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Heroes Community > Other Games Exist Too > Thread: Dungeons & Dragons games
Thread: Dungeons & Dragons games This thread is 2 pages long: 1 2 · «PREV
Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted June 15, 2017 06:02 AM

You're arguing wizards with regards to your playstyle which is honestly wrong. Nobody plays wizards like that without getting them killed Wizards are about preparation and tactical use of spells, fighters just enter the fray and soak the damage. Sure, there are spells that suggest that the wizard will see close combat but those are usually last resort spells or require a more might-oriented playstyle, multi-class etc. Anyways, the class would be too powerful without an hp drawback and if hp were higher, the spells would have to be nerfed which would be lame.
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Dulkan
Dulkan


Known Hero
posted June 15, 2017 08:58 AM
Edited by Dulkan at 08:59, 15 Jun 2017.

Tito_Reni said:
dulkan said:


What do you propose should the weakness of a wizard then be? If a wizard is baseline as strong on defense as a warrior, then what's the point of playing a warrior?




My problem are wizards who die with one strike while warriors can stand a nuke.

In other words: health-points.



Which I already addressed in my previous post. Wizards are much more powerful and flexible than fighters. What's the point of ever playing a fighter, when a wizard can take just as much damage as a fighter? Wizards need a weakness to at least somewhat balance them out and usually that simply is being fragile without defensive spells, so you have to protect them from harm and not let them stand in the front line. That's completely logical to me. If you get a wizard able to stand in the forntl ine thanks to high health and good armour, he needs to have weaker spells, too.
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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted June 15, 2017 12:05 PM

Tito_Reni said:
dulkan said:
Tito_Reni said:

Speaking in general terms, I don't tend to like how wizards are treated (normaly they have very low health and can't wear decent armour). It makes difficult or even boring to play as one.



What do you propose should the weakness of a wizard then be? If a wizard is baseline as strong on defense as a warrior, then what's the point of playing a warrior?

Besides, there are plenty of games, where you can play a battlemage type, woh uses sword and magic and wears heavy armour.


My problem are wizards who die with one strike while warriors can stand a nuke.

In other words: health-points.

Also, armour, I know they can cast some spell to have magical armour, but that is temporary and requieres mana while standard armour doesn't (another good thing about NWN: you could have good magical armour, like a magic tunic which protects you like it was a heavy armour). If they don't have armour, that means less defense points, which also makes them easy to kill.

So, basically, that. They are too easy to kill. They (usually) cannot be in the first line because they get rekt inmediatly.


Are we talking PVP, or the official campaign single player here? those are two very different beasts.

In NWN, you can combine the improved expertise perk with automatic still spell and you get to wear heavy armor and shields without casting penalty, with extra +10AC on top. The mage can actually reach higher AC than fighter without gimping himself in neverwinter nights.

And in the campaign, the enemies mostly attack whatever's near, so your henchman, summon and familiar take all the heat while you're safe.

Even if you want to facetank the damage, the mage is still strictly better than fighter, even when doing it himself in rags. The combination of his defensive spells, improved invisibility and premonition make you pretty much unkillable unless all is dispelled off you (but in D&D 3.0, dispel isn't so easy) and then there's the Epic Warding spell, which makes you IMPOSSIBLE to damage with physical attacks for character level times of rounds.

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Galaad
Galaad

Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
posted June 15, 2017 12:22 PM

I always loved D&D games for their brilliant atmosphere but I never committed enough in them to be good at playing them.

Last year, I bought IceWind Dale's EE but there was some point I think I ****ed up my party setup and didn't find the force to start over.

So, any advice for a good party setup in IWD?
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Quantomas
Quantomas


Responsible
Famous Hero
AI Wizard
posted June 15, 2017 12:29 PM

Galaad said:
I always loved D&D games for their brilliant atmosphere but I never committed enough in them to be good at playing them.

Last year, I bought IceWind Dale's EE but there was some point I think I ****ed up my party setup and didn't find the force to start over.

So, any advice for a good party setup in IWD?

Started IWD on Heart of Fury difficulty with a level 1 party (against all recommendations).

Was total fun. The starting area was extremely challenging and you needed to find a way to earn the experience to level up your party. There were some goblins, had to draw these away one by one, even a single one was a serious threat to wipe out your entire party.

Forces you to figure out a well-rounded party. Ranger and druid were pretty important, particularly later the summons truly made a difference.

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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted June 16, 2017 08:42 AM

I never did play that game, maybe sometime..

Meanwhile I gave up on my rogue playthrough in pillars. Starting combat with a powerful crossbow sneak attack is awesome and I sure like getting some sneak attacks with dual daggers/swords but.. something puts me off. Switching weapons or keeping my party in the back to go backstab and fall back feels like a hassle, maybe I've just grown lazy. I much prefer a ranger with focus on archery and pet companion cooperation. Feels more reliable.
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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted June 16, 2017 09:00 AM
Edited by Doomforge at 09:11, 16 Jun 2017.

Icewind Dale was the only game that was kinda meh to me. I literally couldn't stand it.

Either way, as a rule of a thumb, in D&D 2.0 games (or 2.5? either way, BG&Icewind dale) spam "Sleep" spell on low levels. "Spook" is also useful for a single target. In addition to that, give everybody a bow or other ranged weapon and select 1 "tank" guy to dump best armor+shield on. Use him as bait, move left to right and draw attantion (there are no attacks of opportunity in 2.0) while the rest of your party spam missiles, arrows, bullets or whatever. Melee combat is ridiculously weak at very low levels and your best bet is always a ranged weapon. You can replace the "tank" guy with a summon if you wish - weaker, but expendable.

This is the most idiot-proof strategy ever. Big groups will be decimated by sleep, and the few non-asleep survivors will run helplessly after a guy running in circles while being pumped full of arrows by 4-5 characters. Works every time and is very cheesy.

If you're playing the enhanced editions, keep in mind that throwing weapons were given full bonus damage from strength, and throwing daggers have 2 attacks per round by default. So yeah, throwing daggers are game breaking in the EE games for strong characters Try an Kensai going for Dagger Grandmastery, with 18/00 strength. Hilarious. You can make him a typical powergaming Kensage later on.

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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted June 16, 2017 10:53 AM

Attacks of opportunity was a very good rule. Pillars expands on it with skills that aid disengagement, take flanking into account or affect the number of enemies you can keep engaged. There is also a subtle visual clue between units engaged in melee. Very nicely planned.
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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted June 16, 2017 03:33 PM
Edited by Doomforge at 15:39, 16 Jun 2017.

yep, D&D 3.0 introduced many good things, such as feats, sneak attack, simplified BAB system to replace Thac0, sorted out APR progression, multiclassing that made sense and many others. Compared to that, 2.0 was a total clunky mess

3.5 went overboard with magic nerfing, though. It pretty much reduced (in computer games, ofc) mages to buff-bots with some crowd control.

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