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Heroes Community > Heroes 5 - Temple of Ashan > Thread: Am i the only one seeing this problem?
Thread: Am i the only one seeing this problem? [ This thread is 2 pages long: (1) 2 ]
shadara
shadara

Tavern Dweller
posted May 27, 2006 03:50 AM

Am i the only one seeing this problem?

I've played H5 a lot in hot seat and from what i see the paladins are WAY to powerfull. Knight hero with 11 atack 7 defense with 20 paladins killing 11 green dragons from first hit, 15 paladins doing 9000 damage against regular troops and so on...
In 8 weeks i can get with trainig around 40 of them, split them in 2 or 3 groups and u can kill any enemy stack in 1 hit...that's not balance in my oppinion.
Pls post your oppinion on this matter
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JustAFan
JustAFan

Tavern Dweller
posted May 27, 2006 05:16 AM

They could do that much dmg because of
1)Luck
2)Their spec ability (forgot how it was called) - the more the target is away from your paladin the more dmg it deals. If it is right next to you
you will do less dmg than if it is on the other side of the battlefield and you have a hasted paladin in order to reach it. But I agree game is a little misbalanced!

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kinslayer
kinslayer


Sometimes death seems better-
posted May 27, 2006 07:03 AM

i agree uith u. the paladins are overpowered. they must be changed because, if the user can easely upgrade 3 monks in 3 paladins every week. A good ideea is to prevent upgrading monks in paladins.imo

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shadara
shadara

Tavern Dweller
posted May 27, 2006 03:16 PM
Edited by shadara at 15:17, 27 May 2006.

I've played another game in hot seat versus heaven; my opponent didn't choose Klaus (at lvl 20 +10 atack/+10defense to pallies) and he lost; the pallies were doing very high damage, but can be beaten; with klaus on the other hand... just take a lvl 14-20 klaus with 20 pallies on a walk and u'll see what i'm talking about
U can get around 13-16 pallies per week with 30000 gold.
On the other hand, training troops with heaven has a BIG downfall...u MUST be inside the castle with your hero, the other races just use summon troops, so it's ok, i don't think it's imba anymore; mobility>brute force
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DragonLord3000
DragonLord3000


Known Hero
Romanian flamethrower
posted September 05, 2006 08:31 AM

Quote:
I've played H5 a lot in hot seat and from what i see the paladins are WAY to powerfull. Knight hero with 11 atack 7 defense with 20 paladins killing 11 green dragons from first hit, 15 paladins doing 9000 damage against regular troops and so on...
In 8 weeks i can get with trainig around 40 of them, split them in 2 or 3 groups and u can kill any enemy stack in 1 hit...that's not balance in my oppinion.
Pls post your oppinion on this matter


I've noticed this problem myself when i started plaiyng H5 but now when i have somewhat more experience in the game it looks to me that there not so though!That damage is due to their attack skill(not sure how much,but it must be high),and to their jousting...thing.
C'mon !5 paladins killing 11 dragons?

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Doomforge
Doomforge

Hero of Order
Mayhem Elemental
posted September 05, 2006 08:51 AM

Quote:
C'mon !5 paladins killing 11 dragons?


check the postdate maybe? They nerfed klaus in 1.2, but in May it was perfectly possible to do 1500 damage with Klaus' 5 cavaliers.

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Nebuka
Nebuka


Promising
Supreme Hero
Save me Jebus!
posted September 05, 2006 10:42 AM
Edited by Nebuka at 10:44, 05 Sep 2006.

Now it is 50% or so limit, as can't rely on paladins moving more than 10 tiles. That is, for 'regular' heroes.

Klaus is now even more powered compared to other heroes carrying paladins.

Before it was 14% at start, +2% for every level. Other heroes had 10% per tile.

Now it's 9% at start for Klaus, and again +2% for every level, while other heroes are nerfed to 5%.

Jousting is nerfed, but Klaus is still a force.
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alcibiades
alcibiades

Hero of Order
Really, Ubisoft?
posted September 05, 2006 11:35 AM

Still, for all the merit it has to say that the Paladins are powerfull, there seems to be something wrong with the math here. 15 Paladins doing 9000 damage would correspond to 600 damage pr. paladin. Even with Charge bonus of 100 %, Attack bonus, Retribution bonus of 25 % and Offense bonus it seems impossible.

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Doomforge
Doomforge

Hero of Order
Mayhem Elemental
posted September 05, 2006 12:16 PM

Quote:
Still, for all the merit it has to say that the Paladins are powerfull, there seems to be something wrong with the math here. 15 Paladins doing 9000 damage would correspond to 600 damage pr. paladin. Even with Charge bonus of 100 %, Attack bonus, Retribution bonus of 25 % and Offense bonus it seems impossible.


well, I did 1,5k dam with 5 cavaliers, so 300 damage per cavalier. Add luck and there you go - 600 damage ;p

Check Klaus at level 15. 39% per every tile, 8 tiles. +320% damage, rounded up, of course. I'd say wicked.. I thought klaus was nerfed more than pathetic 5% of his starting bonus. Lmao.

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Nebuka
Nebuka


Promising
Supreme Hero
Save me Jebus!
posted September 05, 2006 03:13 PM

Quote:
Still, for all the merit it has to say that the Paladins are powerfull, there seems to be something wrong with the math here. 15 Paladins doing 9000 damage would correspond to 600 damage pr. paladin. Even with Charge bonus of 100 %, Attack bonus, Retribution bonus of 25 % and Offense bonus it seems impossible.


As doomforge said, he can get quite larger bonus than puny 100%.

Here's some charts for 1.0 (1.1) and 1.2 versions.

1.0, 1.1


1.2

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Unixmage
Unixmage


Known Hero
Demon Slayer
posted September 06, 2006 01:52 AM

No I don't see your problem. Paladins are taken down easily and if the archangels resurrect just do another implosion on them.

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RaZmuShaDoW
RaZmuShaDoW


Known Hero
The Sync Bug Hunter
posted September 06, 2006 03:19 AM

Quote:
No I don't see your problem. Paladins are taken down easily and if the archangels resurrect just do another implosion on them.


The problem for most factions is that Paladins have quite a good initiative. So it's is ussualy quite hard to kill them before that first (and biggest) hit.

As I am a Dungeon player I ussualy ruin that first move of Paladins with Blood Furies and Grim Riders. If the number of Paladins is to big I delay their movement by blockig them with 1 Blood Fury.

In fact last night I managed to kill like >30 Paladins with 64 Grim Riders with the first hit (only one Paladin survived). That happend because I had max undefencing bonus with Riders and also got a luck roll What I want to say is that you can't let yourself depand on justing bonus of Paladins. Same as you can't rely on luck
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Doomforge
Doomforge

Hero of Order
Mayhem Elemental
posted September 06, 2006 04:27 AM

Quote:
In fact last night I managed to kill like >30 Paladins with 64 Grim Riders with the first hit (only one Paladin survived). That happend because I had max undefencing bonus with Riders and also got a luck roll What I want to say is that you can't let yourself depand on justing bonus of Paladins. Same as you can't rely on luck


You were lucky - usually it's EXACTLY opposite, paladins strike first and kill ALL lizards in one blow.

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Elvin
Elvin

Hero of Order
Stillness within Movement
posted September 06, 2006 04:32 AM

Maybe he blocked them with a fury first and they waited or had an initiative boosting artifact.If not that is a fine example of how the forces of chaos and luck can turn around even the best strategies
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alcibiades
alcibiades

Hero of Order
Really, Ubisoft?
posted September 06, 2006 06:18 AM

If those charges are correct, the problem is not so much with the Paladins themselves, but rather with this Hero Klaus. The Paladins are powerfull, but not overly so, and are quite vulnerable to magic (Dark and/or Destructive). However, a 500 % charge bonus - or more - is absurd.

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PhoenixReborn
PhoenixReborn


Promising
Legendary Hero
Unicorn
posted September 06, 2006 08:43 AM

Well it seemed to me like the paladin charge was lessened in patch 1.2. (as the chart shows)

Also, Jolly Joker posted on Celestial Heavens that they are changing the way Klaus' special works in 1.3.
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Doomforge
Doomforge

Hero of Order
Mayhem Elemental
posted September 06, 2006 10:03 AM

that's good, but it'd be better for them to remove dougal from the game ;p

THAT would rebalance haven a bit. And also, training peasants to archers should be removed totally.

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Elvin
Elvin

Hero of Order
Stillness within Movement
posted September 06, 2006 10:14 AM

Quote:
Well it seemed to me like the paladin charge was lessened in patch 1.2. (as the chart shows)

Also, Jolly Joker posted on Celestial Heavens that they are changing the way Klaus' special works in 1.3.


I took a look at the post and it seems that the percentages to jousting won't be added for EACH tile the paladins move but added to the whole jousting bonus.Actually that's how I thought it worked at first and couldn't understand why his palies did SO much damage.Of course back then I didn't have the formula and it seemed he had a huge bonus-which he did but wouldn't matter as much without the 'every tile' rule.
So far I've heard of so many balance changes that I wonder if I'll be playing the same game after 1.3
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Unixmage
Unixmage


Known Hero
Demon Slayer
posted September 06, 2006 11:07 AM

Fixing paladins pales in comparison to fixing academy.

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sylvian_prince
sylvian_prince


Hired Hero
the ranged hanter
posted September 06, 2006 04:03 PM

I agree the klaus must be removen!!! the game is not balanced that way

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