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| Thread: UHHGG Chaining is BACK??? :( :( :( |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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jb239
Famous Hero
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posted May 31, 2006 08:40 PM |
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You can't hate on a strategy in a game.. Chaining in Heroes 3 didn't mean an automatic win or anything.. I was a minimal chainer, but could compete pretty well with a lot of players.
That's the joy of heroes.. there are so many strategies you can use. The only limitation is in the map... if you play a certain type of map you might limit your strategies. Remember Open vs Closed maps? Try chaining in a very open map
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted May 31, 2006 10:26 PM |
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I agree JB that chaining didnt mean an automatic win, I myself was a general and even a Field Marshall for a short time, and I did little to no chaining, but for example, you take a player that has played a map 50 times and he challenges someone else that has only played it once or twice, the chaining gave a supreme advantage, because the guy who had every hex memorized on map could manipulate the map and the game.
I just personally would have liked to seen the game continue to evolve to a point where overal skill and knowledge of the game itself gave the player the ability to create strategies etc, not simplifying it to who can memorize the maps and chain more effeciently.
I have high hopes for H5 so I am going to be open minded about it. Maybe it wont be as bad as it seems.
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balcough_dra...
Supreme Hero
unlucky? i want to pump you up
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posted May 31, 2006 10:39 PM |
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jinxer just play it man
get on the ranked channel and lets have a game i suck just as bad as a pure newbie since i never knew how to play h3 well at all
so far i see some h4 things but not many at all compared to the h3 things. sucks tho is there are only a few normal size maps so far played 3 online games 1 couldn't complete and 2 saves which i hope they will be able to actually have a final battle.
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slayer
whos your daddy and what does he do?
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jb239
Famous Hero
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posted May 31, 2006 10:53 PM |
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Well Jinxer.. without random maps you can't prevent someone from knowing a map. But if I remember correctly.. on the TOH rank page you can see what maps a person played. So if you see someone who played the same map 20 times and you never tried it.. then you might want to get a little familiar with it first 
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rychenroller
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted May 31, 2006 11:43 PM |
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Quote:
@ rychenroller -- ofcourse I respect you and your opinion, but I do want to point out that, in Heroes 3 chaining was the ONLY strategy etc.. just had to memorize the map and chain your way systematically through the map in 2 weeks and game over. After a while it wasnt about strategy but about practice and memorization of exact movements. I just think there should be more strategy is deciding which path to take or direction to go or what part of map is more important etc, instead of sweeping the entire map with no thought to strategy and planning. So if the chaining in H5 is like that, it will be the same old map memorization and 2 week rush games. However if they economy structure balances out buying all them heroes then might not be so bad. Might be a happy medium.
I disagree jinxer, I barely chained in h3 because I didnt particularly like doing it...I liked the idea of 1 hero doing all your fights (unless u had an alamar or something) I did ok in heroes 3 without it so its not the be all and end all. Chaining in h5 will automatically be different anyway mainly because 8 heroes in h5 costs over 30k gold, whereas in h3 8 heroes cost about 17k
Huge diff right there.
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted May 31, 2006 11:56 PM |
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Quote:
...Chaining in h5 will automatically be different anyway mainly because 8 heroes in h5 costs over 30k gold, whereas in h3 8 heroes cost about 17k
Huge diff right there.
And in H5, there are NO nagabanks, NO dwarvern treasuries, NO medusa stores, NO imp caches, NO stockpiles, NO utopias (at least i havenīt seen any of them yet...).
So if u manage to get 30k gold in the first 2 weeks....u prolly cheat...
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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Niagaran
Adventuring Hero
Braveheart returns
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posted May 31, 2006 11:58 PM |
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to chain or not to chain?
While it is advantageous to chain a little early to assist in the taking of lightly guarded rewards rushing is largly out of the question .
Multiple and heavier guardians often between opponents...the more I play and understand this game the better it gets...This is a new game...run with it
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bobbyohms
Adventuring Hero
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posted June 01, 2006 12:43 AM |
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I also prefer not to chain much other than bringing more troops to the front or whatever. I agree with what has been said about the cost and all that so far. Hopefully that won't go out the window once people start making maps and they plop down gold everywhere. It's a bit too early to determine how balanced the current maps are but they were designed fairly well so as to not unbalance how it appears the game is intended to be played. The game is set up to give you lots of options to decide what you should buy and build when and not the no thought way it went back in HoMM 3. You have to actually manage your money and resources a whole lot more now.
About the only thing I'd like to see is the creature stacks just a bit easier or more things you can actually kill the first week or so. Penninsula comes to mind. Your basic mines are lightly guarded but if you get a stack of shooters blocking your underground or you get beat down a bit there is very little to do for a while til you can slowly build an army to start taking things. Plus the stacks guarding the rare resource mines are pretty tough to take down too.
One other point about how chaining should be different now is with Heroes costing so much you need the couple extra that you have to go collect the extras like the waterwheels and external creature dwellings. I just hope that when more maps come out the same managing feel can be maintained and instead of more money on the map there are more battle opportunities to take advantage of the rich skill tree.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted June 01, 2006 02:20 AM |
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Thanks to all ( except Mocara ) that replied with there insites and angles on the chaining issue. It appears there are more aspects that affect the ability to chain then I realized with my first observation. I appreciate everyones replys helping to point these things out.
@Balcough -- Ofcourse I am anxious to engage you in battle. There are some old scores to settle
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Prince_Legolas
Bad-mannered
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posted June 01, 2006 02:21 AM |
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Chaining in Homm 5 completely different,strong economy like in Homm 2 even better.No Naga Banks,Dwarven Stores and other things like that=balance for a strong economy,i like that way more and now you have more tactics to create than in past series,there is no nonusefull skills and abilities,in homm 4 strategy with heroes was more straight and not that interesting,in homm 5 there is no such thing and you cant simple win, you have to think how to mix all what you have and create tactic that will bring you victory
I believe later alot of people will admit that Homm 5 is the best from all series,and not because of grafic but because of gameplay.But i believe it is core feeling will be more on Random Map.And also people will find out that most fastests games will be in Homm 5,but both players should use quick combat option and know how to play
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted June 01, 2006 05:36 AM |
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When we all experimented that a few more creatures can make the decisive blow, I strongly doubt anyone will use quick combat, even if improved.
Just think about Beltway or Broken alliance, a few goblins more and you won. I dont think Heroes changed. May change on huge maps maybe.
I dont see the point complaining about chaining while both opponents were allowed to use it. I may understand that "Hit and RUN" may sound dishonorable to some, but chaining was about planning and speeding its expansion, thus having a more adrenaline game.
But maybe some just prefer to smoke a cigar and move one hero at time.
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted June 01, 2006 07:27 AM |
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I played many players who chained & personally it becomes automatic to me.
8 heroes & by the time you are ready for a breal or a move, you heroes are already stationed for the chain.
Each day is crucial but I rarely chain orless it became automatic.
I beat some of the best players playing like a noob.
What wins you the game is strategy.
Being strategic would usually win you the game.
Usually saved my arse in alot of games, & players calling me one of the most strategic in the game is a hugh compliment for me.
I beat hugh chain players before & only having half my army & same stats or a little lower.
Knowing the field & your spells can save you if you know what your doing.
Knowing your creatures stats helps too.
Just because you cant afford all your troops vs a good oponent with all his troops,dont mean an automatic win.
Just have to use strategy.
I am confident that strategy will beat the chainer most of the time.
Ask ZUd, hes one of the best strategic player I ever played.
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Blue_Camel
Famous Hero
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posted June 01, 2006 07:34 AM |
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Quote:
Quote:
...Chaining in h5 will automatically be different anyway mainly because 8 heroes in h5 costs over 30k gold, whereas in h3 8 heroes cost about 17k
Huge diff right there.
And in H5, there are NO nagabanks, NO dwarvern treasuries, NO medusa stores, NO imp caches, NO stockpiles, NO utopias (at least i havenīt seen any of them yet...).
So if u manage to get 30k gold in the first 2 weeks....u prolly cheat...
yeah there's banks in h5.. but they're not as frequent in the maps that came with the game. i don't have all of them memorized, but i know there IS a dragon utopia, crypt, elemental stockpile, among others
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Arangar
Famous Hero
Weak ranger - lost viking
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posted June 01, 2006 10:19 AM |
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Quote:
I played many players who chained & personally it becomes automatic to me.
8 heroes & by the time you are ready for a breal or a move, you heroes are already stationed for the chain.
Each day is crucial but I rarely chain orless it became automatic.
I beat some of the best players playing like a noob.
What wins you the game is strategy.
Being strategic would usually win you the game.
Usually saved my arse in alot of games, & players calling me one of the most strategic in the game is a hugh compliment for me.
I beat hugh chain players before & only having half my army & same stats or a little lower.
Knowing the field & your spells can save you if you know what your doing.
Knowing your creatures stats helps too.
Just because you cant afford all your troops vs a good oponent with all his troops,dont mean an automatic win.
Just have to use strategy.
I am confident that strategy will beat the chainer most of the time.
Ask ZUd, hes one of the best strategic player I ever played.
I think one of your advantages is that people probably underestimate you (esp. if they've been to the HC boards)
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Arangar
Norwegian viking
ranger of the north
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Ghasteater
Known Hero
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posted June 01, 2006 10:44 AM |
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Yes, i dislike chaining strategy mostly because too easy defend your town:
Flee whith main hero and transfer his troops by chain in main town.
Now that can be cost twice as much, depending of how many heroes you have.
Also is too hard rebuild chain if enemy hero destroy some of your secondary heroes...
For example if he destroy 3 heroes in HOMM3 rerecruiting will cost 7500.
Here it can be 4000+4500+5000=13500 Nearly 2 times more.
May bebetter Hit and run and Surrender than risk that sum of money???
So "power of chaining" diminishing well...
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted June 01, 2006 03:05 PM |
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valkyrica
Supreme Hero
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posted June 01, 2006 03:34 PM |
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... and the same people that waste the oxygen don't get even the most primitive forms of sarcasm
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I'm Guybrush Threepwood, mighty pirate
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted June 01, 2006 03:45 PM |
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To think I been getting slammed by a guy who post his toh pic wearing only his bed sheet like a toga .
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Prince_Legolas
Bad-mannered
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posted June 01, 2006 04:13 PM |
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Quote:
I played many players who chained & personally it becomes automatic to me.
8 heroes & by the time you are ready for a breal or a move, you heroes are already stationed for the chain.
Each day is crucial but I rarely chain orless it became automatic.
I beat some of the best players playing like a noob.
What wins you the game is strategy.
Being strategic would usually win you the game.
Usually saved my arse in alot of games, & players calling me one of the most strategic in the game is a hugh compliment for me.
I beat hugh chain players before & only having half my army & same stats or a little lower.
Knowing the field & your spells can save you if you know what your doing.
Knowing your creatures stats helps too.
Just because you cant afford all your troops vs a good oponent with all his troops,dont mean an automatic win.
Just have to use strategy.
I am confident that strategy will beat the chainer most of the time.
Ask ZUd, hes one of the best strategic player I ever played.
Dont forget Aculias that strategy including chaining as well,it is one of the parts
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted June 01, 2006 04:18 PM |
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If I remember right, dont I always say that chaining is a strategy 
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