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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted January 12, 2006 03:58 PM |
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Iīm pretty sure many new players now know how to do full crypts day 1, especially with castle.
Itīs still fact, Jebus template is played very often and most players chose Castle. Chaining tactic seem to change at the end of the first week though. For the matter of fact, Jebus is a very rich template, u will find "smaller" fights everywhere in your area, which can be done with week 1 army excluding the angel. Thatīs why i think itīs a good idea to "split" your heroes in 2 or 3 teams at the time u have built your portal of glory (normaly day 5). 1 of these teams should run around with that 1 angel and try to do many fights for money, to be able to upgrade your angels as soon as possible in week 2. Crypts of course help a lot here, so do smaller treasuries and stores.
However, some people seem to have problems taking a full crypt with only that 1 angel, especially if they have to do the fight with a magic hero, who has zero on attack and defense, no offense or armorer and also no good spell to cast (or no spellpoints left...).
The reason why those fights are getting close for them, is obvious....they attack the vampires in round 1...and i wouldnīt do that! What u have to prevent, is a "double-attack" in one round, means, getting hit by 2 different stacks. But this will happen in round 2 or 3 (sometimes later), when the vampires and the wights are too close to each other.
Thatīs why i would suggest to attack the wights in round 1! Normaly they die by retail after their attack, if it runs bad, 1 wight is left over. In round 2, you attack the skeletons (at least 15 of them die) and kill them off by retail. Your angel has suffered about 30 hitpoints damage till now, and u only have the vamps and the walking undead left (and perhaps the single wight). Now it should be easy for all players to survive that fight.
This is not meant to be for experienced players, but for those who have these problems and were scared to enter coz they thought (or even did in former games) they could lose their angel.
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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grendal
Adventuring Hero
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posted January 12, 2006 07:27 PM |
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Its important i think to uncover the area as quickly as possible. Sometimes there is an angel dwelling in your area and if it is uncovered soon enough you can plan on taking it with that 1 angel and week 1 army (it cant always be done but often it can be). Otherwise i like setting up a chain to hit as many crypts as possible on my way to getting the gold mines.
Crypts really are easy to take with one angel. Even the weakest hero shouldnt have a problem taking them. Angels have such great range it shouldnt even be a problem if you attack vamps first 2 rounds (i dont though). I attack the wraiths first. (also with 5 champs i do same way). Then i get 2 hits on the vamps. With champs (or cavs) the vamps die on that second hit. With angels if the vamps dont die then i just fly around until i can hit the vamps again without the skels or walking dead reach me.
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Life is full of frustrations, heroes should help release it!
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted February 10, 2006 06:17 PM |
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After the "250 magogs vs 1 angel" tactic, i wanna show another tactic, which has a similar strategy.
I guess nearly everyone knows about the "Hydra trick" on 100%. But this can be used on higher difficulties aswell with a small trick.
The case i will show here is similar to one i had in a game vs gagarin about 2 months ago.
We played a game on Extreme 2 template, i had fortress. My main (Alkin) did some fights with his chaos and ran out his follow up guy. I saw the tome of earth, guarded by throng of mighty gorgons. I only had 7 Chaos and no mass slow. Only some level 1 and level 2 spells. Also the spirit of oppression was present.
Would u attack? If u know about that hydratrick, u would. But how to do that on 130%?
Here is the start of the battle:
Iīm not sure which week it was in the real game, but afaik, stats were about the same.
The trick now is, to prevent the stacks from attacking me. How to do? Just blind 1 stack and place your Chaos besides this stack. Now, none of the other stacks will attack you, coz the blinded stack would recieve damage by retail, and that is what the AI always wants to prevent.
So u wait on your turn besides the blinded stack, then attack (at the beginning, u will be able to hit 2 units at once a few times, later on the AI places them better) and then go back besides the blinded stack again. Bless helps a lot, if your spellpower isnīt that high. When the blind is over, blind a stack with only 10 moos, so u can be sure to kill it, when all others are dead. A 25 stack could prolly kill ya 1 or 2 Chaos with deathstare.
For the matter of fact, my spellpower wasnīt that high, i ran out of spellpoints at that point, but got attacked only by a stack of 3 and no deathstare hit me.
And the deadly cows were all dead 
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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TNT_Addict
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Beautiful Liar
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posted February 10, 2006 06:33 PM |
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I have never seen anything like that ever!!! Really a magnificent fight it was.
I could never believe something like that is possible, but I think if some unexperienced players will try it they will probably screw up at one point and then their game is ruined...
Can you win this one without the spirit of opression?
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted February 10, 2006 06:38 PM |
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Quote:
...Can you win this one without the spirit of opression?
Yes u can, the only dangerous moment is round 1, where u have to wait with your Chaos, and all 6 stacks move first. If one of them gets moral, u could prolly loose 2 or even 3 Chaos. After that, the spirit of oppression isnīt important anymore, coz no stack attacks you, they all will take defense stand or move away..
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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tigris
Supreme Hero
Supreme Noobolator
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posted February 10, 2006 10:48 PM |
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Quote:
How to do? Just blind 1 stack and place your Chaos besides this stack. Now, none of the other stacks will attack you, coz the blinded stack would recieve damage by retail, and that is what the AI always wants to prevent.
this is correct.I have noticed this myself in my games.AI is a sucker for blind.
Quote:
So u wait.... (at the beginning, u will be able to hit 2 units at once a few times, ..)
Does this works only round 2 when attacking with hidras or does it works even after this?
congrats for this tip dirk !
damn this was worth intrerupt my dream weekend and i swear as soon as i get near a computer that has heroes installed i will try it too! someone give the foo a qp!
heehe donuts and qp's does not mix lol, anyways nice one man!
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maretti
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted February 10, 2006 11:04 PM |
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Nice trick angelfoo, didnt know about this.
These caos hydras are very nice on extreme 2. Kru can witness how difficult it is to face 36 in main battle. 
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Crag rules, Orrin and Ivor suck
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Xarfax111
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
The last hero standing
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posted February 10, 2006 11:38 PM |
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..nice trick angelito .
So i gonna add smthn that most players (maybe all) dont know.
If u do it right uve a 100% chance to get earth. Means: If u want u can get earth every time.
Its pretty simple: Take a might here which cant get all 4 Magic Schools. During the skilling always accept an offered magic school.
Background: A might hero gets always offered a magic school as third time. After that he gets offered a magic school every 6 time, so u get offered Earth with level 17 at the latest!
Most made fault is not to take Water with a Fortress Might. Water has highest possibility and will be most likely be offered again. Second fault is to take a Knight or an Alchemist...as they can get all 4 Magic School with high possibility in Air and Water you would be offerd Earth at level 23...with 2 Skills given and the last 2 Skills are only upgrades, you wont get Earth (24 Skills -2 -2 = Level20).
Xarfax1
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grendal
Adventuring Hero
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posted February 11, 2006 02:24 AM |
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Nice post Angelito. I never wouldve thought about doing that. I have a question though.
Does the AI refrain from using magic as well in this situation?
I rescently replayed the campaigns and had a similar situation. It was the scenerio with dracon and i was clearing the land of fairie dragons. I blinded one stack and attacked the stack adjacent to it. The next turn, one of the stacks cast lightening bolt and it "unblinded" the stack.
Was this just a random choice of spells or did the AI choose to use it in order to unblind its stack? Maybe if the AI had meteor shower in your scenerio, it would have used it. Just curious here
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Life is full of frustrations, heroes should help release it!
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LKru33
Promising
Famous Hero
3x NFL Pick'em Champ
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posted February 14, 2006 01:21 AM |
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Great tactic Dirkster!! I will have to practice this myself. Really cool what you can do with so little. Normally I wouldn't even attempt this battle with 1/2 the Mighty Moo's shown. Thanks for sharing with the rest of us!
Quote:
Nice trick angelfoo, didnt know about this.
These caos hydras are very nice on extreme 2. Kru can witness how difficult it is to face 36 in main battle.
Yeah, thanks alot for bringing that nightmare back up Fooster 
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GabyStan
Known Hero
Seeking Wisdom
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posted February 15, 2006 08:49 PM |
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So I reckon this trick should work against everything slower that the Hydras/Chaos Hydras, except unretaliation troops (i.e. Nagas).
Very nice, Angel, and thanks again for sharing a real good trick with us, more or less foos.
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Your worst enemy is... yourself.
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Binabik
Responsible
Legendary Hero
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posted February 17, 2006 12:24 PM |
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Quote:
Does the AI refrain from using magic as well in this situation?
Magic can change things. But even without magic, the hydra trick doesn't always work when the AI has a hero. It's more predictable with wondering creatures. If the AI has a hero, it usually still works, but it's a little more risk.
The AI seems to place a value on the hero. With wondering stacks, the AI places heavy weight on not losing creatures. When there is a hero, it seems to place more weight on winning the fight and less weight on creature preservation.
Quote:
So I reckon this trick should work against everything slower that the Hydras
I haven't tested it, but I don't think they would necessarily have to be slower. The AI isn't very good at using wait. If you had the hydra next to a blinded stack, the AI might defend with the faster units instead of waiting and attacking after you move.
Without a blinded stack, the AI will definately attack, but you might be able to avoid a gang attack. Always attack the last stack to move. In the next round the first units to move might defend and only that last stack attacks. Again, I haven't tested this.
You could look at it this way. The reason it works with a blinded stack is because it's the last stack to move....not because it's blind. Being blind only prevents that stack from attacking, but it's not the reason the other stacks don't attack.
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GabyStan
Known Hero
Seeking Wisdom
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posted February 17, 2006 11:20 PM |
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Hm, so that blinded stack is considered by stupid AI as last to move, interesting... Then it should really work no matter what. Only danger is that you have to get in reach of that blinded stack, which is sometimes tricky, but to attract the faster creature stack with some fodder round 1 is a good idea. So, I can't wait to try it. 
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Your worst enemy is... yourself.
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Binabik
Responsible
Legendary Hero
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posted February 17, 2006 11:47 PM |
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It's not so much that the AI considers the blind stack to be the last to move. But it has the same effect. All other stacks move before the stack the hydra is next to. Blind is better than simply attacking the last stack because it keeps that last stack from attacking as well.
Also, this same tactic should work with psychic/magic elementals. The AI doesn't like doing things that will kill it's own units.
For some reason this doesn't apply as much to dragons. It's common for the AI to kill it's own units with overspray.....which comes in handy when taking utopias.
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Zsa
Famous Hero
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posted March 19, 2006 08:25 PM |
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Edited by Zsa on 19 Mar 2006
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Adding to this great thread
What I find extremely important in a game of heroes is the surprise element:
This allows you to win games where your opponent is stronger than you, if you have surprise on your side.
There's some strategies to use and pitfalls to avoid for this to be succesfull and it unfortunatelly doesn't work every game.
1. Make the most of the underground entrance.
If i know that the underground breaks into my opponent's territory, I will not break the mosnter stack guarding my opponents territory. I kill the stack on my side, go on the underground, and press space quickly so my opponent doesn't see me. Then I WAIT there with the hero for the rest of the day, EVEN if he has some movment points left. Why? The surprise element . I might even be able to take his castle next day with full movement points and no losses, or catch his hero without his army further down the road.
Sitting on the underground entrance. If i know my opponent will come in the underground through that entrance, sit on the underground and allow him to clear the stack on his side. Why? Because most people will clear a stronger stack like this with his main hero, and good players will almost never take all the units with them to avoid losses. And most of the time, after your opponent has cleared the ug entrance, they will just walk on it without all of his army.
2. Scout wars - allowing your opponent to scout your territory is bad play. Almost always, you should try and kill the opponent's scouts as fast as possible, do not allow yourself to be discovered
3. Patience is a virtue. One game I stayed on the ug entrance two days. Why? Because I saw my opponent break into a part of my underground through another entrance. I know that he can't gain much from the territory, so I allowed him to fan out with his scouts and his main hero.
4. Scout the map as far as possible, if your opponent comes from one of those places, you can attack him by surprise
5. Bait area - If you know there's a good chance your opponent might appear in that area, and it contains some nice things in it, but nothing game breaking or too important, DO NOT CLEAN that area. Allow your opponent to come on it and start cleaning. Chances are you will catch him with your pants down.
6. Misleading your opponent with the size of the stack. I lost a game to this once. Both me and my opponent had almost no army left from the battles. I saw him advancing down the road with 7 stacks of few silver pegasi, and I thought that I can attack and make him surrender, after that take my secondary castle back and kill his scouts in the area.
Turns our he had 7 groups of 4 silver pegasi unlike the usually expected 7 groups of 1, and that was my undoing.
7. If you know a game breaking spell will not help you win or gain a significant advantage in a battle, do not use it (if you have alternatives).
8. Avoid leaving any ugs or teleporters around your area or your hero unexplored. The first thing i do when i see a teleporter or such, I always explore it first, don't allow your opponent to catch you unprepared or with your army at a sec hero.
9. Try and always scout ahead - this might not always be possible, but if you feel your opponent is pulling a fast one on you, scout, or keep your army together.
This way, you won't have to come up with lame excuses like my opponent got lucky and such. There is little luck involved in this (save for the portal placed next to your casle guarded by strong monsters).
This is not about luck most of the time. Luck is getting good relics at a tope while your opponent gets sh!t. This is about playing the game smarter than your opponent.
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"You sound like zsa who only plays the game on forums" - Russ
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted March 19, 2006 11:57 PM |
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How to fight with 1 Angel vs 250 magogs
As promised before, i copied the "1 angel vs 250 magogs" tactic from the Efreet sultans thread and paste it here into the Homm3 tactic thread:
For those of you who tried it and failed so far, here some hints:
- Cast shield first round to recieve less damage
- Always place your angel between 2 stacks. If u only have 1 stack "touching" your angel, it will move away and all others will shoot at you.
- When placed between 2 stacks, always attack the lower stack of magogs. Why? Simple...coz that way, u decimate both stacks at the same speed. You attack the lower one, and u retail to the attack of the top one.
-If both stacks are down to 10-20, fly your angel between the next 2 stacks.
- Cast cure early enough, coz when u r down to about 50 hitpoints, u will get attacked by range, coz they will be able to kill u with one shot.
- When all stacks are down to 10-20, start again from bottom to the top. Only attack once and give one retail, coz then the magogs are down to 4-7 each, which would be too low to survive an additional hit.
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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Zsa
Famous Hero
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posted March 21, 2006 12:30 AM |
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give yourself a qp angelito, that's pretty cool
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"You sound like zsa who only plays the game on forums" - Russ
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hacici
Tavern Dweller
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posted March 21, 2006 02:24 AM |
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Zsa
Famous Hero
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posted March 21, 2006 08:49 AM |
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Just...one...step
Some more thoughts
I played a game on balance today, Large no under, me tower vs opp stronghold - dbl build allowed.
I got gurnisson as main, opponent gets gundula. We're well into week 4 and gundula's stats are fairly close to gurnissons. I knew that I didn't have much chance if he doulbe built his stronghold towns (which he did) - knowing that he has expt haste (found hut on his inferno territorry with air).
I saw his hero prancing around with 2 groups of few angels, and because I saw that you need necklace of swiftness at a seer's hut I thought, this is my chance. I desperately cleaned the desert area in the hopes of finding the necklace and I eventually found it.
The point of this story is, just before the break into his territory, I chose to not follow my own advice - that is, sitting next to the break (lots of champions). I decided to go replenish the mana to the hero at a well - had half the mana.
After I broke through, I stopped 1 square shy of Gundula just with the Angels on her (like expected). That 1 square was the difference between me losing and winning the game.
Morale of the story:
1) I didn't use properly the element of surprise I had
2) I didn't lose because my opponent was lucky, I lost because I was dumb .
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"You sound like zsa who only plays the game on forums" - Russ
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted April 09, 2006 02:39 PM |
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Your situation was for sure on 100% difficulty (or even lower). Magic-elementals act the same as hydras. If u try it again on 130% or higher, u will see, some stacks of griffins will fly away from your Elementals instead of waiting or taking defense stand.
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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