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| Thread: In-depth Acadmy review |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted January 31, 2007 01:29 PM |
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Haha!  Irina is my favourite but I also like Maeve. Haven has some interesting heroes.
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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86wyp
Adventuring Hero
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posted February 02, 2007 08:01 AM |
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Edited by 86wyp at 08:02, 02 Feb 2007.
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Doomforge I don't feel offended, I feel regret. But I don't want to waste any more time on you anyway.
Towerlord I got something for you. I didn't have time to play h5 recently, but I sent the maps to other players on the Chinese forums, and one of them tested BattleforHonor already. I think maybe we will have matches on that map in the future.
Just some screenshots here, this is what can a player who knows how to play academy do on BattleforHonor.
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TowerLord
Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
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posted February 02, 2007 09:23 AM |
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good playing 86wyp, very impressive ! The record breaking at toh , is week 2 day 4 . We get to level 12 in day 7 , with any town, but we play on hard difficulty (we consider hard the best difficulty to play)...
The question I want to ask you is : do you think after breaking the guards so fast you'll have enough troops to defeat your opponent ? I don't know what you built in your town, but by that time i have fully built one of my towns and the other town as you know has lvl 1,2 prebuilt, so plenty of troops to counter your rush.
Anyway you are trully a great creeper ! I hope you(and other chinese) can join us at toh and we'll all improve our playing !
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted February 02, 2007 09:25 AM |
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Sure.. you get phoenix *every game* (sigh..).
Sure that looks good, still, any necro could do similiar things anyway, and he gets summoning in the guild too, so he can head for phoenix aswell. Oh, even dungeon heroes got summoning, and they do lvl5 guild fast anyway.
The point is not to show uber-creepkills (wanna see some mine? Equally impressive, I'd say.. ~~), but the battle with the other player itself, who will kill your uber phoenix in one turn and lay a massive attack on your tiny force. You don't even have logistics to run away from him.. or to catch him running. aww.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted February 02, 2007 09:50 AM |
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Let me guess, he got resurrection as well! And used it to replenish the phoenix's hp when it was about to die. Still when creeping with such a little army is light that useful? I see the results but I wonder how much easier it would be with dark or summoning, unless no good spells had appeared. Does your friend remember the selection of spells he got? I think that with arcane armour and holy word he'd be in a really tight spot.
I also suspect that consume artifact should be very helpful in a rush as well just taking 25% of the hero's turn but I haven't tested it.
@Doomforge
A necro and a warlock can't possibly rely on a phoenix due to low mana reseves both for intensive creeping AND casting it more than one times in the final battle. Also they can't tackle any kind of neutrals as academy can this way. And about the equally impressive creeping part I hope you aren't referring to Deleb!  And I don't think that a wizard really needs logistics with MMR though it CAN be hit&miss sometimes.
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted February 02, 2007 10:07 AM |
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Quote:
A necro and a warlock can't possibly rely on a phoenix due to low mana reseves both for intensive creeping AND casting it more than one times in the final battle.
But they don't need it as badly as academy in creeping, and it can surely help when they want to kill some titans too.
86wyp seems to try to tell me I'm a loser not using his uber strategy, but I guess once he goes into some serious tournaments (I know there ain't none ~~) and get unholy word, word of light and arcane armor, he gets thrashed without any effort. His strategy is impressive while you're lucky, but it's a coin toss. If you're not (say, no wasp swarm, no offensive spells, no phoenix, no puppet master), you already lost. A strategy that is uber powerful 50% of the time and totally useless the other 50% of the games isn't worth that much to me anyway.
Quote:
Also they can't tackle any kind of neutrals as academy can this way. And about the equally impressive creeping part I hope you aren't referring to Deleb! And I don't think that a wizard really needs logistics with MMR though it CAN be hit&miss sometimes.
Not only. Deleb is the prime killer, but all 2.0 necros could also kill whatever they wanted without any effort, faster and cheaper than academy, with 1k skeletons, vamplords and dark magic only. I also had Irina kill 40 titans with no loses aswell. It took me 6 weeks to do so (needed decent army), though, while the MMR player could do it in second, third week. So, yes, MMR is really good creeping power with the right spells, but most of other factions can handle the creeps very good aswell, just a bit slower and they are not dependant so much on spells they get in the guild. Rushes are also less dangerous to them, which 86wyp playing mostrously big maps will probably never realize. Too bad for him. He wouldn't be so confident after being rushed several times against a good opponent on a small map.  Well, if his opponents let him go for a creeping spree around the map, get all mines and reach LVL 25, it's their own fault.
What's the point of taking your hero so far away if you can't defend your castle? He creeps the titans on the other side of the map, I come, take all his mines and his castle aswell, and even if he comes back, with my expert logistics he'll never catch me. And once he goes away, the raid heroes will return. No mini-arties this time, huh? ~~
Everyone can build uber-army and go for a single endgame battle.. But what about rushes, raiding, and so on? Seems a long forgotten heroes3 myth to most of heroes5 players, I see.
One thing to add about creeping: Get a ONE powerful stack as a necro, cast mark of the necromancer on it and go after a powerful creep. You lose a lot, which regains your mana over and over, so you keep spamming raise dead and in the end you lose nothing. Easy. Can be extended to a point of being cheesy with expert summoning+master of life and expert sorcery+arcane training. Especially good in 2.0 with legion of skeleton archers, but with all those easy-to-get wights in 2.1 it can turn out to be good too. All magical factions have cheesy magical creepkillers, too bad 86wyp discovered just a single one and forgets that there may be others aswell.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted February 02, 2007 10:24 AM |
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Quote:
86wyp seems to try to tell me I'm a loser not using his uber strategy, but I guess once he goes into some serious tournaments (I know there ain't none ~~) and get unholy word, word of light and arcane armor, he gets thrashed without any effort. His strategy is impressive while you're lucky, but it's a coin toss. If you're not (say, no wasp swarm, no offensive spells, no phoenix, no puppet master), you already lost. A strategy that is uber powerful 50% of the time and totally useless the other 50% of the games isn't worth that much to me anyway.
Not only. Deleb is the prime killer, but all 2.0 necros could also kill whatever they wanted without any effort, faster and cheaper than academy, with 1k skeletons, vamplords and dark magic only.
Not exactly 50-50 since you get the library it's rare to get really crappy spells. And you won't ever get 1k skeletons with the new necromancy, not until a lot later anyway. Otherwise I agree with everything else you have said. Alright maybe not so much about taking summoning with a warlock! But since I haven't tried it I may be missing something.
As for me I generally don't like taking unnecessary risks in a strategy though at times I have a suicidal nature hehe! It's the excitement and the possibility of a good reward that makes me try it. But at the time I'm trying to change it so it can be used in larger maps. So that academy still has a good creeping but has enough army forces later and adequate protection just because I love games that drag on. Not to the point you'll have 20 titans as by then you'll be creamed by a powerful haven but you get the idea.
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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sq79
Famous Hero
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posted February 02, 2007 10:59 AM |
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Wow 86wyp, very impressive posting i see.
I wasn't an academy fan previously but its nice to see this post. : Level 14 in week 1 is very impressive. But I was wondering if u can do this every time in this map ? What u get in mage vault is very important. And with the mmr stragety you mentioned, What happens if u get word of light, arcane armour and curse of netherworld
Phoenix killing the titans and devils is pretty commonly used tactic to break thru. But in week 4 day 1 , most other factions will clear entire map and break thru.
I meant the chance is low to be that unlucky, but things like this happens
With the way you clear map as well... it seems u have developed a good secondary hero as well ?
Btw.. I am a chinese too, but am from singapore, was wondering where can i play you guys ? I speak and understand chinese, but can't type them in my computer.
Also encourage you to join toh
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86wyp
Adventuring Hero
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posted February 02, 2007 11:12 AM |
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Ha Elvin hope you can improve this strategy soon, that is what I am always expecting.
To Towerlord. week 2 day 4 is just great. I hope some chinese will come after chinese new year(coz we are very busy now before new year). For me, I do not play homm5 anymore(I've got something more interesting to do). But don't worry there are tons of chinese players who are better than me, and I am encouraging them to come. I know the leaders of the chinese forums, both of them can speak english. So if you guys are interested, feel free to come to our forums and arrange matches with them.
http://gamebbs.enet.com.cn/forum-96-1.html
http://www.gamerhome.net/bbs/forumdisplay.php?fid=127
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TowerLord
Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
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posted February 02, 2007 12:13 PM |
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ruozui , indeed fire trap is great killer for walkers, and flyers even. and you are right about the mage vault which gives you important magic, but it cant give you both summoning and light ... only one of them. Anyway I agree the lvl 5 spells will be no problem do to that fact.
my question to you is ... how does academy do when facing a ranger or a knight with a big army . you'll have a big army too probably, but being a ranger or a knight makes the troops much more powerfull than the ones from wizard !
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86wyp
Adventuring Hero
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posted February 02, 2007 12:44 PM |
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Hey towerlord, if we are going to have matches, how do we do that? Do you use softwares like hamachi or vnn for mp games?
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TowerLord
Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
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posted February 02, 2007 12:55 PM |
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Hamachi all the way ... it even works better than the ubi place of meeting
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86wyp
Adventuring Hero
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posted February 02, 2007 12:56 PM |
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Quote:
Hamachi all the way ... it even works better than the ubi place of meeting
That's cool! Then I think we will have games very soon. Tell the players you know and let them come to play with us.
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dschingi
Famous Hero
the guy with the dragon golem
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posted February 02, 2007 01:54 PM |
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Edited by dschingi at 13:56, 02 Feb 2007.
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Quote:
So if you guys are interested, feel free to come to our forums and arrange matches with them.
http://gamebbs.enet.com.cn/forum-96-1.html
http://www.gamerhome.net/bbs/forumdisplay.php?fid=127
Well it's kinda hard to post there if you don't speak Chinese
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open source for an open mind
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86wyp
Adventuring Hero
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posted February 02, 2007 02:05 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
So if you guys are interested, feel free to come to our forums and arrange matches with them.
http://gamebbs.enet.com.cn/forum-96-1.html
http://www.gamerhome.net/bbs/forumdisplay.php?fid=127
Well it's kinda hard to post there if you don't speak Chinese
I forgot. You will have to register before posting anything, so... if you really have something to say I can help with that...
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Fortress_fan
Disgraceful
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posted February 02, 2007 03:16 PM |
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The best thing with mr. Falcon is that he his full of B*llsh*t!
Mr. Falcon, you are still cheating way too much to fool any experienced player.
I am rude? Look at this:
Quote:
Why would not 6 black dragons kill more than one Gargoyle if attacking? And because they are immune to magic, you only have Gremlins and Gargoyles to attack them with. Not MMR! And 6 black dragons can easily crush a hundred gremlins.
What is the answer of all these questions? MR. FALCON HAS EDITED THE SCREENSHOT! Period.
Mr. Falcon, you are rude to the newbie’s who look at this and think that it works. I suspect you are some bad-mannered student from some college in England or America who want’s to have fun. And because you where so exited you forgot to hide your email adress!
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Shauku83
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted February 02, 2007 03:24 PM |
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In case you have never played Heroes Fortress_Fan, I'll explain something. When there is only 1 Gargoyle in a stack, no matter if a 1000 Black Dragons attack that 1 Gargoyle, they can only kill 1 Gargoyle.
Only Gargoyles and Gremlins to attac with? Well what is that Phoenix on the screen then? The Green Dragons are not immune to Magic etc.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted February 02, 2007 03:26 PM |
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No need to be a jerk, he summoned a phoenix and the dragons then focused on it. Nothing I or many others haven't done so far.
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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gecko
Tavern Dweller
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posted February 02, 2007 05:18 PM |
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Also, for breaths reaching the gremlins: Resurrection (as long as they all don't die, since the battle would be over then). I don't use this race that often. Can gremlins reassemble the cart?
So, one Gargoyle protecting the Gremlins at a diagonal, it dies, summoned phoenix takes its place.
When I have played this race, for walkers, I take one stack of gremlins, and 5 slots with 1 Gargoyle each, and a the last slot, all the other Gargoyles, which do not enter the battle. Surround the Gremlins in a corner, and every time a Gargoyle dies, move in one of the extras. Until you run out of Gargoyles...
For shooters, leave Gremlins out of the battle, and place 5 1-stack Gargoyles in the battle, and kill all shooters with magic (before all the Gargoyles die). This sometimes works, especially if the gargoyles survive a single shot.
You end up going through a lot of Gargoyles this way, though. And if you have only one town, and no other way to get high level spells, you could be out of luck later on with more difficult guards.
I tried the MMR strategy once, single player, small map, with an enemy on two sides. Problem was, every time my hero went after one player, the other would come at me from the other side, and I would have a poor defense with a low level secondary hero, and few support troops. So I never got it to work  (on Heroic). Also, with only one town, and a bad selection of spells... So, first week was easy, then I got stuck.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted February 02, 2007 05:23 PM |
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Quote:
I tried the MMR strategy once, single player, small map, with an enemy on two sides. Problem was, every time my hero went after one player, the other would come at me from the other side, and I would have a poor defense with a low level secondary hero, and few support troops. So I never got it to work (on Heroic). Also, with only one town, and a bad selection of spells... So, first week was easy, then I got stuck.
And that's the probable scenario with MMR. Even with only one enemy ~~ Creeps are stupid. Players ain't. (well, at least not all ). This strategy is IMO too random. May be fun, though.
I still think it's too harsh to call 86wyp a cheater. What he says makes perfect sense, in fact. The only thing he does wrong is just underestimating other factions, other creepkillers and other intelligent players. Well, too bad for him
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