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malax83
Famous Hero
Game ranger, HotA Player
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posted September 15, 2015 06:40 PM |
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Giant burger is also deluxe
And it s comestible. 
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted September 15, 2015 06:41 PM |
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dark-whisperer said:
Why do you act as if this is something new? We know this since preorder options were presented.
And it's still bullsnow so I shall continue to call it out as such
____________
It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that the cis are at it again.
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EnergyZ
Legendary Hero
President of MM Wiki
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posted September 15, 2015 06:42 PM |
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Edited by EnergyZ at 18:43, 15 Sep 2015.
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dark-whisperer said:
kiryu133 said:
Oh look! A CE only map!
snow off 
Why do you act as if this is something new? We know this since preorder options were presented.
Some of us hoped that they may reconsider such an option.
But hold on... can the map be shared on some map sites? Come to think of it, what was H6's bonus map?
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Marzhin
Shaper of Lore
Designer & Writer, Ubisoft
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posted September 15, 2015 06:47 PM |
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Solmyr will be available in the map editor to everyone, if mapmakers want to use him in their maps.
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dark-whisperer
Famous Hero
Darkness feels no mercy
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posted September 15, 2015 06:47 PM |
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I'm pretty sure that we will be able to download exclusive map in matter of hours. Solmyr tho is another story...
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted September 15, 2015 06:49 PM |
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None of this matter. It's still actively cutting out content from people who payed for the full game. That's just despicable.
____________
It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that the cis are at it again.
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Dies_Irae
Supreme Hero
with the perfect plan
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posted September 15, 2015 06:50 PM |
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kiryu133 said:
Oh look! A CE only map!
snow off
Now you understand why I pre-ordered it 
In H6, I have to look at a greyed-out scenario, "Heart of Nightmares"...not available because I don't own the (pre-ordered) CE. There are also two artefacts and other unique heroes (Sveltana, Kraal etc) only available in that version.
I didn't want to let that happen again...
Anyway, this looks really good  . Interesting to see he has a unique class (so it is possible after all). His specialisation, as with many others, could definately benefit from a level-up bonus.
Kiryu said:
None of this matter. It's still actively cutting out content from people who payed for the full game. That's just despicable.
That's the whole point. Without a bonus, why bother ordering the CE anyway? It has bonuses for the people who want to pay a bit more for the game. Exclusivity, luxury, not meant for the masses  ...
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted September 15, 2015 06:54 PM |
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Dies_Irae said:
I didn't want to let that happen again...
And it shouldn't.
The only pre-order bonuses should be stuff like statues and snow. Not in-game stories and maps. That's pure snowing bullsnow.
Maybe some minor aesthetic stuff like some alternate costume but absolutely nothing beyond that in-game.
____________
It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that the cis are at it again.
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Wellplay
Famous Hero
Poland Stronk
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posted September 15, 2015 06:54 PM |
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Edited by Wellplay at 18:55, 15 Sep 2015.
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kiryu133 said:
None of this matter. It's still actively cutting out content from people who payed for the full game. That's just despicable.
That's how it works in this time and age. Hopefully it will change in near future.
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted September 15, 2015 06:56 PM |
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Wellplay said:
That's how it works in this time and age. Hopefully it will change in near future.
And it won't unless we complain
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It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that the cis are at it again.
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Wellplay
Famous Hero
Poland Stronk
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posted September 15, 2015 07:07 PM |
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Edited by Wellplay at 19:09, 15 Sep 2015.
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kiryu133 said:
Wellplay said:
That's how it works in this time and age. Hopefully it will change in near future.
And it won't unless we complain
Complain will not accomplish anything without action from players.
Good example is new Batman game on PC which thanks to new function of steam players were able to get their money back. Thanks to this WB had to pull back game from digital and retail stores. Batman now is planned to be releasde on later date when it's fixed.
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Kayna
Supreme Hero
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posted September 15, 2015 07:07 PM |
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Yep, Ubiflog is like that. Other companies offer little extras when you preorder, but Ubiflog likes to punish you for not preordering. If you don't preorder, you will miss out of fun stuff in game, forever. They won't even give you the chance to buy those things later on ; they are flogging their player base in shape, making you regret not preordering until you all preorder like the little snowes you all are. From Ubisoft's point of view, I mean.
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted September 15, 2015 07:16 PM |
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Wellplay said:
Complain will not accomplish anything
Ugh, we got two units to get reworked from scratch in order to have a more decent Necro lineup, also, TotE?
And if you want, like everyone else, for the game to get better with expansions, how could it ever happen if people don't complain.
Although I agree is tiring to keep shouting into deaf ears, but at least feedback is here.
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cleglaw
Famous Hero
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posted September 15, 2015 07:31 PM |
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"cursed volcano known as Mount Iblis"
another sign for efreet (:
explanation:
1-iblis means efreet in my language.
2-volcano means lava, which efreeti dwell.
3-map is related to djinns and you know, efreets are related to djinns very closely
i wouldnt be suprised if they also feature an efreet unit in later days, if not ine xpension (:
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted September 15, 2015 07:48 PM |
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Dave_Jame said:
The factors that determined what skills you could pick in H6 were A) your faction (which chose your magic schools) and B) his focus on Might and magic.
Exactly? That IS dependancy of your class (i.e. faction and might/magic inclination)?
Dave_Jame said:
Not all heroes should have access to all skills. Not all heroes have to be usefull as main heroes.
I just plain 100 % disagree with this statement.
Dave_Jame said:
The max number of skills was always limited in one way or another based on the number of skill slots. So What that you can't have a level 100 hero now? The huge impact of the Hero is still one of the biggest problems of the game. This at least somehow limits it.
This was not something I mentioned at all in my post? What I talked about was the fact that some skills are limited only to get to next-highest level, i.e. Expert level but not Master level.
Dave_Jame said:
A) you don't have to. The random system IS in the game. And don't even think about call it just an option. (...)
B) If I vaguely remember, you were one of the very vocal people who disliked the randomness of the H5 system, but you saw what freedom does to a game. If I may quote one of my favorite critics "A game that allows, everything focuses or nothing."
The random system that is in the game but doesn't fix the issues of the system at all, it just makes it random which skills you get offered, which is not at all the point about what's missing from the previous games. The thing that made H5 system fun was that you could get all skills, but some were very common, others were very rare. This made it fun to hunt for alternative hero builts - like Inferno/Light Magic or Wizard/Logistics/Leadership (for Golems). The point here is NOT that I want just a random combination of skills, but the exact opposite: I want a very specific combination of skills, but I need to work the system in order to obtain it.
The brilliant part of H5 system was that you could work the percentages to your advantage: Pick very common skills and max them out but postpone perks in order to get double offers for new skills and increase relative chance of a skill to pop up. The weeknes of the H5 system was the tangle of perks that could destroy your build, which was very a lot of us argued for random skills/non-random perks, but obviously the point of this is completely lost if developers don't understand the difference between true random and controlled random.
Dave_Jame said:
In the end you agree that the system lacks "core characteristics" of the H6 system, but still you call it nothing more then an update obvious that the system has more incommon with H5, or even H3, with its N-A-E ranks, perks, General bonuses specializations of individual skills.
I'm sorry, but I just have a plain different opinion than you with regards to what is the important "core characteristics". I don't care whether skills are labeled Light Magic I/II/III or Novice/Expert/Master or Basic/Advanced/Expert - I may have a preference for the latter, but that is just naming and has no real implications for the system. Like I said in my previous post, the things that I find to be the essential parts are very similar between H6 and H7, and while you may not agree, that's my opinion, and it's mine to have.
____________
What will happen now?
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Wellplay
Famous Hero
Poland Stronk
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posted September 15, 2015 08:32 PM |
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Edited by Wellplay at 20:34, 15 Sep 2015.
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Galaad said:
Wellplay said:
Complain will not accomplish anything
Ugh, we got two units to get reworked from scratch in order to have a more decent Necro lineup, also, TotE?
And if you want, like everyone else, for the game to get better with expansions, how could it ever happen if people don't complain.
Although I agree is tiring to keep shouting into deaf ears, but at least feedback is here.
I did not mean in regards to a game but bigger picture which is pre-order age that complain will not do jack snow to change it only direct action.
Also not every little thing in this forum runs around Heroes, same with my comment.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted September 15, 2015 08:43 PM |
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Ah but that is the problem. Often ubi won't do jack unless the shadow council explodes.
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted September 15, 2015 08:47 PM |
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Not even then most of the time
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It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that the cis are at it again.
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Dave_Jame
Promising
Legendary Hero
I'm Faceless, not Brainless.
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posted September 15, 2015 09:39 PM |
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alcibiades said:
Exactly? That IS dependancy of your class (i.e. faction and might/magic inclination)?
Ok. more in detail. What limited what skills you could, or had higher chance to get in each game?
In Heroes 2 and 5 there was only one class for each faction. So basically Faction=Class. The thing that limited you were the hardcoded probability ratings.
Heroes 3 was the same with one change: Each faction had 2 classes, negating the Faction=Class part and giving emphasis on "Class",
What did Heroes 6 have? Well all heroes of each faction had access to the same skills. The only change between factions were spell schools and the difference in Classes (which were depending on your point of view 2, 4 or 6) were what 3rd level skills they had access to. So basically 80% of the skills were the same regardless of faction or class
Now Heroes 7 has 6 classes for each faction. Only one skill is shared between all of the heroes in one faction (the racist one) so each of them has different skill sets and potential. Man just like real people do. This is even highlighted by the fact tha we have so few heroes in each class. More can be added later, but for now, each hero has his personality. Is it that wrong?
This brings me to point two,
alcibiades said:
I just plain 100 % disagree with this statement.
You know when was the last time each hero had the same value as any other? H2, since there were no specializations and one single class. The only thing that made them stood out was their face. The idea behind specializations is to make each hero unique, and when we are all unique we can not be compared, we can not be equal. Each of us has his set of skills and abilities and it is up to us how we make them work. Why do you think most Games use classes and specializations? To give each character a focus. Not all characters have the potential to be the primary hero. Not all are destined to be the savior. Some heroes are good creepers, some are good support heroes, some are more fitt for direct approach. You choose your playstyle. We need variety, and when you implement variety you instantly create characters that are not up to every task in the game.
A fighter is not a mage, A ranger is not a druid. Archetypes represent different approaches and each approach focuses on its personal way. That is what classes represent. If each of us is unique, none of us is equal.
alcibiades said:
This was not something I mentioned at all in my post? What I talked about was the fact that some skills are limited only to get to next-highest level, i.e. Expert level but not Master level.
Ahh..in that case read the upper paragraph again. In short "A Ranger can heal, but will never heal as well as a Healer. A warrior may sneak, but will never sneak as well as a rogue". Classes have limitations to create their own feeling. I know some people love the "choose whatever you want approach" but again, you saw what total freedom ended up as in H6. Limitations force you to make decisions, making decisions is a vital aspect of variation in a game. Total freedom leads to "my personal best pick, or must have" situations, which lower variation and replayability. Imagine chess where you could choose what figures to use?
alcibiades said:
I'm sorry, but I just have a plain different opinion than you with regards to what is the important "core characteristics". I don't care whether skills are labeled Light Magic I/II/III or Novice/Expert/Master or Basic/Advanced/Expert - I may have a preference for the latter, but that is just naming and has no real implications for the system. Like I said in my previous post, the things that I find to be the essential parts are very similar between H6 and H7, and while you may not agree, that's my opinion, and it's mine to have.
I'm going to tell you the core features of H6 system and you tell me what of it is in the H7 one.
- free pick only
- no general "skills" (read Basic-Advanced-Expert), only perks (read navigator, enlightenment, ignition)
- one skill set for faction, only some small changes made by each class
- All might skills shared by all might heroes.
- spells and active abilities as core part of the skill system
- focus on reputation (further restriction of choice)
- skills limited by the hero's level.
____________
I'm just a Mirror of your self.
We see, we look, we gather, we store, we teach.
We are many, and you can be one of us.
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natalka
Supreme Hero
Bad-mannered
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posted September 15, 2015 10:00 PM |
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Edited by natalka at 22:07, 15 Sep 2015.
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Excuse me but I have always selected the school based on what I think is the best in the current matchup not on the spells I have. Then try hard to find the spells all game..
I can't believe you see this system as restrictive. 2% chance to get a skill was the same deal more or less and don't start theories how you can increase chances bla bla.
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This MEGA THREAD is pages long: 
