Heroes of Might and Magic Community
visiting hero! Register | Today's Posts | Games | Search! | FAQ/Rules | AvatarList | MemberList | Profile


Age of Heroes Headlines:  
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
6 Aug 2016: Troubled Heroes VII Expansion Release - read more
26 Apr 2016: Heroes VII XPack - Trial by Fire - Coming out in June! - read more
17 Apr 2016: Global Alternative Creatures MOD for H7 after 1.8 Patch! - read more
7 Mar 2016: Romero launches a Piano Sonata Album Kickstarter! - read more
19 Feb 2016: Heroes 5.5 RC6, Heroes VII patch 1.7 are out! - read more
13 Jan 2016: Horn of the Abyss 1.4 Available for Download! - read more
17 Dec 2015: Heroes 5.5 update, 1.6 out for H7 - read more
23 Nov 2015: H7 1.4 & 1.5 patches Released - read more
31 Oct 2015: First H7 patches are out, End of DoC development - read more
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
[X] Remove Ads
LOGIN:     Username:     Password:         [ Register ]
New Server | HOMM1: info forum | HOMM2: info forum | HOMM3: info forum | HOMM4: info forum | HOMM5: info forum | MMH6: wiki forum | MMH7: wiki forum
Heroes Community > Heroes 3.5 - WoG and Beyond > Thread: [VCMI Faction] Ruins
Thread: [VCMI Faction] Ruins This thread is 18 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 · «PREV / NEXT»
xericsin
xericsin


Known Hero
posted September 09, 2018 05:47 PM

Here is what I feel.

If you look at the unicorn and centaur, their front legs seem longer and hence make their body look tall.

Look at the kelpie, its hind legs seem much longer than the front legs. That makes its butt look tilted up and uncomfortable.

Also, the left hind leg looks displaced.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Warmonger
Warmonger


Promising
Legendary Hero
fallen artist
posted September 09, 2018 06:03 PM

Nah, Centaur doesn't have angled butt either. You simply draw the line under his hand.
____________
The future of Heroes 3 is here!

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Lord_Immortal
Lord_Immortal


Famous Hero
posted September 09, 2018 11:54 PM

xericsin said:
Here is what I feel.

If you look at the unicorn and centaur, their front legs seem longer and hence make their body look tall.

Look at the kelpie, its hind legs seem much longer than the front legs. That makes its butt look tilted up and uncomfortable.

Also, the left hind leg looks displaced.



That as well, I almost forgot it.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
fiorin
fiorin


Promising
Known Hero
ctrl + s
posted September 10, 2018 01:23 AM
Edited by fiorin at 01:16, 11 Sep 2018.

xericsin said:
Here is what I feel.
If you look at the unicorn and centaur, their front legs seem longer and hence make their body look tall.
Look at the kelpie, its hind legs seem much longer than the front legs. That makes its butt look tilted up and uncomfortable.
Also, the left hind leg looks displaced.



Warmonger said:
Nah, Centaur doesn't have angled butt either. You simply draw the line under his hand.


Lord_Immortal said:
xericsin said:
...

That as well, I almost forgot it.


Made some changes with your inputs...



Gonna finish the animations, then go for town screen...

Trying some new heads...



What the best way to go ?

Update: Gonna stay like that:



 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Winston
Winston


Adventuring Hero
posted September 11, 2018 03:00 AM

My god the kelpie looks fantastic. I think the update version is the best one of the heads so far.

Why did you choose to change its position in the town to be a level 6 unit? What is the new unit where it previously was in the lineup?

I know it might not be the right time but have you started thinking about special abilities, stats, and buildings in the town? I understand if you haven't gotten there yet, it's important to get the graphical element first and then design how it plays, because numbers are easier.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
fiorin
fiorin


Promising
Known Hero
ctrl + s
posted September 11, 2018 03:40 AM

Winston said:
My god the kelpie looks fantastic. I think the update version is the best one of the heads so far.

Why did you choose to change its position in the town to be a level 6 unit? What is the new unit where it previously was in the lineup?

I know it might not be the right time but have you started thinking about special abilities, stats, and buildings in the town? I understand if you haven't gotten there yet, it's important to get the graphical element first and then design how it plays, because numbers are easier.


Thanks

The lineup was changed by Lord Hawk suggestion on AcidCave about some tweaks.

The abilities now are the following:

Pygmy
Fearless (Can't be affect by fearless)
Sorrow Immunity
Pygmy Veteran
Fearless (Can't be affect by fearless)
Sorrow Immunity
Unlimited Retaliations
---------------------
Stalker
Shooter
Tracker
Shooter
No melee penalty
---------------------
Cockatrice
Flying
5% Petrify after attack
Herald Cockatrice
Flying
10% Petrify after attack
---------------------
Witch
Shooter
10% Magic Mirror
Priestess
Shooter
20% Magic Mirror
Cast 1x Shield (advanced)
---------------------
Peryton
Flying
Return after strike
Grand Peryton
Flying
Return after strike
Jousting
---------------------
River Spirit
Non Living
Mind Immunity
Water immunity (damage spells)
Kelpie
Non Living
Mind Immunity
50% Slow after attack
Water immunity (all negative spells)
---------------------
Living Ruins
Earth Immunity (all negative spells)
Non Living
20% Ranged damage reduction
Ruins Guardian
Earth Immunity (all negative spells)
Non Living
30% Ranged damage reduction
Block retaliation
---------------------

What you think ?

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Winston
Winston


Adventuring Hero
posted September 11, 2018 04:10 AM
Edited by Winston at 03:54, 12 Sep 2018.

To me, ruins has the look and feel of a slower, more defensive town. These are my thoughts on the creatures:

Herald Cockatrice - Give return after attack.

Priestess - Change shield casting to ability to cast expert force field once per battle.

Peryton - Remove return after strike. Give block retaliation instead.
Grand Peryton - Change return after strike to no retaliation. New ability "Ram" that only works when the peryton moves at least 1 hex when attacking. "Ram" causes the enemy unit to become afflicted with a new status condition "dazed" that has the effect that the units next available turn is skipped when it is reached, and the dazed condition is removed.

Kelpie - new ability "Drowning" afflicted to every creature it attacks, that is a bit like dendroid roots but persist after kelpie moves away, keeping the enemy creature stuck there for 3 turns. It also does 100 (can be changed if too much) damage to the unit each turn while drowning and the unit affected only does 75% damage while attacking/retaliating. This would replace the slow effect.

Ruins Guardian - Remove the block retaliation. New ability (if possible) "Quagmire" that creates an effect where any enemy unit that moves into a hex adjacent to this unit is treated as if it is under the quicksand effect (not quicksand but a new effect that is similar), immediately ending its turn, this also affects flying and teleporting units edit flying/teleporting units would land in a square if they were moving to it to attack so they would then be affected, but if flying past the unit then they would not be affected. So basically an enemy unit moving to attack it would move next to it and lose its attack and be forced to attack the next turn when it's already right next to it. And if moving away from the guardian they move through another adjacent hex to the guardian, they would get stuck again.

edit:
Thinking about names a bit more, I'm pretty happy with most of them besides the rank 4
Witch and Priestess sound a bit bland and generic, also interchangeable with existing titles in the game already. Also, priestess sounds a bit too proper for the style of the town.
As a suggestion,what about Embalmer -> Strega
Strega is an italian term for witch, but makes it more interesting to read than just "witch", and embalmer sounds exciting enough while also coming off as a title that would logically be a downgrade from a witch.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
fiorin
fiorin


Promising
Known Hero
ctrl + s
posted September 12, 2018 04:58 AM
Edited by fiorin at 04:59, 12 Sep 2018.

Winston said:
To me, ruins has the look and feel of a slower, more defensive town. These are my thoughts on the creatures:

Herald Cockatrice - Give return after attack.

Priestess - Change shield casting to ability to cast expert force field once per battle.

Peryton - Remove return after strike. Give block retaliation instead.
Grand Peryton - Change return after strike to no retaliation. New ability "Ram" that only works when the peryton moves at least 1 hex when attacking. "Ram" causes the enemy unit to become afflicted with a new status condition "dazed" that has the effect that the units next available turn is skipped when it is reached, and the dazed condition is removed.

Kelpie - new ability "Drowning" afflicted to every creature it attacks, that is a bit like dendroid roots but persist after kelpie moves away, keeping the enemy creature stuck there for 3 turns. It also does 100 (can be changed if too much) damage to the unit each turn while drowning and the unit affected only does 75% damage while attacking/retaliating. This would replace the slow effect.

Ruins Guardian - Remove the block retaliation. New ability (if possible) "Quagmire" that creates an effect where any enemy unit that moves into a hex adjacent to this unit is treated as if it is under the quicksand effect (not quicksand but a new effect that is similar), immediately ending its turn, this also affects flying and teleporting units edit flying/teleporting units would land in a square if they were moving to it to attack so they would then be affected, but if flying past the unit then they would not be affected. So basically an enemy unit moving to attack it would move next to it and lose its attack and be forced to attack the next turn when it's already right next to it. And if moving away from the guardian they move through another adjacent hex to the guardian, they would get stuck again.

edit:
Thinking about names a bit more, I'm pretty happy with most of them besides the rank 4
Witch and Priestess sound a bit bland and generic, also interchangeable with existing titles in the game already. Also, priestess sounds a bit too proper for the style of the town.
As a suggestion,what about Embalmer -> Strega
Strega is an italian term for witch, but makes it more interesting to read than just "witch", and embalmer sounds exciting enough while also coming off as a title that would logically be a downgrade from a witch.


Im studying how do the new abilities/spells for your suggestions. About the names, i prefer stay with celtic/irish/scotland/england names... Witch make sense on that context... Maybe Deity then as the upgraded one... based on

"Accepted in panentheism, pantheism, deism, polytheism, animism, totemism, shamanism and paganism the deity embodies natural forces and can have characteristics of the mother goddess, Mother Nature or lord of the animals."

Or maybe Cailleach, a celtic witch

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Winston
Winston


Adventuring Hero
posted September 12, 2018 05:01 AM
Edited by Winston at 05:09, 12 Sep 2018.

Wicca is the english term, if you want to keep it English. Although I like Cailleach more, but it's weird to pronounce for english speakers so might not be the best option?

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Maurice
Maurice

Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
posted September 12, 2018 09:34 AM

"Witch" has the problem in that there's already a Hero class with the same name. It might not be the best choice because of that.
____________
The last Reasonable Steward of Good Game Design and a Responsible Hero of HC. - Verriker

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
sirironfist
sirironfist


Adventuring Hero
Master of the Sword
posted September 13, 2018 03:20 PM

I believe at some point we might want to consider adjusting existing creature and hero names. Imagine if in 20 years there will be loads of new towns and every now and then someone clmes up with a new kind of wizard/monk/sorcerer or whatever.
So as someone makes a new magi, we will rename the existing one into bracada magi. And monks will be erathia monks just to make room for new monks.
I don't see a reason why multiple factions shouldn't have a sorceress. But they all should be slightly different so the name also needs some adjustment.
Maybe this is a silver witch or a ruin sorceress or rock abbess.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
fiorin
fiorin


Promising
Known Hero
ctrl + s
posted September 14, 2018 05:34 AM

sirironfist said:
I believe at some point we might want to consider adjusting existing creature and hero names. Imagine if in 20 years there will be loads of new towns and every now and then someone clmes up with a new kind of wizard/monk/sorcerer or whatever.
So as someone makes a new magi, we will rename the existing one into bracada magi. And monks will be erathia monks just to make room for new monks.
I don't see a reason why multiple factions shouldn't have a sorceress. But they all should be slightly different so the name also needs some adjustment.
Maybe this is a silver witch or a ruin sorceress or rock abbess.


I understand, but im not wrong about the names.

Wicca is based on a group of witchs and on Wiccan hierarchy the woman leaders are named High Priestess. Please guys, correct me if im wrong. I do not know much about Wicca, i just read somethings before choose the lineup.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
xericsin
xericsin


Known Hero
posted September 14, 2018 02:31 PM

I like the new model's pale color and 'withering' hair.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
fiorin
fiorin


Promising
Known Hero
ctrl + s
posted September 14, 2018 04:47 PM

Finished Kelpie re-texturing and animations:



Gonna update the patch on weekend for the new daily build.

I thinking about the hero adventure model, just having the normal 2 models for class and just in battle the custom for hero.

Yet, gonna rework Witch textures soon

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
verynice
verynice

Tavern Dweller
posted September 14, 2018 05:08 PM
Edited by verynice at 17:08, 14 Sep 2018.

I think you should focus more on having names that both flow well and resonate with existing fantasy archetypes rather than names that are historically correct.

The original Heroes III creature lineup works so well because it is pretty much an all star ensemble of classic mythology and folklore mixed with some DnD tropes.

Most of your creatures names are awkward sounding and conceptually weak.
For instance:
Pygmy
Pygmy Veteran

Pygmy is associated with primitive jungle tribes while veteran is a term often associated with professional standing armies. The two do not fit.

Cockatrice
Herald Cockatrice

Similar issue. Herald is too military sounding to apply to a beast like a Cockatrice. Something like Dire Cockatrice would be much better.

Stalker
Tracker
Witch
Priestess
Ruins Guardian

The above names suffer from being too generic. If you separate them from your graphics they don't mean anything specific. The names should provide flavour and explain the subject in an interesting way.

Compare these:
Bullman - Minotaur
Green Warrior - Goblin
Snakewoman - Medusa
Flying Lizard - Dragon

The names completely changes how the presentation feels because of all the interesting associations they carry. You basically get most of your background lore for free since most players will be familiar with these concepts and their origins.
Making the creatures interesting and understandable is ultimately all that matters in the context of Heroes. Adding historical or regional limitations will just make naming much harder with very little payoff.

The original towns already mix all kinds of mythology together with very little logic or consistency and you should not be afraid of doing the same.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
fiorin
fiorin


Promising
Known Hero
ctrl + s
posted September 14, 2018 05:40 PM

verynice said:
I think you should focus more on having names that both flow well and resonate with existing fantasy archetypes rather than names that are historically correct.

The original Heroes III creature lineup works so well because it is pretty much an all star ensemble of classic mythology and folklore mixed with some DnD tropes.

Most of your creatures names are awkward sounding and conceptually weak.
For instance:
Pygmy
Pygmy Veteran

Pygmy is associated with primitive jungle tribes while veteran is a term often associated with professional standing armies. The two do not fit.

Cockatrice
Herald Cockatrice

Similar issue. Herald is too military sounding to apply to a beast like a Cockatrice. Something like Dire Cockatrice would be much better.

Stalker
Tracker
Witch
Priestess
Ruins Guardian

The above names suffer from being too generic. If you separate them from your graphics they don't mean anything specific. The names should provide flavour and explain the subject in an interesting way.

Compare these:
Bullman - Minotaur
Green Warrior - Goblin
Snakewoman - Medusa
Flying Lizard - Dragon

The names completely changes how the presentation feels because of all the interesting associations they carry. You basically get most of your background lore for free since most players will be familiar with these concepts and their origins.
Making the creatures interesting and understandable is ultimately all that matters in the context of Heroes. Adding historical or regional limitations will just make naming much harder with very little payoff.

The original towns already mix all kinds of mythology together with very little logic or consistency and you should not be afraid of doing the same.


Well said... i agree with everything. The thing is, I like very much hear the community opinions about that, and other stuffs... cause Im doing the concept, models, animations... so often Im blind to details.. important details i can say.

If you have suggestions, feel free to share. Thanks for the input

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Winston
Winston


Adventuring Hero
posted September 14, 2018 11:50 PM
Edited by Winston at 23:53, 14 Sep 2018.

The new version of the kelpi seems a bit off. I preferred it with a slight blue tint, maybe less than what it was but at least some because it seemed like a creature with ties to water with how it's presented. At least could we get a comparison of what the current level 6 both forms look like versus a slight blue tint for both?

As far as names go, I agree on veteran pygmy and herald cockatrice.
Not sure what to change veteran but I agree with Dire Cockatrice for the upgrade name.

For the level 7, how about instead of Ruins Guardian -> Living Ruins,
Living Ruin -> Colossus
It looks like it's from shadow of the colossus and the name would be a simple fit for players to visualize it and know what it is, and living ruin sounds much more basic but is still a good name IMO.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
fiorin
fiorin


Promising
Known Hero
ctrl + s
posted September 15, 2018 01:45 AM

Winston said:
The new version of the kelpi seems a bit off. I preferred it with a slight blue tint, maybe less than what it was but at least some because it seemed like a creature with ties to water with how it's presented. At least could we get a comparison of what the current level 6 both forms look like versus a slight blue tint for both?

As far as names go, I agree on veteran pygmy and herald cockatrice.
Not sure what to change veteran but I agree with Dire Cockatrice for the upgrade name.

For the level 7, how about instead of Ruins Guardian -> Living Ruins,
Living Ruin -> Colossus
It looks like it's from shadow of the colossus and the name would be a simple fit for players to visualize it and know what it is, and living ruin sounds much more basic but is still a good name IMO.


I liked Dire Cockatrice as upgrade too. About Pygmy, maybe then 'Pygmy Survivor' as if the pygmy life ends soon, because they are eat or killed. About lvl 7, i liked Colossus for up. For non-up, i was thinking 'walking stones'.

Colors ?

I made some examples to throw rocks!


 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
portus
portus


Hired Hero
posted September 15, 2018 01:58 AM
Edited by portus at 02:00, 15 Sep 2018.

Walking stones sounds kind of dull and generic. May I suggest "Moai"? If you are not particularly concerned about lore consistency, I believe it'll quickly ring a bell on everyone's heads and makes somewhat sense with the nature of the creature.


As to the kelpies: Schhhhweet! Considering it a marsh/water-related creature, color 6 looks nice to me. However number 12 looks really nice too if we don't focus that much on the water theme.

Oh! and cockatrice's upgrade should be evil chicken. Naaah, just kidding
____________
Ssssshhhhhhhpp!! Ah! (crimson cloud and I'm gone)

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Winston
Winston


Adventuring Hero
posted September 15, 2018 06:52 AM

portus said:
Walking stones sounds kind of dull and generic. May I suggest "Moai"? If you are not particularly concerned about lore consistency, I believe it'll quickly ring a bell on everyone's heads and makes somewhat sense with the nature of the creature.


As to the kelpies: Schhhhweet! Considering it a marsh/water-related creature, color 6 looks nice to me. However number 12 looks really nice too if we don't focus that much on the water theme.

Oh! and cockatrice's upgrade should be evil chicken. Naaah, just kidding


Moai technically did have bodies, they were just buried under the ground.
http://newsroom.ucla.edu/stories/easter-island-statues-revealed-234519

I like Moai if Living Ruin isn't going to be done.

As far as the Kelpie, I like 7 and 9 the most. They are the lightest and most muted colors that aren't too different from the unupgraded version, but also natural looking and enough to make them look like they have a relation to water.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Jump To: « Prev Thread . . . Next Thread » This thread is 18 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 · «PREV / NEXT»
Post New Poll    Post New Topic    Post New Reply

Page compiled in 0.1606 seconds