Heroes of Might and Magic Community
visiting hero! Register | Today's Posts | Games | Search! | FAQ/Rules | AvatarList | MemberList | Profile


Age of Heroes Headlines:  
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
6 Aug 2016: Troubled Heroes VII Expansion Release - read more
26 Apr 2016: Heroes VII XPack - Trial by Fire - Coming out in June! - read more
17 Apr 2016: Global Alternative Creatures MOD for H7 after 1.8 Patch! - read more
7 Mar 2016: Romero launches a Piano Sonata Album Kickstarter! - read more
19 Feb 2016: Heroes 5.5 RC6, Heroes VII patch 1.7 are out! - read more
13 Jan 2016: Horn of the Abyss 1.4 Available for Download! - read more
17 Dec 2015: Heroes 5.5 update, 1.6 out for H7 - read more
23 Nov 2015: H7 1.4 & 1.5 patches Released - read more
31 Oct 2015: First H7 patches are out, End of DoC development - read more
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
[X] Remove Ads
LOGIN:     Username:     Password:         [ Register ]
New Server | HOMM1: info forum | HOMM2: info forum | HOMM3: info forum | HOMM4: info forum | HOMM5: info forum | MMH6: wiki forum | MMH7: wiki forum
Heroes Community > Heroes 4 - Lands of Axeoth > Thread: MULTIPLAYER campaigns in H4 [how to]
Thread: MULTIPLAYER campaigns in H4 [how to]
NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted August 02, 2018 01:38 PM

MULTIPLAYER campaigns in H4 [how to]

Possibly H4 is the only Heroes game that enables multiplayer campaigns, that I know of.

I haven't yet tested it but everything indicates it.


The roadblock is probably that, if you lose a game, you are auto.kicked thus you can't continue to next scenario.

This would still allow multi-scenario co-op campaigns, but disallow normally competitive ones.



Not taking that into account:
So, my idea is the following: Create two multiplayer campaigns (that will be integrated for version 0.20 of my mod). I already have experience with campaign making of course.

The only thing I lament is that H4 doesn't have as much campaign features as say, Starcraft. There you can dynamically choose what the next scenario is based on ingame actions;

The most important thing in Starcraft campaign is that you can still play a next scenario if you lose.

In contrast, H4 scenario campaign order is fixed. However, I think I can "cheat" this by making a "skip" mechanism. For example.

Scenario 1, two players, red and blue.
The one that first gets True Sword wins.
Carry over sword to next scenario

Scenario 2
Designed in case red gets the Sword. Say, Red comes as a single hero to Blue's homeland to conquer their city.
If blue has the sword instead, skip to next (instant "ally win" possible).
This is controlled with scripts.

Scenario 3
Designed in case Blue has the sword. Say, Blue goes down as a single her to Red's underground lair to conquest HIS city.

If this is an intermediate scenario, the cities can actually be neutral, and the fight be indirect (for example with quests), thus ensuring no player actually "loses", and both win as allies, to go to next scenario.


You see this way you can have scenario progression according to incame parameters. The key is the carryover and scripts that act in consequence.

* * *

About maps which are competitive, and yet require allied victory, it is possible to make them with unorthodox mechanics.

Example: There are two "computer enemies", one facing each player. Yet each player reinforces the computer enemy of the other. Direct alliance with them is not possible in the way H4 is set up (you can't be allied with the enemy of an ally, its all homogeneous blocks). But you can set up Quest Huts, which, for example, will give money to Red's enemy computer player if Blue brings it. So you invest in your (fre)enemy's destruction, indirectly. Many such mechanisms are possible, even locking or unlocking doors and destroying map objects from your frenemy's side of the map. The sky is the limit, but it must be customized.


***

Of course the possibility of multiplayer campaigns, even cooperative ones, still has to be tested. We still don't know if both players can appear in the next scenario after finishing one until we try.

What do you think? Any results? Further ideas?
____________
Discover H4 Greatest Mod!
https://www.moddb.com/mods/greatest-mod/downloads
(Also biggest of only two 2 mods for HOMM IV)

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted August 02, 2018 01:56 PM

PS: Ok, I have made a test. And yes, you can even have fully competitive campaigns. At least tested with two players. Even if a player loses fighting the other, both will advance to the next scenario. I'm not sure how exactly it would work with three or more players. First player to fall, or last to stand?

You chave to remember though in any case to add the player options from the campaign dialogue, not the scenario dialogue (in "campaign" menu, not "tools" menu). Choose a portrait, make positions be able to be occupied by humans, etc. Even if you do it on the scenario only, it won't work for the campaign as a whole if you don't enable it there.

Anyways:
Quite an underused and neat feature, really.
____________
Discover H4 Greatest Mod!
https://www.moddb.com/mods/greatest-mod/downloads
(Also biggest of only two 2 mods for HOMM IV)

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
radmutant69
radmutant69


Known Hero
posted August 03, 2018 09:18 AM

Underused? I think I've never seen any multiplayer campaign so far. Dang I've never even heard about it from anyone except you

Unfortunately I know almost nothing about campaign making but it's really an interesting possibility, I'd especially like to play cooperative campaigns..

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted August 03, 2018 11:25 AM
Edited by NimoStar at 11:27, 03 Aug 2018.

Well that's exactly what underused means... that it's used way less that it could be. But I didn't want to say "unused" because whenever I imply that someone comes crashing the walls screaming about how it's been done before and how can I dare saying it hasn't been . So it's just a rule of cautious editing, but I have known none either.

Guess that's also a secondary effect of H4 not being as popular, but there are quite a few custom maps and none tried this feature...

Well, then co-op campaign it is!


Just have to wait until karmakeld releases the objects :/
____________
Discover H4 Greatest Mod!
https://www.moddb.com/mods/greatest-mod/downloads
(Also biggest of only two 2 mods for HOMM IV)

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
radmutant69
radmutant69


Known Hero
posted August 03, 2018 11:48 AM

Look into the PNG thread I guess

But also I think he's planning to release the first bunch of objects on this weekend.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Karmakeld
Karmakeld


Famous Hero
posted August 03, 2018 08:05 PM
Edited by Karmakeld at 20:09, 03 Aug 2018.

Yup it'll be out this weekend (the object package) I recommand waiting for the package rather than download all files.. some renaming was required..

H4 campaigns and maps has a lot of unused ideas/potentials in general, fan maps has shown this ever since the release, but nice idea. But it's nice to see new ideas still emerge..
A few comments, take a look at KarmaKeld's Tale of Mudgeon campaign (cough cough), another way to link campaign maps is by linking them as single maps (in a campaign) rather than in a string campaign as the original. This might give you more free hands regarding skipping maps.
This also allows for some other 'features' like you can transfer the same hero from each scenario completed, so you can make doublicates. Of course there's pros/cons for this alternate campaign setup.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted August 04, 2018 11:19 AM
Edited by NimoStar at 11:20, 04 Aug 2018.

So waiting it is... again... :V

Well, that's not a bad idea, I guess that comes from the last "campaign" (single mission) after beating everything in Winds of War, too.
But there would still be testing required. It would be easier to "skip" for single-player decisions, but I don't know how multi-player carryover would deal with it.

Another point is how these campaigns would react to being played online. Thus far I have only tested hotseat from the normal create a game configuration.
____________
Discover H4 Greatest Mod!
https://www.moddb.com/mods/greatest-mod/downloads
(Also biggest of only two 2 mods for HOMM IV)

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Karmakeld
Karmakeld


Famous Hero
posted August 04, 2018 01:31 PM
Edited by Karmakeld at 15:29, 04 Aug 2018.

NimoStar said:
So waiting it is... again... :V

Well, that's not a bad idea, I guess that comes from the last "campaign" (single mission) after beating everything in Winds of War, too.
But there would still be testing required. It would be easier to "skip" for single-player decisions, but I don't know how multi-player carryover would deal with it.


In theory they should react just the same way  the final map in Winds or War did.
Iirc as long as the heroes you want to carry over has a color (gray won't carry over) on both the completed and new map, they should carry over (if named ofcourse). I recall you can even change owner color on the new map if you'd like.
If the carryover hero name is blank the strongest hero of that color will carryover.

EDIT: Sorry for kept you waiting for 4 hours
look here

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted August 04, 2018 04:51 PM

What I meant is for example to play that online, you would need to start a new game each time unlike with the campaigns which are joined together (if indeed they are playable that way, which is dubious, but you could at least play online a single-player co-op scenario which I don't remember to have been done either). And the new one would not record which player was which; campaigns prompts don't let you select the classic way. And non-campaign  scenarios can't import carryover heroes. So its still the "Multiplayer" part which may be problematic.

But it is all a matter of testing. Perhaps I will get to it using 2 pcs and 2 connections.

***

4 hours + 7 months since january :V
____________
Discover H4 Greatest Mod!
https://www.moddb.com/mods/greatest-mod/downloads
(Also biggest of only two 2 mods for HOMM IV)

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Karmakeld
Karmakeld


Famous Hero
posted November 03, 2018 08:50 PM

oh looks like someone else had the idea of multiplayer campaigns:
http://www.hommdb.com/maps/heroes-4/coop-campaing-heroes-of-might-and-magic-iv-3/
Coop versions of the original Campaigns.
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
radmutant69
radmutant69


Known Hero
posted November 04, 2018 11:12 PM

Cautious editing rulez! Let's say it's underused then lol..

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
NimoStar
NimoStar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted November 09, 2018 11:33 AM

Interesting but sort of cheap if it's only adding an extra player to the existing maps :V

Even so, it is nice to see at least someone considered it.

I actually conceived and written all the mechanics and story for an all-original custom co-op campaign, but it's much work actually making the maps...
____________
Discover H4 Greatest Mod!
https://www.moddb.com/mods/greatest-mod/downloads
(Also biggest of only two 2 mods for HOMM IV)

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Karmakeld
Karmakeld


Famous Hero
posted November 09, 2018 10:23 PM

NimoStar said:
Interesting but sort of cheap if it's only adding an extra player to the existing maps :V

Even so, it is nice to see at least someone considered it.

I actually conceived and written all the mechanics and story for an all-original custom co-op campaign, but it's much work actually making the maps...


Indeed. Well really most of the work is the balancing. But
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Jump To: « Prev Thread . . . Next Thread »
Post New Poll    Post New Topic    Post New Reply

Page compiled in 0.0340 seconds