decided to ignore him lol
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LizardWarrior
LizardWarrior


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Age of erwins is over
posted February 21, 2017 05:42 PM
Edited by LizardWarrior at 17:45, 21 Feb 2017.

Mediczero said:
I honestly think that... "sarcastic" attitude of yours really only makes things worse. You make the community look like a bunch of Erwin hating crybabies. Ever stopped to think about that?


Fine, if you don't want to look like "a bunch of Erwin hating crybabies", then I will leave this thread and let you debate about proposals that will have no chance at all to be ever implemented.

I was working on a heroes-like scene in unreal, to decide what perspective would be the best, but since you don't need me, I see no reason to continue.

____________

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Mediczero
Mediczero


Famous Hero
Warlord of the sea
posted February 21, 2017 05:44 PM
Edited by Mediczero at 18:01, 21 Feb 2017.

Lord_Immortal said:
But it would be a Free-to-Play game much like Renegade-X. Renegade-X had no problems, I don't see why this game should have. Besides, wasn't there a Chinese Heroes of Might and Magic Online set in Erathia?

Still i think we should be able to use visual concepts from Heroes I-IV.

As for the factions, I will start working on some general concepts right away. Castle, Sylvan, Stronghold, Dungeon and Necropolis must certainly be included.

As for the 3d art, why don't you contact the "New Upgrades VCMI" mod team. They have some very good 3d models based on Heroes III. Here. See it for yourself.

I'm honestly not fond of the idea of reusing visual concepts from the older games. Primarily it feels cheap and lazy, and restricts our freedom if we would like to include new elements in terms of factions and units. Same goes for the setting. We would not be restricted by the old lore, and could build it as we would like it. Generally the only advantage of using the oldsetting/visual elements is that its fanservice for those who are just want the old setting back. I believe it would be better for the community to build the setting, FX by different members suggesting various factions, in an open lore style (not directly tied to any setting)

LizardWarrior said:
Fine, if you don't want to look like "a bunch of Erwin hating crybabies", then I will leave this thread and let you debate about proposals that will have no chance at all to be ever implemented.

I was working on a heroes-like scene in unreal, to decide what perspective would be the best, but since you don't need me, I see no reason to continue.

Fine, I'll swallow my pride and say the following.

I'm sorry, that was rude.

However, I want to say that the whole "Erwin" parody really gets on my nerves. It's rude, disrespectful and childish, not to mention a poor taste of humor. Let's just leave it out of the tread, please?

And I'm curious, what where you working on? Seems interesting.

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Lord_Immortal
Lord_Immortal


Famous Hero
posted February 21, 2017 06:04 PM

I disagree... the author clearly states he wants to do something that the Old heroes be remembered so we should do something that is quite similar to the Heroes 1-4 even in style.

First of all, we should remove all Warcraft-ish visual elemets of exaggerating the creatures. For example:
Heroes III Black Dragon looks like a proper dragon and, no matter how beautiful the Heroes VII Black Dragon is, it is simply NOT in original Heroes style.

Same's worth, for example, or for the much debated Necropolis. I personally am a fan of a gothic-style Necropolis regarding buildings. It should be gray and grim, with very very few colors, like the Heroes 3 one.

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Galaad
Galaad


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Enrothian Conservative Party
posted February 21, 2017 06:14 PM

Mediczero said:
Lord_Immortal said:
But it would be a Free-to-Play game much like Renegade-X. Renegade-X had no problems, I don't see why this game should have. Besides, wasn't there a Chinese Heroes of Might and Magic Online set in Erathia?

Still i think we should be able to use visual concepts from Heroes I-IV.

As for the factions, I will start working on some general concepts right away. Castle, Sylvan, Stronghold, Dungeon and Necropolis must certainly be included.

As for the 3d art, why don't you contact the "New Upgrades VCMI" mod team. They have some very good 3d models based on Heroes III. Here. See it for yourself.

I'm honestly not fond of the idea of reusing visual concepts from the older games. Primarily it feels cheap and lazy bla


You miss the point Mediczero. Please create a Naga or whatever it is you want to see and show us. It is no surprise some people recreate Heroes III, we all wanted that and it was never made. Not wanting to sound rude but, if it's not good enough for you or if you don't like it, either start learning a 3d software or go to art university. Cheap and lazy you say, I think you mean your attitude.
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verriker
verriker


Honorable
Legendary Hero
No Use Crying Erwin Spilt Milk
posted February 21, 2017 06:28 PM

nasty naysayers =/= pleasant pragmatists

anyway bear in mind that a next level AI is required for a next level Heroes game, all is certainly for toss if the AI is trash lol

if you have a bunch of people stroking their chin and saying with a straight face "hmm interesting, now I cannot code and I cannot art and I cannot money but I may contribute some lore or some ideas or some testing", you will have a hard time to get a dog biscuit out of that for your dog, let alone a basic AI let alone a game lol

also bear in mind that all of that stuff about making an Indiegogo where lots and lots of money will flow in to hire great programmers and buy engines of Might and Magic belongs in the comedy club as it is not serious (no offence mate) lol

personally if I were you I would ask the Quantomas if he needs a hand with his project (which is basically already this project IIRC) or be born rich or have a rich and gullible friend cheers lol
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LizardWarrior
LizardWarrior


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Age of erwins is over
posted February 21, 2017 06:38 PM
Edited by LizardWarrior at 21:16, 25 Feb 2017.

I agree with Verriker, making a game like heroes is hell of a task even for a commercial game studio with professionals. Just look at team Erwin and how miserably they failed, you may blame corporate greed, but I'd take a Computer science student over someone that just played videogames any day of the week.

Though, a fan-made heroes game is something I'd like to try doing, even if I fail miserably. I would work in parallel with Romanian town and use assets for both if would do it, that's when I will have more time and skills. Right now my life is a sh1tshow of work and can't spare much free time

Mediczero said:

However, I want to say that the whole "Erwin" parody really gets on my nerves. It's rude, disrespectful and childish, not to mention a poor taste of humor. Let's just leave it out of the tread, please?


Uh... I don't think that's called swallowing your pride

Mediczero said:

And I'm curious, what where you working on? Seems interesting.


Setting the camera.

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