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| Thread: Battle Screen Format | |
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RedSoxFan3
Admirable
Legendary Hero
Fan of Red Sox
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posted January 07, 2004 11:22 PM |
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Battle Screen Format
My inspiration for this thread is based on a discussion in Prelimenary Hypothesis brought by Djive.
First of all the battle map would be proportionate to the amount of space that an army takes up in battle. The map would also be in hex grids.
As we know 1 skeleton on the battlefield would certainly take up less space than 500 skeletons. If a player had 500 skeletons, It would take up 500 times the space as that of 1 skeleton. However it would be too difficult to see something like this so allow 15 skeletons to occupy one hex. Could be more, but I'm just using an example.
Now for some specific rules to add to make the strategy and my big picture perspective on how it will actually work. Previous to battle you are allowed to plan how your army will line up. All damage is dealt simultaneously. The battle results are turn based and all orders for all troops are given at the beginning of each round. Creatures still have abilities such as flying, movement points, etc.
Now for some more technical rules. Let's say that you have creatures on one hex. Your opponent has another creature stack on another hex adjacent to your creature stack. The number of opposing creatures stacks will give penalties or bonuses to each player.
If a creature stack is adjacent to no enemy troops there is a defense and attack bonus. If adjacent to 1 hex there is a slight defense bonus. If adjacent to 2 hexes there is no bonus. If adjacent to 3 hexes there is a penalty to defense. If adjacent to 4 hexes there is a penalty to both attack and large penalty to defense. If adjacent to 5 squares there is a huge penalty to defense and a penalty to large penalty to offense. If a stack is completely surrounded, it can either surrender or continue to fight with huge penalties to both attack and defense.
Ranged attacker attack areas of hexes not creature stacks. At closer ranges the attack will be stronger and more precise. Elevation will increase the accuracy and distance the creature can fire. When creatures are under bombardment by ranged attackers. They receive a penalty to defense and/or attack. This means that although you may not be killing huge amounts of creatures you certainly may be lowering their defenses dramatically which allows your melee fighters to go in and slaughter them.
Flying creatures receive bonuses when in combat with all ground troops. Flying creatures can occupy the same hexes as ground troops. Flying creatures receive penalties to their defenses from ranged attacks.
Some creatures have trample attack. For example, Champions have the trample ability which will give enormous attack bonuses to melee creatures like skeletons. There will be varying degrees of trample. Example Elephant Riders will obviously be able to trample better than horses can as well as being able to trample over the horses.
Creatures that have spears such as pikeman are much harder to trample and are immune to being trampled by horses but not by knights. Each creature will be have statistics as to whether or not they are vulnerable to each level of trample, immune to each level, or partially immune.
Some creatures will have first strike. This means that in the simultaneous combat, the creature with first strike will deal an initial set of damage before the regular combat. This takes preparation. If a player cannot find a sanctuary or a town, he or she can go into the battle map and dig trenches and make siege weapons if the materials are available.
A new creature ability called burrow. This creature can dig into the ground and move around. Your opponent cannot see where the creatures are without a creature or hero-ability that can detect underground creatures through vibrations. But this only has a specific range of hexes. When the creatures come up out of the ground, one of two things can happen. If the enemy has not detected them the enemy will be startled. This will give the burrowing creature first strike and will lower the defenses of the enemy for the remainder of the round. If the burrowing creature is detected the enemy will get first strike with reduced attack. And further combat will proceed normally. Movement underground will have a separate statistic.
Example: Giant Wurm
Speed: 7
Burrowing: 10
This means the Wurm is faster underground. Some creatures will be slower underground.
Heroes can get Leaders to join their armies. Leaders have an ability that can be used once a turn on many stacks of troops that are not engaged by the enemy. This will increase the creatures defense, attack, and movement each turn for up to 3 rounds. Leaders can go into any hex regardless whether it is enemy troops or whether it is allied troops. The hex that the leader occupies will give a large bonus to attack, defense, and movement to an allied stack and equal penalties to enemy stacks. For any hex adjacent to the leader, allied troops will get a smaller bonus to the same stats and enemies will get an equal penalty. The effectiveness of the leader is determined by the total experience of the leader.
Note: Leaders can die in combat, so you must be careful with how you use them.
Each town get 1 hero per week. 2 with citadel and 3 with capitol. Each hero can bring a number of leaders proportionate to the size of the army.
Help me think of some leaders that have different abilities that relate to what happens in combat.
So what do you think? Could this still be Homm with a battle strategy like this? I certainly think the battles would play out differently and it definately brings a spatial element to the battle strategy of the game that the previous games had never touched upon.
Obviously troop upkeeps would be necessary to keep armies smaller however I feel that the armies probably won't get TOO big because it will be much harder to defeat the AI with virtually no losses as it has been in the past. Although I do think that with more special abilities like trample, first strike, trample defense and flying.
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Go Red Sox!
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gerdash
Responsible
Famous Hero
from the Animated Peace
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posted January 08, 2004 02:25 PM |
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so, are you saying that no more than 15 skeletons fit on one hex? 500 skeletons would then occupy 34 hexes.
i didn't quite understand how you would move a stack that is located on more than one hex.
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RedSoxFan3
Admirable
Legendary Hero
Fan of Red Sox
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posted January 08, 2004 03:25 PM |
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This was simply an example. However the battle screen may be hundreds of hexes large. But I would like to see large stacks of skeletons as a large glob occupying many hexes rathter than a big skeleton guy standing on one hex that can have an infinate number of creatures.
In previous Homm's there was a little bit of the spatial element in the game, but this will take it to the next step.
With globs of creatures, in this case 34 hexes of skeltons, there should be options of selecting troops on multiple hexes as a group and moving them that way.
There should be another option of movement which I call a snake movement. You click on a troop, this stack will be the leader. Then you hold shift or some button and click on more troops. This will allow specific troops to move on a specific route in a line that does not have to be straight this can be necessary for tactics designed to surround your opponent.
Edit: I noticed after reading my original post that there was something that should be changed. If you notice I had mentioned penalties and bonuses for creatures being adjacent to enemy creatures. Well Let's say that 15 skeletons can occupy 1 hex. Well if you put 13 on one hex and 1 on 2 other hexes, then you shouldn't get the full penalty for 3 squares. It should be determined two ways. Part of it will be how many hexes. The other part will be equal to the number of hexes that adjacent creatures can occupy.
Quote:
so, are you saying that no more than 15 skeletons fit on one hex? 500 skeletons would then occupy 34 hexes.
i didn't quite understand how you would move a stack that is located on more than one hex.
Okay. Let's say you have 500 skeletons that occupy 34 hexes. At the beginning of the battle you line them all up the way you like. Since there will be a lot of hexes. You can select more than one unit and have the big glob of skeletons move together.
Here's what I was talking about with the snake movement thing.
Before:
* * * *
_* * * *
* * * * *
_* * * * *
After:
* * *
_* * *
* * * *
_* * * * * * * *
First you would select the men that you want in bold. This will create a line that will move like follow the leader. Then you click and drag the last guy in the line where you want them to go. The groups take the same path as the stacks in front of them.
As for creatures that take up more than one hex. You simply click on the creature and choose where to put it. For creatures that are not symmetrical you can rotate them and position them how like. Let's say you have a huge snake. You can either have the snake stretch out across several hexes or coiled up into a glob shape for combat.
Edited by ThE_HyDrA: Merged 2 posts into 1.
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Go Red Sox!
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Polaris
Promising
Known Hero
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posted January 09, 2004 10:16 AM |
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I think you described something other than a Heroes game!
This is more like Myth or something. Your battle system is detailed enough to make an entire game out of it (imagine it in an RTS). IMHO your system should be an entire game, not a piece of one.
Have you ever played Age of Wonders? I think it has a good, simplistic battle model, but at the same time it's more detailed than the Heroes model. An intersection between these two models may be more appropriate.
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draco
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted February 11, 2004 06:39 AM |
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i like how the battles are now.. 1 hex = 1 stack.. it gets to complecated when you try and make more unites use more land (as logical as it may be)
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Asmodean
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Heroine at the weekend.
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posted February 11, 2004 09:05 PM |
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I agree with polaris. It sounds more like Shogun:Total War, which was mainly the battles and a small strategy/building part to the game. I don't want to see Heroes relegating it's adventure map to the sidelines in favour of large flamboyant battle scenes.
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To err is human, to arr is pirate.
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Zero
Hired Hero
of Hyrule
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posted February 11, 2004 09:16 PM |
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i agree with draco the system is good as it is now if they try to change it it could be worse
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I am the one who will lead you to the Final Destination
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Gerdash
Responsible
Famous Hero
from the Animated Peace
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posted February 12, 2004 12:16 AM |
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Quote:
i agree with draco the system is good as it is now if they try to change it it could be worse
lol, we are not changing the system yet, but the day after tomorrow all the heroes games you have purchased will start to function this way. as soon as your computer gets connected to the internet, the change will be downloaded.
please remember: this is a fan forum, not developer's final decisions.
Moderator's note:This topic has been closed, as it refers to an older version of the game. To discuss Heroes 3, please go to Library Of Enlightenment, to discuss Heroes 4, please go to War Room Of Axeoth, to discuss Heroes 5, go to Temple Of Ashan.
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what is the safest way to pass your time? heroes community -- your posts won't affect almost anything
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