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Heroes Community > Heroes 3.5 - WoG and Beyond > Thread: Possible Creature
Thread: Possible Creature [ This thread is 246 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 (235) 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 ]
Salamandre
Salamandre


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted September 10, 2011 07:27 AM
Edited by Salamandre at 07:28, 10 Sep 2011.

More from Astaroth (to use with !!UN:W):






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Salamandre
Salamandre


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted September 11, 2011 09:17 AM

Anyone knows how to avoid DefTOOL common palette? If I use a single picture, all ok, if several, the common palette will screw all.

Before and after:


Preparing the bmp one by one gives good results, and then they go in deftool already color indexed. But then DT does the palette conversion once more, game over.
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Neraus
Neraus


Known Hero
Servant of the Cross
posted September 11, 2011 09:48 AM
Edited by Neraus at 09:49, 11 Sep 2011.

As far as I know, there isn't a way, but i don't have problems like that, or I don't see them?
Anyway just to be curious what is that for?
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JimV
JimV


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted September 11, 2011 11:14 AM

When I have had problems, I first create a common palette myself for all the frames of the DEF, then redo the frames using that palette.  I use GIMP, so I take samples of all the bmp colors and paste them into an RGB image, then convert that image to indexed to get the palette.  Then I paste the old bmp's onto that image and "Save As".  The second part could be scripted if I ever learn the GIMP scripting process.

I think this is the best that can be done - the stored images are going to be indexed with 256 colors, so if you need 300 colors to do all your shadings you are bound to be disappointed.

GIMP has the option to use "dithering" (mixing dots of different colors to approximate shades which are not in the palette, when converting from RGB to indexed).  This helps some.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted September 11, 2011 11:21 AM

I already tried that, opened all pics in Image ready, added each one palette to master palette, then index all using this saved palette in Photoshop. The result is 100% the same as when using Def Tool, they are screwed. I don't know how to modify a master palette, to remove the >256 colors without altering important colors.
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JimV
JimV


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted September 11, 2011 11:41 AM

If I understand what you did, it is not the same thing as what I (sometimes) do.  It sounds like you create a master palette of greater than 256 colors.  I create a palette of no more than 256 colors (or 224 if it is the type of image which uses the last colors as player colors or for animation) by manually picking samples from the original images which have colors which I want to preserve.  It is a manual, trial and error process, but since beauty is in the eye of the beholder, I doubt if even Grayface has a way to automate this - although I think dithering might improve your "after" picture.

(No doubt current game programs store images in RGB since the limitation on memory size has increased a lot since Heroes III was written.)

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted September 11, 2011 11:47 AM

I did it both ways, create master palette from original images (>256) and create master palette from indexed images (256) but correct displayed (used Photohop). Can't make it work.
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JimV
JimV


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted September 11, 2011 12:15 PM
Edited by JimV at 22:54, 12 Sep 2011.

Quote:
I did it both ways, create master palette from original images (>256) and create master palette from indexed images (256) but correct displayed (used Photohop).


I'll stop repeating myself here, but I used samples of RGB images pasted into an RGB image, then converted it to indexed/256-colors to create my palette.  That might not make much difference, but in any case, that, plus dithering, is the best that can be done because Heroes III stores all DEF frames as indexed pictures with a common palette of 256 colors (according to Grayface's Help notes).  (I think he also says there is a maximum of about 50 different palettes that can be stored, and to contact him if a special custom palette is required.)

Also, you might try making a 224-color custom palette, since the last 32 sometimes get modified in the game.  You could check which colors seem to be messed up and where they are in the palette to see if this is the case - but I don't know if this applies to creature DEF's.  (It does apply to terrain tiles and rivers, as well as to PCX pictures.)

Update:  I remembered seeing something at Grayface's website which might be relevant:
------------------------------------
From Grayface's website:

Def Tool v2.1.1  [DefTool2]

Old version of Def Tool. Combine and Split buttons can be useful. It can help you prepare palettes for def cadres with better quality.
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From the Help for DefTool2:

3)   Use "Combine" to convert all the sprites to 256 colors with the best quality. It will make a large picture with standard colors at the end.

Attention! Don't close the program after you've combined pictures. "Split" won't work otherwise.

4)   Use "Split" to split the combined picture into sprites again. It will also put the standard colors at the beginning of the palette.
-------------------------------

It sounds like an automated version of what I do manually, but maybe its algorithm for picking the "best" colors is better.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted September 11, 2011 01:54 PM

Pasting rgb images in a master rgb image, then indexing + create master palette is exactly same as creating a master palette from x rgb images then index to 256 colors, which I did. Somehow one of the images breaks the limit and changes others.
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Kivo
Kivo


Famous Hero
posted September 24, 2011 05:56 AM

Here's another creature I did in the style of homm2 . This time a centaur and its upgrade Centaur Marauder. I also did a Ghost and a Spectre which i'll upload soon! Check my gallery to see more.

http://melindar.deviantart.com/#/d4ar4u1

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Hobbit
Hobbit


Supreme Hero
subiroK ot għicosutak
posted September 24, 2011 07:25 AM

Nice. Are you going to make playable animation?

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Kivo
Kivo


Famous Hero
posted September 24, 2011 07:27 AM

Quote:
Nice. Are you going to make playable animation?


I dont really know how to do that sorry :/ Im only 13 and I dont know how to do that stuff. But feel free to mod them coz if u want i can upload them in the original size

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Kivo
Kivo


Famous Hero
posted September 24, 2011 08:29 AM

Before and now Titan! Hope you like the moded one on the right!

http://melindar.deviantart.com/#/d4aree8

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Gorgon
Gorgon

Tavern Dweller
posted September 24, 2011 05:03 PM

My Goal is too have skeleton  warriors to shoot . I copy and paste Under "Add shooting ability" adding 57 (skel war # ) in script that part was fine . I downloaded Def tool , and read posts on how to use ,
there are 57 pictures of skeleton war in file do i add " shoot up.. shoot straight..shoot down" to each of the pictures? or just to one picture ?
After that what do i do with it ?
if anyone has a map with that in it i can copy?
or if easy  for some one to make and e-mail to me and tell me where to put it works too ?

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Kivo
Kivo


Famous Hero
posted September 25, 2011 06:55 AM
Edited by Kivo at 07:53, 25 Sep 2011.

Thi is another creature ( with upgrade ) I did. A Lizardman with Lizardman Chieftain. Hopefully Mister_Kalu will like my version better than his

http://melindar.deviantart.com/#/d4av6pr

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted September 25, 2011 07:01 AM

because of copy right I drawn two lines so noone will try to copy or use my mods

Excellent, so we see sh#t. You should be happy if someone is using them, anyway zero chances that happens, if tags remain on.
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Kivo
Kivo


Famous Hero
posted September 25, 2011 07:12 AM
Edited by Kivo at 07:34, 25 Sep 2011.

Quote:
because of copy right I drawn two lines so noone will try to copy or use my mods

Excellent, so we see sh#t. You should be happy if someone is using them, anyway zero chances that happens, if tags remain on.


Well if anyone wants to use my creature then feel free to ask me first and I will send you a link without the tag. Don't get all angry about it. Anyway they are not uploaded in the original size, thats why I want people to ask me first, if they want to use it.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok, uploaded it without the tag but still you need to ask me first if you want to use it as its not in the original size, so if you'll try to make it smaller it will go all blurry.

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itsjustme
itsjustme


Promising
Known Hero
posted September 25, 2011 07:33 AM

Quote:
if anyone wants to use my creature


Your creature? Where we can see your creature? By your link we can see only one picture. But creature for Heroes 3 should have 30 or more pictures for all animations. I don't know crazy modders who want to use only one picture per creature.

Have you whole animations? Portraits? Adventure map sprites?

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Kivo
Kivo


Famous Hero
posted September 25, 2011 07:38 AM

Quote:
Quote:
if anyone wants to use my creature


Your creature? Where we can see your creature? By your link we can see only one picture. But creature for Heroes 3 should have 30 or more pictures for all animations. I don't know crazy modders who want to use only one picture per creature.

Have you whole animations? Portraits? Adventure map sprites?


Well Mister_Kalu asked me if I can work for his project heroes 2/ heroes 3 mod. So I need your opinion guys about the creature as I dont know what things I should change to make it better. So if you think it looks bad and i should change something, after your thoughts I will start with the animations.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted September 25, 2011 07:42 AM

I don't like the two big red lines over it
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