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| Thread: mass killings outside the u.s. |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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blizzardboy
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posted March 16, 2019 01:41 PM |
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Blob -
News will bring to light the obvious, or the extraordinary possibility that the crazy white Aussies and Kiwis were secretly Muslim radicals who murdered dozens of other Muslims in order to ignite other radicals *eye roll*
Then again, you might become suspicious at that point that any stories that reveal further details will also be a conspiracy, even though dozens of different news agencies are all going to be digging into and fact checking the same thing. They will all be covers up. 
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AlHazin
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posted March 16, 2019 04:32 PM |
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Kipshasz said:
Insider is leftist bull.
Maybe, maybe... hahaha.
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blob2
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posted March 16, 2019 07:48 PM |
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@Blizzard
It's not that I want to say "ha, told you so!". We probably won't find it out either way. Authorities wouldn't want to tell it even if it was the truth because a "white supremacist" is much better to sell then a "mercenary hired by radicals". We probably will never know. NZ government wants to change gun laws after the tragedy, disarming the population was another of the radicals ideas?
When I was younger I eyerolled to everything, especially all those "New World Order" and other theories that explain why someone wants the population to be against each other. I didn't want to belive there's such a powerful and evil power around...
Oh and in ages past we had something like privateers, pirates which robbed one countries ships while supposedly having no connection to their rival countries...
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blizzardboy
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posted March 16, 2019 08:47 PM |
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Privateers and piracy are just a form of proxy war, and everybody knows proxy wars are a real thing. It was a risky job but people did it because they got paid a handsome sum of money.
What does the ringleader have to get out of it, if he is not an ideological zealot? He was captured and had no real hope of escape. He's going to be in prison for life. You can easily explain crime if there is a financial or other material motive, or maybe to get themselves or family out of trouble, but otherwise the only other reasons are A) the person is disturbed, or B) they are extremely dedicated to an ideology. A and B to some extent are interlinked with each other but they are also different. There's no point getting paid if you know you're going to be killed or captured.
I don't know why it's so hard to just accept (with 99% certainty) that he was exactly what he says he was. White hate groups - as well as other hate groups - have been steadily on the rise. A combination of alt right politicians, nationalism/ethnocentrism, and internet/social media make it easy to radicalize people.
For a zealot, they will do whatever it takes to get a gun if that helps them accomplish whatever they are trying to do. They put little value on their own life, so there's not really much you can do to deter them once they have made up their mind.
But for the average criminal, if firearms are more trouble than what they are worth, then they won't go to the trouble of having them. This is why criminals in many countries (basically all of Europe) don't carry. There's no point and it just makes their life worse to even bother. But so many Americans ignore this fact - and it is A FACT - out of fear and because they've grown attached to have a gun in their home, so now that it is a psychological dependency, they automatically feel unsafe without it. It's purely psychological but unfortunately their disordered attitude means the rest of us are put at greater risk.
This is why you can't convince the pro-gun group no matter what you show them. They didn't reason themselves into their view, so you can't reason them out of it. It's like trying to get a person who is terrified of heights to go skydiving. It's more-or-less futile because it's the lizard part of their brain that is afraid.
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blob2
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posted March 16, 2019 10:09 PM |
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Edited by blob2 at 16:40, 17 Mar 2019.
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blizzardboy said:
I don't know why it's so hard to just accept (with 99% certainty) that he was exactly what he says he was. White hate groups - as well as other hate groups - have been steadily on the rise. A combination of alt right politicians, nationalism/ethnocentrism, and internet/social media make it easy to radicalize people.
He might be what he says he is. But he still might've been used by some groups. Isn't this what ISIS was build upon? There were a lot of Europeans (white or no white) who became ISIS soldiers, because those were some poor confused souls, and ISIS knew what to do with them. The Christchurch shooter appears to have hated Muslims, so it didn't matter to him who he killed. But someone might've made it easier for him. It didn't matter for them which Muslims he killed, as long as he would make something of this scale. Baseless violence is always the best trigger to make people angry and wanting revenge. No one will cry after some backwood guerrilas somewhere in the desert... plus we know terrorist don't give a f* even if their fellow Muslims die (they are traitors for peacefully coexisting with the infidels either way).
But guess you're right. It's a theory, and we know nothing.
blizzardboy said:
But so many Americans ignore this fact - and it is A FACT - out of fear and because they've grown attached to have a gun in their home, so now that it is a psychological dependency, they automatically feel unsafe without it. It's purely psychological but unfortunately their disordered attitude means the rest of us are put at greater risk.
Yeah but incidents like mass hsootings don't make it easier for them to just let go. Besides it's in reality more about day-to-day violence. From what I've seen many defenders of gun laws in US aren't about protection against terrorists, but gangsters who rob shops or homes. I think it's about this kind of self-protection: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vo_X53dNTS8
EDIT: I think this article https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-news/pewdie-pie-new-zealand-mosque-shooting-youtube-808633/ does make a point. As a person who doesn't use social media that much I can't fully understand this phenomena, but something might be amiss. Yet it would be nice if they mentioned non-white supremacist also use social channels for spreading their propaganda...
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AlHazin
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posted March 20, 2019 10:58 AM |
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Seems like the killer went to France to radicalise
Quote:
For many years I had been hearing and reading of the invasion of France by non-whites, many of these rumours and stories I believed to be exaggerations, created to push a political narrative," Tarrant wrote. “But once I arrived in France, I found the stories not only to be true, but profoundly understated. In every French city, in every French town the invaders were there.
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Kipshasz
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posted March 20, 2019 11:02 AM |
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he's been well traveled, some sources cite he's been part of Azov cuck battalion as well, though it may be some donbassi bullcrap.
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blob2
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posted March 20, 2019 11:30 AM |
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He also visited Poland, lel.
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artu
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My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted March 20, 2019 12:09 PM |
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Istanbul, too.
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Salamandre
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posted March 21, 2019 02:34 PM |
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blizzardboy said:
I don't know why it's so hard to just accept (with 99% certainty) that he was exactly what he says he was. White hate groups - as well as other hate groups - have been steadily on the rise. A combination of alt right politicians, nationalism/ethnocentrism, and internet/social media make it easy to radicalize people.
First sentence true, the bold one not. You denounce the effects but remain blind concerning the causes. Tolerance does not equal immunity, racism starts when tolerance red line is exceeded. African uncontrolled - and not desired, all polls show it - mass immigration, massive islamisation of Europe (come in France to see how parallel societies hate each other, where went this assimilation concept regressive leftists cherished), then spectacular rise of criminality and daily violence due to it. And last but not least suppression of free speech. So what remains to one to sort out his discontent? Violence.
Guns or not guns, they will find a way. An african guy locked 51 italian kids in a bus yesterday, tied their hands then put the bus on fire. Only the hazard saved them, one kid had kept his phone and able to call for help. Went almost unnoticed in the news.
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Minion
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posted March 21, 2019 02:46 PM |
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Salamandre said:
Guns or not guns, they will find a way. An african guy locked 51 italian kids in a bus yesterday, tied their hands then put the bus on fire.
But he didn't find a way, the kids were saved. Had he had an assault rifle, it would be a very different story.
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blob2
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posted March 21, 2019 02:48 PM |
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Edited by blob2 at 14:57, 21 Mar 2019.
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Meanwhile in Netherlands (or Dutchland if you prefer) the rightist (anti-immigrant) party which was nonexistant before now has a sizable presence in the diet, probably getting a few more votes in the aftermath of the Utrecht shooting...
Salamandre said:
Guns or not guns, they will find a way. An african guy locked 51 italian kids in a bus yesterday, tied their hands then put the bus on fire. Only the hazard saved them, one kid had kept his phone and able to call for help. Went almost unnoticed in the news.
It's quite well covered here in PL. Yeah but, we're a rightist country, so figures...
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Salamandre
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posted March 21, 2019 03:09 PM |
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Minion said:
Had he had an assault rifle, it would be a very different story.
No, he failed because he was an amateur. The guy who attacked the mosque prepared his act for 2 years. Twin Towers attack was prepared for years too. When you have months to prepare, getting a gun is not hard, even in gun-free countries. And even if not, you will find a way: a knife, a truck, a plane, a train and so on. In my opinion, the discussion around weapons availability is irrelevant when it comes to terrorism of any kind, motivated people proved they can be very creative to accomplish their designs. Meanwhile we never talk about causes, the real ones.
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blob2
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posted March 21, 2019 03:33 PM |
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Edited by blob2 at 15:39, 21 Mar 2019.
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Salamandre said:
Minion said:
Had he had an assault rifle, it would be a very different story.
In my opinion, the discussion around weapons availability is irrelevant when it comes to terrorism of any kind, motivated people proved they can be very creative to accomplish their designs. Meanwhile we never talk about causes, the real ones.
Yeah, as the cases of the so called "lawn-mowers of Allah" show you can use an automobile to drive through a pedestrian group. I don't suppose you need much planning for that...
Meanwhile in Birmingham 5 Mosques were vandalized last night: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-47651350. I sense it will only get worse...
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AlHazin
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النور
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posted March 21, 2019 04:09 PM |
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blob2 said:
Meanwhile in Birmingham 5 Mosques were vandalized last night: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-47651350. I sense it will only get worse...
Vandalism and violence will continue as long as it is fueled by people like Salamandre who justify such attacks almost calling for their legitimacy.
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Salamandre
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posted March 21, 2019 04:20 PM |
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bla bla from the guy living in a 99,9% refusing diversity of any kind country.
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JollyJoker
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posted March 21, 2019 07:26 PM |
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Salamandre said:
First sentence true, the bold one not. You denounce the effects but remain blind concerning the causes. Tolerance does not equal immunity, racism starts when tolerance red line is exceeded. African uncontrolled - and not desired, all polls show it - mass immigration, massive islamisation of Europe (come in France to see how parallel societies hate each other, where went this assimilation concept regressive leftists cherished), then spectacular rise of criminality and daily violence due to it. And last but not least suppression of free speech. So what remains to one to sort out his discontent? Violence.
Same bollocks than before. The problem with this is actually not so much that this is all pretty debatable, the problem with this is that things are like they are. If this was 1970 and you'd debate whether you should alow muslim immigrants to become permanent residents in France you could have the debate - although, you'd have to throw human rights and religious freedom out of the window.
But as it is, it makes no sense, since there ARE already a lot of first and second generation immigrants in France. What are you going to do? Shoot them? Force them into the mediterranean at gun point?
They are in your country. As others are in other countries. Hate propaganda doesn't help. And comments like the last one are extremely bad and actually a disgrace.
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Blizzardboy
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posted March 21, 2019 08:14 PM |
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Salamandre said:
Minion said:
Had he had an assault rifle, it would be a very different story.
No, he failed because he was an amateur. The guy who attacked the mosque prepared his act for 2 years. Twin Towers attack was prepared for years too. When you have months to prepare, getting a gun is not hard, even in gun-free countries. And even if not, you will find a way: a knife, a truck, a plane, a train and so on. In my opinion, the discussion around weapons availability is irrelevant when it comes to terrorism of any kind, motivated people proved they can be very creative to accomplish their designs. Meanwhile we never talk about causes, the real ones.
It's pretty much impossible to prevent somebody from inflicting lethal harm but there is terrible and then there is worse than terrible.
It's non-debatable that the terrorists in NZ would have killed more people if it was within their power to do so. There are guns they could have been using that would have been far more effective. Saying "well, they could have used a knife or a car" doesn't change anything.
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Salamandre
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posted March 21, 2019 08:17 PM |
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JollyJoker said:
What are you going to do?
Yeah, because when water dumps out of the pot, you keep pouring water into the pot. So smart.
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Blizzardboy
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posted March 21, 2019 08:23 PM |
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Minion said:
But he didn't find a way, the kids were saved. Had he had an assault rifle, it would be a very different story.
You're making perfect sense. Please stop.
Basically, if that story in Italy had happened in the USA, there would have been a news story about two or three dozen dead people.
Salamandre: you are using a "whataboutism". It's a logical fallacy.
'What about knives?' 'What about cars?' Yada yada yada. None of it changes the fact that there are weapons that make killing people more efficient and more easy. Any acts of terrorism that kill people would be much worse if people had easy access to whatever they felt like.
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