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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: Land of Topes and jebus
Thread: Land of Topes and jebus [ This thread is 2 pages long: (1) 2 ]
durell
durell


Adventuring Hero
Sub-n00b
posted October 02, 2005 03:38 PM

Land of Topes and jebus

Im ready to get spammed with insults here.
     This season i am playing only jebus,in my humble opinion Jebus is the most exciting and adrenaline inspiring template yet created(hail Bjorn).
  the reason that "vets" try to bring jebus down escapes me,jebus is a player friendly template that mixes skill with a certain amount of luck,if ya dont play jebus(or perhaps ya can escape this by saying jebus is for n00bs)i'm thinking ya fear a loss....."give a noob a chance ya coward"

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Russ
Russ


Promising
Supreme Hero
blah, blah, blah
posted October 03, 2005 11:43 AM

*spams Durell with insults*
Jebus is ok, but some people find it a bit boring because it only has 1 way of playing it and you can only use Castle if you want to have a chance of winning. I belive Frank described this strategy in details in one of the threads. The slightest deviation from this one tactic will result in your loss (unless, of course, you get excessively lucky, which can happen we well).
You never get to calculate your money and estimate how many heroes you can afford and which building strategy to choose based on your area's richness. You won't need to chain your troops or to carry a small army on your scout just so he can take that one guarded chest on the other side of the mountain that you really need for building a castle on week 1. You don't even need to think about chosing your main! Because chances are you will have almost endless attempts of getting a good one from the inn on Jebus.

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Nebuka
Nebuka


Promising
Supreme Hero
Save me Jebus!
posted October 05, 2005 04:56 PM

When I played before, I played mostly Jebus.

Reason is simple, I had most fun playing it. And that's a one good reason to play it.

Though, my lack of skills might have something with it....
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Zsa
Zsa


Famous Hero
posted October 05, 2005 07:59 PM

Quote:
*spams Durell with insults*
Jebus is ok, but some people find it a bit boring because it only has 1 way of playing it and you can only use Castle if you want to have a chance of winning. I belive Frank described this strategy in details in one of the threads. The slightest deviation from this one tactic will result in your loss (unless, of course, you get excessively lucky, which can happen we well).
You never get to calculate your money and estimate how many heroes you can afford and which building strategy to choose based on your area's richness. You won't need to chain your troops or to carry a small army on your scout just so he can take that one guarded chest on the other side of the mountain that you really need for building a castle on week 1. You don't even need to think about chosing your main! Because chances are you will have almost endless attempts of getting a good one from the inn on Jebus.

yes russ, in short it SEVERELY limits the strategy part of the game and amplifies the luck part. A good strategy game would put a person in a lot of different situations, one which doesn't have a cookie cut solution.

Saying that people fear to play jebus because they might get a loss is umm... :\ . There are people who fear losing game all across the player skill spectrum. However, who do you think is more likely to fear a loss?
The guy who plays the same stuff over and over again, or the guy who likes to try new stuff?

I don't know about you, but if it was possible to make a statistic on who fears a loss more (jebus players or various random templae players), my money would definetly be on the jebus players.

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durell
durell


Adventuring Hero
Sub-n00b
posted October 06, 2005 03:16 PM

Well,thx for answering my question about why vets avoid it like the plague.
all fair comments.but that doesn't change my attidude towards the template.
i am ready to move on to more challenging templates,but i still enjoy jebus,like i said...its fun,its all about the "big Kill" ,i have played other templates and read various strategy's that explain how to master such variations,does that allways work then?i mean,if it allways works on jebus  when ya stick to the formula,then all ya need to do is read what a "vet" says and you have won ANY map ya play.....LOOOL.    is there a better training temp than jebus?
  If ya think the jebus player fears a loss ,well ,let me address this,i am playing my 2nd season for ww,i play jebus,i lose 2 thirds of the games i play, because i play people who know how to play heroes better than me,but,i enjoy playing heroes,dont mind losing,.I have low skills in combat ,and lose troops .where better to learn about combat than jebus?.....yours sincerely   a n00b

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Zsa
Zsa


Famous Hero
posted October 06, 2005 07:29 PM

Quote:
i mean,if it allways works on jebus  when ya stick to the formula,then all ya need to do is read what a "vet" says and you have won ANY map ya play.....LOOOL.    is there a better training temp than jebus?


Umm, this wasn't about winning all the time. You WON'T win all the games even with a "fixed" formula.
Jebus is a cookie cut template more that others because of its nature (because of the template settings and design). It's not a formula template because a vet writes a guide on how to cookie cut .

I mean jebus is so rigid, you can only play 1 (max 2) races effectively on it. Jebus is so rich you are almost never in any resource constraints.

Quote:

  If ya think the jebus player fears a loss ,well ,let me address this,i am playing my 2nd season for ww,i play jebus,i lose 2 thirds of the games i play, because i play people who know how to play heroes better than me,but,i enjoy playing heroes,dont mind losing,.I have low skills in combat ,and lose troops .where better to learn about combat than jebus?.....yours sincerely   a n00b


I'm sorry durell, I didn't know you embody the gaming philosophy of all jebus players out there

Of course there's going to be players that care less about losing than others. But how do I extrapolate the fact that you don't fear a loss to every other jebus player out there?

It's like saying, look I do not fear to lose I am a nice guy to play with and I never cheated, therefore all romanian players are fair, nice to play with and don't cry when they lose.  

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Xarfax111
Xarfax111


Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
The last hero standing
posted October 07, 2005 10:40 AM

The reason why some Vets avoid to play Jebus is very simple: Its no challenge.

Its far too easy in any way.

Lately i made some fun games in German league. 1on1on1on1 with one hero on 130. Thats what jebus is perfect for. Fast and easy game. And hell...that makes fun.

But normally i like more the "McGuyver-Style": "Give me 3 Mighty Cows and 4 Gogs and a Pencilmine to kill the map".

Means like i dont want it all "for free" like on Jebus, i want to think about what and how to do next.

Unfortunately Midnight took out to much of the surprising stuff to make his templates (Blockbuster, Extreme etc.) interesting. (btw. the "first" Blockbuster which wasnt edited was just plain perfect).

And that a "Vet" (whatever that is in your eyes) doesnt like to play Jebus, because of the fear of loosing ..lmao... the Jebus template makes a Vet two times faster then ull ever be, and u would be killed before u build up your Lvl7 upgrade. So thats just another noobie-fairy-tale.

Xarfax1


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rychenroller
rychenroller


Promising
Supreme Hero
posted October 07, 2005 10:06 PM

Quote:
The reason why some Vets avoid to play Jebus is very simple: Its no challenge.

Its far too easy in any way.

Lately i made some fun games in German league. 1on1on1on1 with one hero on 130. Thats what jebus is perfect for. Fast and easy game. And hell...that makes fun.

But normally i like more the "McGuyver-Style": "Give me 3 Mighty Cows and 4 Gogs and a Pencilmine to kill the map".

Means like i dont want it all "for free" like on Jebus, i want to think about what and how to do next.

Unfortunately Midnight took out to much of the surprising stuff to make his templates (Blockbuster, Extreme etc.) interesting. (btw. the "first" Blockbuster which wasnt edited was just plain perfect).

And that a "Vet" (whatever that is in your eyes) doesnt like to play Jebus, because of the fear of loosing ..lmao... the Jebus template makes a Vet two times faster then ull ever be, and u would be killed before u build up your Lvl7 upgrade. So thats just another noobie-fairy-tale.

Xarfax1





perfect post, couldnt have said it any better.


So I wont try
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durell
durell


Adventuring Hero
Sub-n00b
posted October 09, 2005 06:07 AM

the Jebus template makes a Vet two times faster then ull ever be, and u would be killed before u build up your Lvl7 upgrade.
  HAHAHAHAHA.....LMFAO....hehehehehehehehe
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rychenroller
rychenroller


Promising
Supreme Hero
posted October 09, 2005 07:42 AM

Its not entirely jebus that sux (tho i think it does)...its the rules that players to try to employ on it to make it balanced.


You cant balance the permanently unbalanced.
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rychenroller
rychenroller


Promising
Supreme Hero
posted October 09, 2005 11:56 PM

Quote:
the Jebus template makes a Vet two times faster then ull ever be, and u would be killed before u build up your Lvl7 upgrade.
  HAHAHAHAHA.....LMFAO....hehehehehehehehe


I think we all know that you are going to upgrade your angels day 8 or 9 (angels...sigh, does anybody play random towns anymore...no coz blah tribes blah). It might have been Xar's attempt at sarcasm but it is true. Watch Vinz, or Rock or Maretti play jebus and they are scary fast...not talking week3 day2 they are knocking on your door, but in some cases, they've taken your town week2 day6. Now thats quick.

Case in point...played zendy on extreme the other day, she requested noraml monsters instead of hard, fair enough, I had no problem with that. What it did do is make the game so much faster. I aim for a desert break on extreme at the start of week5...if having a super game I might be able to push it to mid week4 if 3rd and 4th areas are small. Playing on normal monsters made the map that much easier, I had scoured my desert areas as well as all 4 allotted areas by just into the start of week4. I had broken zendy's area just into week5 and her comment was "well i guess i just have to play faster"

Thats not entirely true...The normal monster setting not only made it easier for her, but for me as well. Instead of 120 naga queens guarding 2 boxes with 20k xp and 8 dread knights, they were 80. Instead of there being a horde of blacks guarding the monlith between us, there was only 35...making my task all the more easier as the agressor. If those blacks were a horde, I would had taken many more losses (no earth, no res, no haste) but they let my strong hero through relatively unscathed, losing an entire marksmen stack only to relplace the m with 10 black knights.

Hence the problem with jebus, a weaker monster setting,a ridiculously rich template only allows the superior player more luxury. The better player will kill you on the easier template, and he will do it faster. See if you can get a win off Maretti, or Rock or whoever.

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doomfreak
doomfreak


Famous Hero
The Crispinator
posted October 10, 2005 12:48 AM

Quote:
Im ready to get spammed with insults here.
     This season i am playing only jebus,in my humble opinion Jebus is the most exciting and adrenaline inspiring template yet created(hail Bjorn).
  the reason that "vets" try to bring jebus down escapes me,jebus is a player friendly template that mixes skill with a certain amount of luck,if ya dont play jebus(or perhaps ya can escape this by saying jebus is for n00bs)i'm thinking ya fear a loss....."give a noob a chance ya coward"



I am suprised that Jebus hasn't found this thread and posted in it yet...
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angelito
angelito

Hero of Order
proud father of a princess
posted October 10, 2005 05:37 AM

Quote:
the Jebus template makes a Vet two times faster then ull ever be, and u would be killed before u build up your Lvl7 upgrade.
  HAHAHAHAHA.....LMFAO....hehehehehehehehe


Stephen, it might sound funny what Xarfax wrote, and i know u r playing Jebus very often nowadays and u r getting good on that template (good means = breaking week 3 day 1 most of the times.
But a vet and real good players break before week 3! You are getting better in chaining, but the point where u still have to learn and get more experience are the tough fights, which sound nearly impossible for you or most players. These fights make the difference. Remember our 2vs2 this weekend? Lots of cerberi day 1? Without doing that fight, i wouldnt have flagged 2 roc dwellings week 1, coz the road down there was blocked by them. Would have lost at least 3 or 4 days. Any good player or vet would have made this fight. The "normal" (sounds bad, but is not meant ot be...) or newer players would not. The area of my ally this weekend was a good example for an easy week 2 break. You saw the save. With log on witch hut day 1, 2 cons near the starting town, and a tope right in front of the middle area guards (horde champions), u would have at least 5 Archangels in week 2, and thats pretty much enough to kill the champs.

So never underestimate the speed of the real vets, for the matter of fact u have never played against them. You learn the difference on harder templates even more. Try to play Extreme or Extreme II against a vet....u will wonder how fast he will knock on your door.

Im telling u this not to bring u down (you know we are mates!), but to realize u still have a long way to go to reach the level of the very good players and the longtime vets.
Youre on a good way, keep it up..
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Icecream
Icecream


Hired Hero
posted October 10, 2005 04:38 PM

*spams steve with insults*

Well i dont really know what im talking about here but maybe you should just play more maps then just jebus. I know coming from me that is stupid lol considering i only play all for one(cd version) and jebus but maybe you should play all for one too against me and play heartlands against Angel that way maybe you could gain more experience from fixed maps and put them into preperation for extreme or extreme II
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tigris
tigris


Supreme Hero
Supreme Noobolator
posted October 13, 2005 09:37 PM

speaking of speed and hearing mini say something about heartlands i wonder how fast does a vet usually kills the first 10 AA on that map?
I tried to play the map,took all mines except gold and boots of speed day 2, took tower day 3 and put one hero in boat day 3 or 4.took dwarven tresurerie and imp cache,killed pegasi,recruited angel and took gold mine day 4.
I reckon till this point i moved decently fast.But from this point on i get stuck.I played the map twice.First time i didn't know that i will receive extra troops and cash day 8 so i figured a week 3 day 1 break would do, but seing that i think week 2 it's accesible.For me, the money is now the biggest issue in time mangement.If i had enough money to Upg and buy 5 AA and some fodder day 8 i reckon a break would be possible.But i never get that kind of money (20k for upgrade,20 k for buying 4 AA)=40K.IMHO the only way to get that kind of money would be to recruit 5 angels day 8, chain them to your main who is now standing next to the naga queens guarding the underground chests, killing them, taking gold with a scout then preparing the backchain for the upgrade.This may mean a day 10 break.That's the best i can think of, but there is only one small problem:S How do i kill 19 naga queens with 5 angels and fodders?In my 2 games i never got slow out of mage guild.Also given the small number of figts i did with my main till that point i have small stats, so this fight may prove very tricky.
I never played a fixed map before so i just gave my 2 cents about playing this particular map.How do you guys do it?
Any feedback would be apreciated
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bjorn190
bjorn190


Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jebus maker
posted October 14, 2005 05:30 AM

Jebus was designed for a specific purpose, which it has achieved 10 times over

If H5 has a random map generator u can expect another jebus in that game too, but if I know my corporations, Id say they wont put that in until at least the expansion, and it will probably just be choices, no rmg detail.


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angelito
angelito

Hero of Order
proud father of a princess
posted October 14, 2005 06:47 AM

Im not a fixed player, thats a known fact i guess.
Heartlands was the map i had to play vs DrunkenMerlin in tribefinals last season. I broke vs AAs day 9, took his main town day 14.
The break vs the AAs was end of day 9. At that point, everything was done in my 2 areas, except the Archdevils and the Ancients in the upper world. On day 9, i took library, nagaqueens and AAs. Important is to check both refugee camps in week 1 and on day 8. I found 1 hydra and 1 devil.
I only played that fast, coz i saw in tavern he had Mephala, and i got 5 magic heroes and 1 might. The might was Galthran...lol. So i took Labetha and had expert slow day 2. Helps a lot though..
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tigris
tigris


Supreme Hero
Supreme Noobolator
posted October 14, 2005 06:57 AM

Quote:
The break vs the AAs was end of day 9. At that point, everything was done in my 2 areas, except the Archdevils and the Ancients in the upper world. ..

Tha means u killed pack unis,sultans and naga queens week 1?I took both camps week 1 and 2 as you said, but that's a roll of a dice.
@angelon't share too much or jammer will be in trouble if we are too meet in the finals lol
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angelito
angelito

Hero of Order
proud father of a princess
posted October 14, 2005 07:15 AM

Quote:
Tha means u killed pack unis,sultans and naga queens week 1?I took both camps week 1 and 2 as you said, but that's a roll of a dice.


No, that was done day 8.
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Nebuka
Nebuka


Promising
Supreme Hero
Save me Jebus!
posted October 20, 2005 12:02 PM
Edited By: Nebuka on 20 Oct 2005

Jebus Cross is nothing.

Crazy Cross is the future.


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