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| Thread: Specialization of Heroes | |
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RedSoxFan3
Admirable
Legendary Hero
Fan of Red Sox
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posted November 24, 2003 09:02 AM |
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Specialization of Heroes
Instead of having levels for Heroes, why not let the player spend the experience in the way he/she chooses.
Example:
Crag Hack gets 10000 experience after a battle.
He can get +1 attack which costs 3000. +1 spell power(5000)
+1 knowedge(5000) and defense(4000).
I'd also like to see a huge array of secondary skills that were introduced in HOMM2, except with a couple of changes. Instead of the system of it giving you two choices of what you can improve, I'd like to see a system where you choose abilities that help your hero.
I'd also like to see ability trees for each hero. This means that some abilities have prerequisites whether it's attack rating, defense rating, or another secondary skill.
For example, in order to get basic tactics, you might need basic leadership. In order to get advanced tactics you might need advanced leadership, and basic wisdom. In order to get expert tactics, you might need advanced leadership, basic wisdom, basic offense, and basic defense.
Maybe this is example isn't perfect, but you can get the general idea. If anyone has played Civilization 2. When you research new sciences, each ability that's really good requires a lot of other abilities.
I was thinking of having an entire array of turning some of the magic spells into hero abilities that would fall into a class called charm abilities where a hero can choose to create a charm of a certain spell. Once charm has been learned, the hero ability will get better every time the hero casts the spell. Charm Spells are a permanent affect.
I'll give an example of this.
With the ability Charm Haste learned.
Basic: Haste cast 10 times, +1 speed to all creatures in party.
Novice: Haste cast 25 times, +2 speed.
Advanced: Haste cast 50 times, +3 speed.
Expert: Haste cast 100 times, +4 speed.
Master: Haste cast 200 times, +5 speed. (Maximum level)
Charm Haste prerequisites:
Haste in spellbook
Basic Wisdom
Expert Air Magic
Basic Divination(this is explained later)
Basic Charm(this is explained later)
I'd also like to see some interesting combinations of abilities that work together. Take the game Magic: The Gathering. If anyone has played that game you know how important good combinations of cards are to the game. I'd like to see this in heroes as well.
But I don't want hero building to end up having 2 or 3 different ways being the best way to make a hero.
Here are some new ideas for Secondary abilities.
Divination - This gives the hero the ability to cast low level spells like haste, slow, bloodlust, etc. These are spells that affect the status of a creature. Further development increases the effectiveness of the caster's divination spells and allows the hero to cast the high level divination spells.
Conjuration - This gives the ability to cast low level spells like magic arrow, ice bolt, lightning bolt, etc. These are spells that either create/remove new objects on the battlefield or deal damage. Further developments increases the effectiveness of all conjuration spells and allows the hero to cast high level conjuration spells.
Earth Magic - This gives the ability to cast low level earth spells. Further development...
Fire Magic - same as earth, but for fire...
Leadership - Same as in Heroes3
Charm:
Basic - Allows hero to create level 1-2 charm spells.
Novice - Allows hero to create level 3-4 charm spells.
Advanced - Allows hero to create level 5 charm spells. Level 1-2 charm spells get a +1 bonus every time spell is cast.
Expert - Level 3-4 spells get a +1 bonus. Level 1-2 charm spells get a +2 bonus.
Master - Level 1-2 spells get a +3 bonus. Level 3-4 spells get a +2 bonus. Level 5 spells get a +1 bonus.
These charm spells will be kinda like creating your own artifact except that it takes a lot of effort before it becomes really good.
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Go Red Sox!
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Vlaad
Admirable
Legendary Hero
ghost of the past
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posted November 24, 2003 07:30 PM |
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Edited By: Vlaad on 29 Nov 2003
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I also like the skill tree.
Just a note: shouldn't Basic be above Novice?
I've posted my hero specialty ideas elsewhere, so I'll just paste a part of that post in this thread.
First of all, make heroes race-based (I hate to see humans in each town!). Each race should have certain advantages (attack, defense, speed etc).
Give us unique heroes. In Heroes III, each hero had a unique specialty. However, a large number were useless or I didn’t care for most of them. The WoG team introduced specialties like Builder and Darkness in addition to already existing ones (Hopefully, we’ll see some more in the upcoming 3.58 patch).
Race-based heroes could have creature abilities, like Thief (Chaos might hero) shared his Stealth ability with Bandit (Chaos creature). Vampire heroes could drain life (suck blood) or strike enemies without retaliation. Human Knights could have jousting bonus, or maximum morale, or first strike, or stun ability, or undead protection. Dark Elf Assassins could have trail of darkness, or poison attack, or seduce ability… Imagine a dragon hero with fire breath!
My point is that each of 100+ heroes should have a unique specialty.
There are a lot of other skills that have never appeared in the series before. Think of less abstract yet useful adventure abilities: web, tame, barter, steal, ambush…
The current WoG list of Blesses and Curses may be helpful.
Each hero should also have a unique disorder. This feature should balance various advantages and disadvantages. The more powerful specialty, the more serious shortcoming.This is where various protections, immunities, wards and weaknesses come in.
Gelu in my picture is obviously an Elf, which grants him some inherent skills. His unique specialty is Caravan Master (additional speed for caravans), and he has Death Weakness (Death creatures deal double damage).
You'll notice I prefer the Heroes IV skill tree. 
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RedSoxFan3
Admirable
Legendary Hero
Fan of Red Sox
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posted November 25, 2003 03:59 PM |
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Another thing. I don't like having 100 different heroes.
I'd prefer to have fewer heroes that are equally good, than have some that are really good and some that are bad.
For example, each town can build a tavern that can recruit 3 different heroes for each town. With the skill trees. You only need 3 different skill trees for each hero in a town. I say quality, not quantity.
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Go Red Sox!
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Vlaad
Admirable
Legendary Hero
ghost of the past
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posted November 26, 2003 01:33 PM |
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Edited By: Vlaad on 26 Nov 2003
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Dingo
Responsible
Legendary Hero
God of Dark SPAM
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posted November 28, 2003 03:59 AM |
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Very Good Idea. I really like this idea. It would add so much depth to the game. But we should have some limits on the Heroes. Like say you have a Necromancer, the Necromancer can't learn Leadership, Life Magic or something else. But having Attack cost 3000, Defense cost 4000 and Magic and Knowledge 5000 is unbalanced. All of them should cost the same. It would make Might heroes to Powerful.
I like this idea alot but I do not want Heroes in battle.
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The Above Post/Thread/Idea Is CopyRighted by, The Dingo Corp.
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RedSoxFan3
Admirable
Legendary Hero
Fan of Red Sox
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posted November 28, 2003 05:26 AM |
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I think some heroes should be leaders. The ones that we had in HOMM3. Then there should be ones that fight. These guys can die, but they can get really powerful.
Using the different race based towns, we can get different types of skill trees within that town. For example, you might have a hero in Necro that's a death knight. It has abilities like drain attack. Kind of like a Warcraft 3 hero except with more abilities and with the HOMM style.
Finally there's the classic hero that we know best, the third-person general that overlooks everything.
Maybe you could make the option of fighting in battle a separate skill that you learn.
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Go Red Sox!
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EvilLoynis
Famous Hero
The Dark Shadow
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posted December 05, 2003 06:48 AM |
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Quote:
Very Good Idea. I really like this idea. It would add so much depth to the game. But we should have some limits on the Heroes. Like say you have a Necromancer, the Necromancer can't learn Leadership, Life Magic or something else. But having Attack cost 3000, Defense cost 4000 and Magic and Knowledge 5000 is unbalanced. All of them should cost the same. It would make Might heroes to Powerful.
I like this idea alot but I do not want Heroes in battle.
I think the cost is supposed to be class based. Like Barbarians find it cheaper for atk and def, and Magic heroes have cheaper Knowledge and Power.
Knight- +1 Attack 4000, +1 Defense 3000, and for +1 Knowledge or Power 5000.
Priest- +1 Attack or Power 5000, +1 Defense 4000, and for +1 Knowledge 3000.
The above is based on the belief that Life/Good heroes find it easier to up there def or wisdom where if they want more offensive skills it costs more. This would kind of be reversed for the Death Knights and Necromancers.
Barbarian- +1 Attack 3000, +1 Defense 4000, and for +1 Knowledge or Power 5000.
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"I am both selfish and instictive. I value nature and the world around me as means to an end as well as an end in itself; at best I ... too long to display...
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GabyStan
Known Hero
Seeking Wisdom
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posted May 02, 2007 01:03 AM |
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Hm, interesting ideas, which I think were implemented in Heroes 5, weren't they?
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Your worst enemy is... yourself.
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