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| Thread: Clans Discussion |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 · NEXT» |
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vesuvius
Hero of Order
Honor Above all Else
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posted March 17, 2004 12:42 AM |
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Clans Discussion
This thread is for refining and discussing the powers and upgrades for both the homm4 and homm3 clans. These will be 'set in stone' once the first clans open up, which will be soon. So lets finish up any 'modifications' needed.
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haile73
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted March 17, 2004 09:42 AM |
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h3
I can only repeat that the necro power is overpowered. I think it's best to take necro completely out for h3, since nobody would play against them anyways, esp. on randoms which is the most played mapstyle. Necro is disabled on most rmg's anyway.
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the_teacher
Supreme Hero
Talk to the hand!
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posted March 17, 2004 11:16 AM |
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ves, you should add a post of what is decided so far, to know the advancement of the "negociations" and to not discuss again what came already to a general agreement.
e.g. number of philo closed, powers open etc.
speaking about the philo, i know has been already suggested, but i want to support the idea of having more philo which start with random town
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the_teacher
Supreme Hero
Talk to the hand!
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posted March 17, 2004 02:07 PM |
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one more thing about clans.
part of war rules :
how will those 3 games scheduled? we must find a way to make them balanced, to avoid having following situation :
assuming that numbers are players value from clan (1 is the best, 3 is not so skilled or unexperienced yet  ) ,
game 1 : player1 (A clan) vs. p2 (B clan)
game 2 : p2 vs. p3
game 3 : p3 vs. p1
could advantage alot A clan, assuring (theoretically ) 2 wins, and , in consequence, the war victory.
still no idea how to do that, but i have a suggestion :
if the map is to be picked by one clan, the other should set the games
still thinking of it...
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted March 17, 2004 02:14 PM |
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teacher not sure I know exactly what your trying to decribe, but if I am understanding you correctly why not just make it simle.
Match the closest ranks. i.e. 2 Highest ranked are matched the 2 lowest are matched and the 2 middle matched etc.
Either that or let the clan leaders decide and mutually agree. I have to admit I dont like the idea at all of letting the opponent clan decide on matchups, that is way to huge of advantage.
Jinxer
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balcough_dra...
Supreme Hero
unlucky? i want to pump you up
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posted March 17, 2004 04:06 PM |
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i agree with jinxer
in last clans it was sameway and worked well
so don't change it
and i think there should be 1 more philo
that takes random town also
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slayer
whos your daddy and what does he do?
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valkyrica
Supreme Hero
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posted March 17, 2004 04:28 PM |
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well i have a thought, don't know if it sounds appealing to any of you but here it goes
there are 2 important factors in clan wars : map and deciding who to throw against who.
So make 1 clan choose map, and the other clan choose the matchups, but as i said, just an idea.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted March 17, 2004 04:44 PM |
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Edited By: Jinxer on 17 Mar 2004
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Both of those things need to be mutually decided by BOTH clans. If both clans cant agree on BOTH then they shouldnt war agasint each other plain and simple.
I hope all the new clans this season take better care and actually think of the end result before they just rush into a clan war and get bullied into playing maps and rules and matchups etc by alot stronger clans. If they were smart they would negotiate better and be willing to decline clan wars and not let some of the tuffer clans just roll accross map like last season.
Lets use some strategy people!
Jinxer
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vesuvius
Hero of Order
Honor Above all Else
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posted March 17, 2004 07:36 PM |
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The heroes3 players are more active on the rankings, but not on the message board
About removing Necroma philo for Homm3, its best kept there, for it is a part of heroes3. If nobody plays a necro team, well too bad for them. The freedom of choice is key. The necroma power can be weakened for homm3 though, so it would have a lesser advantage over other powers.
Homm4 guys: I'm in no way going to impose a rule as to who plays who in the wars, that is up to you guys to match up.
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balcough_dra...
Supreme Hero
unlucky? i want to pump you up
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posted March 17, 2004 08:00 PM |
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i vote for ves picking map
he should know the good ones
and no one could complain after
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slayer
whos your daddy and what does he do?
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted March 17, 2004 08:52 PM |
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Balcough noone needs to assign maps. If both cant agree on map then move on to another clan that can agree. Noone has to play anyone, thatts the beauty of negotiations. If you want a war bad enough you will accept a certain map etc. If you cant agree to play what ever map is on the table then you evidentally dont want the war bad enough.
Jinxer
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attila
Known Hero
Young Warrior
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posted March 18, 2004 01:35 AM |
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i think for heroes 3 leave the bounses how there are if no one is wanting to put any input then they cant complain later. i my self get tierd of 1 certian town so i will most likely use the thifes tribe. thats my opinion.
Attila
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¤¤¤ Attila ¤¤¤
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vesuvius
Hero of Order
Honor Above all Else
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posted March 18, 2004 05:42 AM |
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Thinking of weakening the homm3 necro upgrades & power. Any opinion on that?
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the_teacher
Supreme Hero
Talk to the hand!
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posted March 18, 2004 08:11 PM |
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also , there will be nice if its possible to have a special column, in the clans record , which reffers to number of powers available to use
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vesuvius
Hero of Order
Honor Above all Else
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posted March 19, 2004 03:19 AM |
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Quote:
also , there will be nice if its possible to have a special column, in the clans record , which reffers to number of powers available to use
Yes, that is part of all that big empty space on each clan homepage.
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insatiable
Supreme Hero
Ultimate N00bidity
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posted March 19, 2004 05:36 PM |
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Demonic is extremely weak, i suggest not building in main town for 3-4 days
Rogue-Bandirty and Military, not very intruiging - not that 300 lev1 units is few, is just barbarian is not good for many maps, cause of luck of spells.
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the_teacher
Supreme Hero
Talk to the hand!
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posted March 19, 2004 06:31 PM |
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IMPORTANT !! in attn of all mapmakers
i hope you will agree in changing some settings on ALL the maps, once clan thing started.
Due to the philo and modifications brought by 3.4 mod , i DO think all the maps shoud be revised and some features (skills, artifacts,town) enabled again, otherwise the choice of map wll be very tough.
here i'd suggest :
---all maps that have banned spells like MASS CANCELLATION, SANCTUARY or TOWNGATE ( now being level 5 ) it's not a reason to keep them disabled.
OR
disabling tomes for some alignments and for other not would lead into an unballanced initial state, resulting in avoiding playing that map, and it's a pity for maker work, and for beauty of the map.
---also , all alignments must be present on maps ( we tend to play close to a 100% heroes game , not less than half) ) i speak , especially, to blue_camel, who has always nice ideas , but i dare to say his last map ,in my oppinion, is outrageuos, concerning the initial settings)
---after what i saw in TOC speed tourney, i assume every decent player will play mod 3.4 to avoid flaws of the standard version, So map should be prepared for 3.4 only
---banning skills is another crime, equi team worked hard to make them have a sense , and so far , it's ok , no skill is gamebreaker on universal maps.
There are special maps that require special settings, but those will not be played in clans or that aspect will RESTRAIN THE CHOICE OF A PHILO TO 2 -3 TOPS =>> no variety =>> boring. PLEASE, PRETTY please think of this.
as a conclusion, ALL SKILLS, ALL ARTIFACTS (with lil exception like ring of permanency, or boots , or useless stuff , if you really want that) ,and ALL TOWNS should be present in ANY map. IT's bad to be influenced by some preferences of a single player when making maps ....
less skills , artifacts => mathematic choice of a heroes, no imagination, standard game . Jinxer, don't ruin your nice work with this kind of settings .
if it will be required to be clearly noticed, i will post this again in a separate thread, but i hope you'll understand my point of view.
i don't want to change the world now , i'm not criticizing anything here, i always appreciated your work and respected, just wanted to have all maps playable for incoming clan thing, with almost same popularity.
revise them, pls.
for instance, just to scroll the philo and what we could see?
might ( 2 philos) out; cause of some "reasons",
death (2 philo) out ;same unreasonable "reasons",
scholar out; cause some important spells and artifacts disabled
would you like to have only life , chaos and nature , and mostof the time same combat hero due to the restrictions?
it won't be fun at all.
pls, think about
have a nice day
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insatiable
Supreme Hero
Ultimate N00bidity
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posted March 19, 2004 07:25 PM |
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yes, many restrictions isnt nice.
still, i'm sure that some maps need few, in order to work well
what i 100% agree on is that ALL 4th magic skills should be enabled from now on. so games will give a harder challenge, more spicy and allow map to have many altars, without making it too easy.
bottom line is though, mapmaker has right to shape up his chit as he wants to.. fcorse, fact remains; the fewer restrictions the better.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted March 20, 2004 01:59 AM |
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Edited By: Jinxer on 19 Mar 2004
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Well not sure where to start here, but I have to almost disagree with Teachers entire post.
About the only thing I agree with is that Mass Cancelation and Death tome can be reenabled.
First of all Insatiable is right each map has its own style. You cant just make every map the same. Regardless if MOD team balanced some issues they didnt solve all the problems 3do has in game.
For example, Melee being banned is a requirement in my opinion. If you leave EVERYthing in game then every single game on every map will be exactly the same. Make a buncha Barb heroes and buy immortalitys and rush the map. That is fun? No that is boring.
I actually think its nice that there are actually some new ideas and concepts in maps starting to emerge. There are currently 70 makes that all play the same basic way they just have different names. And maybe 10 maps that have unique and new ideas.
About Townportal and Sanctuary. Even tho they made Townportal Level 5, doesnt change the fact that the spell is very unbalancing on some maps. If you have a map like Powerspot for example where there is a simple right to left movement and you meat in the middle then Townportal ends up being just a fast way home to get troops etc. So not overhuge advantage if both dont have it. But on a Map like Imperial Prison or DangerZone where there is multiple map running strategies, if one player had the spell and other didnt the advantage would be a game breaker.
Sanctuary IMO is the most ridiculous spell the game offers. It is a mini hit and run in battle spell. Protect all units then just summon 1000 water elementals and buy the time you can actually start hitting oppoennts men he has thinned you down. Any time 1 player gets to move and do damage while you just sit there, that is unbalanced. So any map that I make that spell wont be an option, plain and simple. If I get enough support for it I may concider putting a Townportal scroll for both players on my maps, if you really want that spell there.
I commend your enthusiasm and ideas for clans Teacher, but to me it sounded more like you are afraid that you may have to accept a clan war on a map that has play style that doesnt conform to your comfort Zone so your wanting to make all maps in your playing style.
Diversity in maps is a must I think.
Jinxer
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balcough_dra...
Supreme Hero
unlucky? i want to pump you up
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posted March 20, 2004 02:05 AM |
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if you summon water elementals while you were in sactury jinxer that hero comes out of sactury's protection.
so opponent can just kill that 1 hero then
the max you would get is to summon twice or max third time
before opponent gets that lone hero out
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slayer
whos your daddy and what does he do?
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