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Heroes Community > Heroes 4 - Lands of Axeoth > Thread: favorite or best building trees...
Thread: favorite or best building trees...
undead_wolf_...
undead_wolf_lad


Adventuring Hero
Undead Wolf Wrangler
posted July 05, 2002 03:32 PM

favorite or best building trees...

Curious what building branches people use the most. It gets discussed alot in many posts, but I hadn't seen a post specifically listing the branches...Here's what I find most effective.

Life:
Lev 1's
pikemen
monks
angels

Nature:
Lev 1's
elves
griffons
faerie dragons (but Phoenixes are great also)
creature portal: Water elems

Chaos:
Lev 1's
medusas
efreet (although it's almost a draw with Nightmares)
Black Dragons

Death:
Lev 1's
ghosts (highly underrated lev 2)
vamps (although sometimes I'll go Venom's since you'll be getting vamps via GM necromancy)
Devils (it's a draw with Ghost Dragons. Neither are especially cool for lev 4's IMO).

Order:
Lev 1's
Gold Golem (mages are good, but weak. Golems are just too strong to pass on)
Genies (probably the most one sided decision IMO).
Titans
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Djive
Djive


Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
posted July 05, 2002 04:23 PM

Life:
Pikemen
Monks
Angels

Nature:
Lev 1's
Tigers (Easier to build early)
Unicorn (Easy to build early)
Faerie Dragons (but Phoenixes are great also)
creature portal: Water Elems (Sometimes Mantis, and if the troops is to defend a town then Waspworts can also be considerd.)

In rich maps I build for Griffins, and if I have the needed wood early I might take the elves. The elves are however a bit slow for my taste.

Chaos:
Medusas
Nightmare (or Efreet both are good.)
Black Dragons

Death:
Cerberi (Ghosts can be considered on some maps, but getting the level 3 early is good, and it's easier to build for Cerberi than for Ghosts.)
Vampire (Venom Spawn can be considered if you want to mix death troops with other alignments. VS are a bit too slow for my taste.)
Devils


Order:
Gold Golem (But Sometimes I take Mages.)
Genies
Any of the level 4. Dragon Golems would be the more common choice.

Might:
Nomads.
Cyclops
Thunderbirds
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Jester
Jester

Tavern Dweller
posted July 05, 2002 05:56 PM

I would say....

Life:
Pikemen
Monks
Angels

Nature:
Elfs
Griffins
Faerie Dragons
Creature portal: Waspworts

Chaos:
Medusas
Efreet
Black Dragons

Death:
Cerberi
Vampire
Devils

Order:
Mages
Genies
Titans

Might:
Nomads
Cyclops
Behemoths

Every map demands diffrent strategies and if I have to towns of the same allignement I often grow diffrent creatures of the same level in those....
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DarkManiac
DarkManiac


Known Hero
of Hell
posted July 05, 2002 06:13 PM

Life:
Ballista
Monk
Champion (only a bit more often than Angels)

Nature:
Elf
Griffin
F. Dragon
CP: Mantis

Might:
Harpy
Cyclop
Thunderbird

Order:
Mage/Golem equily (depends on the map)
Genie
Titan/Dragon Golem (if I have mages I take DG if I have golems I take titans)

Death:
Cerberus/Ghost (depends on the situation)
Vampire
Devil (sometimes GD are better)

Chaos:
Medusa
Efreet (sometimes Nightmare)
Black Dragons/Hydras (both good)

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Darkspirit
Darkspirit


Famous Hero
aka Zutus
posted July 05, 2002 06:44 PM
Edited By: Darkspirit on 7 Jul 2002

here I go:

life:

-pikemen, ballista's are too slow and pikemen are really tough for second levels

-monks, they are the needed second shooter, although I really like the crusaders and I regret the fact that I'm quite forced to pick the monks

-angels, waaaay better, although I might go for champions when I have a lack in resources.

nature:

-elves, but as said, the amount of wood is very huge, so I have to go for white tigers, although I don't really like them.

-unicorns, I like these more than griffins, blind is really useful.

-portal: air elementals, they really kick ass, soo tough to destroy, water elementals are great too, mantises come in too small numbers.

death:

-ghosts, cerberi seem to die fast.

-venom spawns, vampires may be really good, but you get them through necromancy, venom spawns are really really needed as they are the only shooter.

-devils, ice demons are really good, and the fear-effect of the bone dragons only works on living troops.

chaos:

-medusas

-nightmares, they are more usefull I think, the ability of the efreet only kicks in when they die, so.

-black dragons, but hydras come in bigger numbers and can be really great too.

might:

-harpies, no retaliation, just keep them in the back.

-cyclopses

-thunderbirds, the behemoths ability is just lame, it's like the zombies one. The behemoths would be cooler if they have the ability to attack every creature that would come near/pass by the behemoth. I shouldn't be the behemoths turn even. This could also be an ability for the ogre mages, this would make up for a lil' bit tougher choice between cyclopses and ogre mages.

edit: forgot to do order.

it depends here, if I take mages, I pick nagas, if I pick golems I take genies.

mages tend to die really fast, so their magic fist attack becomes not so strong once they're shot by a ranged unit, since most of them have died. Golems on the other hand are really tough, so I go for them mostly.
Genies are overpowered I think. But with good use of teleport, nagas are better I think, they can wipe out those nasty genies pretty fast.
I tend to pick dragon golems more than titans, which are quite expensive and I think they don't do as much damage anymore as they used to do.
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Young moles appear to be in full dispersal which means there are more moles per acre than at any other time of the year

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undead_wolf_...
undead_wolf_lad


Adventuring Hero
Undead Wolf Wrangler
posted July 06, 2002 11:29 PM

forgot Might...

Might:
lev 1's
nomads (almost a draw with harpies)
cyclops
Thunderbird (depends on map, but like the speed)

It's interesting, only 5 responses in, but not a single choice for Nagas, Ogre Magi, Champions, (as I suspected) and only mention of Venom Spawn's because you can get free Vamps via GM Necro.
The Nature units seem to be the most "unclear" or better balanced

pairs that need to be better balanced:
Genies and Nagas
Cyclops and Ogre Magi
Vampires and Venom Spawn
Angels and Champions

and to a lesser extent:
Black Dragons and Hydras
Medusas and Minotaurs
Monks and Crusaders

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Djive
Djive


Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
posted July 07, 2002 03:38 AM

"It's interesting, only 5 responses in, but not a single choice for Nagas, Ogre Magi, Champions, (as I suspected) and only mention of Venom Spawn's because you can get free Vamps via GM Necro."

Nagas face Genies. They are not bad but Genies just come in too high numbers and  are very good. I'd say the best would be to reduce the growth of Genies to 5/week and make them cost a bit more. That would make Nagas a more viable choice.

Ogre Magi needs a better special (more spells and spellpoints) so that they can make up for the Cylops special which is very good.

Vampires and Venom Spawn are well balanced. What unbalances them is the fact that you get Vampires from GM Necromancy. And I would have 40 Vampires rather than 20 Vampires and 20 Venom Spawn.

Angels and Champions are also close. The Champions have a tendency to have reduced mobility because the unit is big. So using them to full effect takes some getting used to.

Monks and Crusaders are also close. It happens that I build for the Crusaders instead of Monks.
____________
"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"

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DarkManiac
DarkManiac


Known Hero
of Hell
posted July 07, 2002 06:38 AM

Quote:
Noone chose champions...


DAH...I chose them.
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A villain's gotta do what a villain's gotta do.

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Darkspirit
Darkspirit


Famous Hero
aka Zutus
posted July 07, 2002 07:17 AM

well, I chose them too, since they only cost 1000gold and a lil' amount of wood and ore, or am I mistaking myself?
____________
Young moles appear to be in full dispersal which means there are more moles per acre than at any other time of the year

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Drizzt12
Drizzt12


Hired Hero
The drow of the underdark
posted July 07, 2002 01:15 PM

I Think there shouldn't be a hard formula to build creatures in towns, u all should build according to the situation for example: in the order town i usually build mages and genies, but if i know i'm gonna fight the choas armies i will build golems and nagas (because of the black dragon immunities).

same goes for another situations in other towns...
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Piquedram
Piquedram

Tavern Dweller
posted July 08, 2002 05:20 PM

Life:
Ballistas (I like shooters; I know the Pikemen are great, but...)
Monks (I really like shooters)
Angels (of course)

Order:
Golems (Mages die like flies, and Golems are about 3x tougher)
Genies (because of their spells)
Dragon Golems (this choice is quite hard - Titans are shooters, which is great, but the golems look great, fight well and they are new to Heroes series - and I guess it's always good to try new things)

Death:
Cerberi (no counterstrike, 3-fields attack - they're really good)
Vamps vs. Venom - hard to say: Venoms are fantastic, but Vampires are always Vampires...
Devils (but the Dragons are also quite good)

Chaos:
Medusas of course - because of the great Mighty Gorgons' ability of Death Stare
Nightmares - both are good, I like their looks
Black Dragon - of course

Nature:
Elves - shooters, however it's much more expensive to get them than Tigers (also a solid unit) - so it depends on the map
Griffins - much better than Unicorns
Fairie Dragons - I guess this is my favorite unit, but the Phoenixes are also great - well, it depends
Portal: Water Elemantals - good spells, good looks, extremely useful creatures

Might:
Harpies - they can very annoying for the enemy and they fight like shooters; also a great design - extremely ugly, but in a cool way
Cyclopes - of course, their area attack is great
Thunderbirds - Behemoths are to slow for me

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Darkspirit
Darkspirit


Famous Hero
aka Zutus
posted July 08, 2002 05:36 PM

ballistas are just sooo bad, I can't understand why some people take them, they force you to only do 15 moves on the map. It's so damn annoying when you have them. I imagine this is no problem against AI, but against human opponents they will mean absolute loss.
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Young moles appear to be in full dispersal which means there are more moles per acre than at any other time of the year

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Thunder
Thunder


Responsible
Famous Hero
posted July 10, 2002 09:32 AM

Do not read this. It is long and boring.


Haven
Second Level Dwelling: Pikemen. Because I like the way they are developing themselves hunchbacks. Besides Ballistas did suck in Heroes 3 and everyone saying otherwise is a good player.
Third Level Dwelling: Monks because of the lack of shooters but I like Crusaders more. Shiny armor rules over boring books any day and night! When I'm playing against Death, Crusaders are more obvious choice.
Fourth Level Dwelling: No favourite here, but I must admit that Champions look a bit too funny when you compare their size to Crusaders.

Preserve
Second Level Dwelling: White Tigers because they have quite excellent stats and it is a lot harder to get Elves.
Third Level Dwelling: Unicorns, because they are easier to build and I need to get 'em Faeries fast. But if I have lots of time in hands and the map is rich I will get Griffins which are better.
Fourth Level Dwelling: Faerie Dragons. Fireball, Confusion, Lightning and the enemy is toast. Fiery chickens are good but Faerie Dragons are just plain amazing!
Creature Portal: Leprechauns! Because little green men rules! You may laugh at them but try to laugh again when I beat you up with them. Well, more seriously I would take Water Elementals most of the time. Sometimes Mantises, Waspworts, Air or Fire Elementals.

Stronghold
Second Level Dwelling: Harpies as their growth and special is better than of Nomads. But if I have trouble getting Citadel I might consider Nomads which propably means that I will take Behemoths also.
Third Level Dwelling: This is really a non-brainer, Cyclops because they are everything what Ogre Magi aren't: Effective, devastative, magnificent, excellent, great, super and cool. They are possibly the only thing that will save your barbarians' necks from nasty spells of the opponent's grim spellcaster.
Fourth Level Dwelling: Thunderbirds because of their awesome special. If I have trouble getting Castle I will take Behemoths instead. Considering that Breeding Pens will change the growth rate of Behemoths and Thunderbirds to 3 and 5, will make Thunderbirds again most obvious choice. Besides you can have good barbeques with Thunderbirds.

Asylum
Second Level Dwelling: Medusa unless I somehow know that my opponent is Death.
Third Level Dwelling: Nightmares as I've always preferred black stallions with flaming mane over normal steads. And their Terror ability makes them a too-good-not-to-be-splitted units. If I really am in a proper mood, when I enjoy seeing red men who look like they have just been beaten to be beated, I will take Efreeti.  
Fourth Level Dwelling: Hydra. Mainly because I like to teach people why Black Dragons aren't so superior after all. I will take Black Dragons sometimes and especially when I'm facing Order with its too good to be true spells. Chaos has good probabilities to get either (Mass) Speed or (Mass) Haste. And as I usually prefer to take Necromancers, the Death Knights will give a nice speed boost to our slow Hydras. Cast Vampiric Touch on the Hydras and listen spooky sounds your opponent is letting out from his mouth in his agony.

Academy
Second Level Dwelling: While Mage has nice spells but are destined to be dead and fragile, Gold Golem is tough but not tough enough to be my favourite, besides Gold Golems are slow. So I take either this or that when I feel so.
Third Level Dwelling: Genies, unless I have nice Tactics hero with his GM Tactics, Offense and Defense, where I may consider taking Nagas. Spells of Genies are just too good to be left for those lowly Wizards in their mumbo-jumbo towers. Create Illusion, Song of Peace, Slow and Ice Bolt will make your opponent wish that he would have never been born to this planet to lose against you in a Heroes 4 game.
Fourth Level Dwelling: Dragon Golems as I have always been a fan of high-tech. It is a shame that they didn't included Mech Town in Heroes 1 & 2 & 3 & 4. Castle is just too much of requirement for Titan Dwelling. Unless I'm feeling silly and little fuzzy I will never take them.

Necropolis
Second Level Dwelling: While I have been really amused of the nice animation and laughter that gives shivers, I rather have hot dogs as they are the way to go. I've taught my Vampires to suck dog's blood. Which means that it is easier to get Cerberi than Ghosts, which in turn is vital to getting Vampires early on.
Third Level Dwelling: Unless the statistics of the Vampires are going to be reduced, I will always have them in more serious games. It is really a shame that Vampires are so good as I've come to appreciate the nice greenish appearance of Venom Spawns in the battlefield. Just couple of those blood suckers can clean an area out of first and second level creatures that can be drained. 30 Attack and Defense is too much!
Fourth Level Dwelling: It is funny that the creatures I like less are better in Necropolis. So I'm going to use Devils to kill my opponents' spell casters in the first round. Nice way to do this is to wait with them and allow opposite Wizard to cast Hypnotize on them and to slaughter your own Necromancer. Other way to go is to attack opposite Wizard right away and to see as he raises back from the dead via Potion of Immortality. But at least you have brought yourself a free round from opponent's nasty spells as he has to drink another potion, right? Indeed, but he casts Berserk on your Necromancer and for your delight the Necromancer takes a firm attack against your own Vampires leaving a nice pile of bones to the ground adding some beauty on the battleground. Meanwhile, opposite army makes Devils wish that they would have never come from their warm, modern and luxurous pits to take such teeth dropping. So divide them at least into two stacks.
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