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Heroes Community > Heroes 5 - Temple of Ashan > Thread: purpose of these creatures?
Thread: purpose of these creatures?
emilsn
emilsn


Legendary Hero
posted January 01, 2007 06:52 PM

purpose of these creatures?

I was just playing haven here earlier and I don't play them that much(I don't like them... bad town) You people might think weird when i ask this question: Archers or marksmen?

Marksmen = PSYCO crazy dude, but well thats only when someone are near them, and yes you can get TONS of them in a sec.

But

Archers: = They can hit Mulpiple targets(I know that don't dmg alot), those you can also get a ton of in sec. and well if you have enough that Arrow barrage attack must be a good thing?!

I havn't really checked their stats but why not use those aswell? Are they really not that usefull. Archers and Markmen are maybe the biggest upgrade in the game, they change so much. so do that upgrade matter that much? (and well? how can those marksmen hit anything? their helm are covering their eyes!)

Another creature from the haven lineup: Peasent and conscribt.

Peasent: Weak, slow and bad in almost any way! But you can either train them to archers or earn money on them? and if your going to train them to Archers? no use in getting conscrips which make conspricts useless! And if not, why not have ellain and get a lot more money and just train a bit of them over time? and in the first weeks, aint a bit good to get some extra money?

Conscribt: Weak, slow and bad in so many ways! No tax payer, they are still too slow to be worthy? They got bash though which is nice but wait! They need to get close !! And its stupid to get them, if you just train them to acrhers, its actully just a waste of money?! so why are they here?

These 2 Creatures and their upgrades are maybe the most weirdest upgrades, because they change so much and that made me question their upgrades.

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RectusDominus
RectusDominus


Adventuring Hero
posted January 01, 2007 07:04 PM

* always upgrade archers to marksmen,
* only buy conscripts when u are not training and u have some spare cash left

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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
posted January 01, 2007 07:39 PM

Look,there is no contest whatsoever.Do you prefer your unit to do 2-4 or 2-8 damage?You lose 1 initiative but it's worth it.Also when having like 500 archers or marksmen would you go for half of (2-4)x500 area damage or (2-8)x500 full damage.Especially if you have divine strength,marksmen become so much better.

If someone told you you can earn money by peasants,he lied.It takes 4 weeks for them to cover their cost BEFORE they even give you a profit.And after 4-5 weeks have passed you'll want them as marksmen to gain an edge.Also no need to train them much earlier unless you will go eliminate your opponent.The point is,the best you can hope from peasants is to cover a part of their cost,maybe all.

Why?Because Nival is clueless and didn't predict everyone would start training peasants like crazy before getting angels.Otherwise while vulnerable and slow they can be a great asset in the hands of a knight.Just get vitality,battle frenzy and some might skills.They are units the opponent does not want and cannot afford to attack because of other higher priority units so they get to cross the battlefield and stun a stack or two.Not as vulnerable as you'd think.
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radar
radar


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Castle/Haven player
posted January 01, 2007 07:50 PM

1. archer or marksman?

i have thought about it also. but look:

* archer - damage 2 - 5, when marksman 2 - 8, you need to cast rigteous might on achers if you would compare their upgrade...  if you put RM on marksmans they will do much more than archers ofc. 3 damage is to much, even if archers have scatter shot

* i loooove (in hard battles, human vs human for example, or in a high diff) teleport my marksmans and do a precise shot

2. peasants or militia?

peasants! i only take them on first battles, then i am hireing ellaine and they are in town with her, giving me a cash. so, i have one more creature slot with my main hero. i am always splitting squires, s'hield allies' useful , especially with deflect arrows and evasion ability

thats my opinion.


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emilsn
emilsn


Legendary Hero
posted January 01, 2007 09:14 PM

Well Elvin you seemed to put things strait to my throat What if i had 500 Marksmen and 500 Archers, i would use my Marksmen to take the bad things away and use me archers to Clean up in my enemy's groups ? WEll they still be worth nothing?

Radar: Don't you train your peasents`? Since you buy Ellain?

how much do this: Scattershot do?

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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
posted January 01, 2007 09:41 PM

*Slits emilsn's throat for pointing that out*
Just kidding! You see most of the times it's better to use marksmen even if you have 2 stacks.This way no matter from where the enemy will approach you'll still shoot at zero defence.The only reason you'd want archers is when against heroes that use phantom forces or have a little army packed together.Say an army of 6 1 unit stacks of assassins which a warlock may use to throw a nasty spell and retreat Then you can take them out faster and get an enemy's main hero(with a bit of luck)!With clones you have the chance to kill them and damage other units too.
However the damage is 1-2.I think you can't get luck with scattershot too.So as I see it,it's not useful in most situations but leaving some unupgraded just in case can still save the day.
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emilsn
emilsn


Legendary Hero
posted January 01, 2007 11:05 PM

Well thank you... (Says the dead man ) So they are not totally useless, well all in all it bothered me that Nival made a(some) creature(s) that are different when upgraded and just wanted to know if they could be used at anything...

and what is the point with those zombies? And why are the strong and very nice Minotaur Guards so slow? And to Doomforge who loves Inferno so much, what use can I make of those horned demons?! (If it was Doomforge who is the "Demon lover") and war dancers? I seem to lose them to almost nothing...

(this is was this post is about, discussin the creatures if you want to)

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RectusDominus
RectusDominus


Adventuring Hero
posted January 01, 2007 11:23 PM

It's simple bro, they are all cannon fodder, every war needs its cannon fodder so that other units keep their faces pretty

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SS
SS


Known Hero
Strike first, Strike Hard
posted January 02, 2007 12:27 AM

if you like archer better than marksman then you should do the same thing as I did. I edited the files and switched archer and marksman places and few other thing like Hp and dammage.

here is link to how to do it:
http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=20628
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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
posted January 02, 2007 12:37 AM

Cannon fodder or guardians(to surround a unit in the corner).They are fun to use with teleport assault,especially the minos!
Generally zombies and demons I use only in earlygame.Demons might as well be sacrificed for xp but I prefer to keep them just for hellfire triggering.Wardancers I find pretty good.If you get defence and vitality,maybe leadership they are great ranged blockers.You charge them and force the opponent to deal with them or lose ranged fire.For tier 2 they sure can be very annoying.
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radar
radar


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Castle/Haven player
posted January 02, 2007 06:53 PM

Quote:

Radar: Don't you train your peasents`? Since you buy Ellain?




i train them in late game, about 40 or more for paladins, if i have enough cash, and rest on archers and then i upgradeing them to marksmans. and i complete my watsage by training also.

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emilsn
emilsn


Legendary Hero
posted January 02, 2007 09:23 PM

To Radar: Well good idea...

To Elvin: Thank you

To the rest: Thanks for answering my questions. I bow for you nobel warriors, may the light guide you. "emilsn cast Endurance on all" (I love defence spells)

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PhoenixReborn
PhoenixReborn


Promising
Legendary Hero
Unicorn
posted January 02, 2007 09:32 PM

Quote:
Cannon fodder or guardians(to surround a unit in the corner).They are fun to use with teleport assault,especially the minos!
Generally zombies and demons I use only in earlygame.Demons might as well be sacrificed for xp but I prefer to keep them just for hellfire triggering.Wardancers I find pretty good.If you get defence and vitality,maybe leadership they are great ranged blockers.You charge them and force the opponent to deal with them or lose ranged fire.For tier 2 they sure can be very annoying.


Yes war dancers are pretty good, and quite numerous.  However, for me, the wood cost is too great and it ends up being a choice between war dancers and treants.

Anyway the point of those unupgraded creatures is to be neutrals.
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Bask in the light of my glorious shining unicorn.

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