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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: Tribute to Strategists
Thread: Tribute to Strategists This thread is 18 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 · NEXT»
Rainalcar
Rainalcar


Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
posted September 28, 2008 02:23 PM bonus applied by angelito on 01 Oct 2008.
Edited by angelito at 21:23, 20 Dec 2012.

Tribute to Strategists

The links below contain the Tribute to Strategists, a strategy guide for Heroes of Might and Magic 3, in two versions, one in PDF, and the other as docx. Since I lack time to make further revisions, I placed the latter version if someone is willing to make further adjustments to it, which he is free to do. In that case I think it would be prudent to post the update in the thread, to keep track, or arrange the guide in the graphically more appealing way, but that is up to the person doing the editing.

The guide is compiled from the info collected in many places, including stuff I learned while actively playing the game. I don't claim authorship for any info presented, but some people who are the authors of some of the parts might/do, that I cannot know.

Work done is tribute to all the people that contributed to better understanding the game and made the game all the better by their efforts. It was a delight (and still is) to be a part of it all.


Download here:
Heroes 3: Tribute to Strategists

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted September 28, 2008 04:14 PM

Some interesting things there, good to learn.

A few mistakes/adds/doubts:


A well can not be visited twice same day, whatever you do.

I don't understand about statue of legion. of course, you cant equip 2 of them in the same hero, but equipping on another will not give any bonus. Only one works.

AI can cast any adventure spell when on cursed ground, not only Dim door.

I never saw AI cast water walk near water then flying over other objects. Are you sure of that?!

I dont understand either the visiting hero/and the one in garrison thing. If AI attacks a town with 2 heros in it, there will always be two fights, so splitting the army between two heros will weak them.

When all creatures die, clones will not disappear. At least in my games they dont.

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Xarfax111
Xarfax111


Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
The last hero standing
posted September 28, 2008 05:01 PM
Edited by Xarfax111 at 17:19, 28 Sep 2008.

Quote:
A well can not be visited twice same day, whatever you do.


I think its this building that give double spell points, as far as is remember correct you can go on the left and on the right and can get 2 times double spell points. Of course i can be wrong.

Quote:
I never saw AI cast water walk near water then flying over other objects. Are you sure of that?!


...there was a bug like that in old versions, even for human players.

Others i dont know, this double heroes with statue should be tested.
___________________________

Edit: Ive just started to read some of the info and im very honored that some of my 14 deleted QPs by Angelito are still alive.
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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted September 28, 2008 06:44 PM

From 14 QP to -4? Did you seduced any moderator's wife or what?

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SAG
SAG


Promising
Supreme Hero
WCL owner
posted September 28, 2008 07:23 PM

Xarfax just damaged Library by deleting all his posts including those 14 QP...

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Rainalcar
Rainalcar


Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
posted September 28, 2008 08:21 PM

Since I'm in a run, I will make a quick reply, and will investigate further later. Thanks for the feedback, it is appreciated.

You are right, not the well, but the Magic Spring, or whatever the name. I will test it all anyway.

2 Legion artifacts work for sure on garrison and visiting hero. At least at some point they did. Easy to test.

True for AI and DD .

I am pretty sure of Waterwalk. I cannot see AI's spells that is, but I know that there was no DD in any of the towns (spell was likely banned all together). But since Xarfax said it is an older versions' bug I will remove it.

If you have troops ONLY in garrison, and a visiting hero with troops as well, the AI will 'think' it has two battles to fight because the armies are split. But, of course, as soon as it attacks the visiting hero the armies are merged (where possible). I will make this clearer.

I will test the clones. Maybe it was an old version.


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Rainalcar
Rainalcar


Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
posted September 28, 2008 11:26 PM

Test results:

Magic Spring will be added.
AI can cast all spells on Cursed Ground will be added.
Waterwalk will be removed.

Clones disappear as soon as they are the only remaining unit in one's army. It is quite logical, otherwise what troops would you have after winning with a clone stack? The only other outcome possible is draw, not the case here.

Legion artifacts work as described.

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angelito
angelito


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
posted September 29, 2008 09:12 AM
Edited by angelito at 09:30, 29 Sep 2008.

- The dragon utopia hint is wrong. There is no utopia containing 4 blacks and 5 golds. And gold drags are always the most...not blacks.

- The order in imp caches or dwarven treasuries is not correct. (Typo I think) last move is by O, not by W.
____________
Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.

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Rainalcar
Rainalcar


Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
posted September 29, 2008 10:57 AM

Utopia numbers very really odd and meaningless. Will be corrected.

Yeah, E, not W.

Thanks

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night_on_earth
night_on_earth


Hired Hero
posted October 01, 2008 11:21 AM
Edited by night_on_earth at 13:52, 01 Oct 2008.

great work, Rainalcar

Just a couple of corrections concerning spell specialists:

Zubin's precision speciality gives an additional
+3 to levels 1-2
+2 to levels 3-4
+1 to levels 5-6
+0 to levels 7

on top of +3/+6 range attack from the precision spell.


Weakness does not decrease creatures' defense, instead it reduces their attack strength.


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night on earth

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Rainalcar
Rainalcar


Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
posted October 01, 2008 05:11 PM

True, Zubin was displayed as a sum of specialty and Advanced mastery, Weakness was a typo (I guess ), thanks for the tips.

All mentioned above is now corrected, and the spell probability table has been remade (thank you, Ecoris). File has been updated.


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Xarfax111
Xarfax111


Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
The last hero standing
posted October 06, 2008 04:40 PM

Unfortunately there are many things in it that are just plain wrong. Example:

"Best creatures to raise Demons from are Pikemen, Archers, Griffins, Centaurs, Dwarves, Orcs etc.
Cloned Pit Lord stack can use the specialty as well. If you have sufficient mana you can raise Demons up to 13 times per battle (7 enemy stacks, 6 friendly stacks)."

Fortunately there are some great advices in it. Example:

"A clever way to get creatures that outspeed you forward without waiting is to block your powerstack by single slow fodder units. The AI thinks you canít hit it, since your power stack is blocked and your fodder canít reach, and moves forward."

Most players dont know that simple trick.

Xarfax1
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Rainalcar
Rainalcar


Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
posted October 06, 2008 04:59 PM

That was really ludicrous. Will be fixed. But I said some very odd stuff will come up for certain.

But you said many: please state the other. And suggestions are welcome.
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Rainalcar
Rainalcar


Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
posted October 10, 2008 02:46 PM

New version uploaded, all reported bugs fixed, spell appearance table finally concluded.
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rainalcar
rainalcar


Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
posted December 02, 2008 11:49 PM

A 3rd post in a row, but it had to be.

New version of the manual now has more then 30 pages more (from 30 it rose to 62). There are stuff in it that very few people know, and stuff that can't be found anywhere on HC. I doubt there is a better guide on game mechanics anywhere else to be found (take a look just at the Orb of Vulnerability section for instance). If I posted all of it separately I could probably get 5-10 red stars . Even if you read the former version, read this one too, I believe there is a bunch of new interesting stuff. I fixed mistakes where I found them. If you find more, let me know.

Download link is in the 1st post (2 MB, PDF).

By doing this my work is now complete. Any future additions may arise from your advices only. See you on GS .
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maretti
maretti


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted December 03, 2008 12:38 AM

"If I posted all of it separately I could probably get 5-10 red stars."

Dont count on it.
____________
Crag rules, Orrin and Ivor suck

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maretti
maretti


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted December 03, 2008 02:44 AM
Edited by maretti at 23:45, 03 Dec 2008.

I take my hat of to you. This is really great stuff. May I ask how the hell you found out about all this?

I have a few comments:

"Two heroes of the same type can never appear at the same time in the Tavern."

They can at the start of the week and in other cases too.

"the only heroes a player cannot buy on his turn are the ones offered in other players' Taverns at the same time and those in game."

And prison heroes.

"If you have more than 1 external dwelling flagged and then you build Portal of Summoning you will get the creature whose dwelling you flagged last."

Not true. Its random.

"Turrets aim mostly at shooters, so some fodder shooter stack can be used. If there are empty slots then you should divide the shooters (numbers are irrelevant), and the Towers will not aim to maximize damage by shooting other stacks, but will shoot the shooter stack instead."

If you have shooters in your army and empty slots place as many single shooters to the right in your line up as possible. The turrets will allways hit the stacks in the bottom of the screen first even though it is total overkill.

"If the opponent has Expert Tactics he can never deploy his shooter stack in a way to cover both opposite corners, you will always be able to place a 1-hex unit (only) in one of those corners, and it will receive half the damage."

What do you mean? I dont get it.

"The AI can retreat even if all of his stacks are blinded if he possesses any War Machine (Ammo Cart included). Artillery skill is irrelevant."

Dosent go for ammo cart and tent if no damage is to be healed from the tent.

"AI will rather hit your Imps then your Gogs."

In most cases anyway.

"AI controlled Harpy (Hags) will always try to block shooters, including Ballistae or Catapults, without attacking them, and after they succeed in that will they begin attacking."

Not true.

"AI stacks will go for the nearest creature (that is out of reach) unless there is a ranged creature within 2 rounds movement."

Not true. They often try to cornor slow stacks or avoid that your slow stacks get out og their reach.

"AI will never wait if it can attack."

Not true. But in most cases.

"If your shooter stack is not blocked AI will attack it if possible, unless there is another stack which he can attack and block the shooters"

Not true.

"If playing Shakti and having a large stack of Troglodytes you must place them on 1 (i.e. you must attack and kill the Vampires) if they are going to act first. The reason is that if you wait with them next round Vampires will go first. If you have Infernal Troglodytes you will be of same speed."

Since you cant get crypts in the underground you will be on dirt with dungeon and the vamps will move first unless you have inf trogs and neclace of speed on shakti.

"Also not recommended, Behemoths can get into speed troubles (Cure would be very helpful but you have only 6% probability to get it in Strongholdís Mage Guild)"

You dont build guild in stronghold towns week 1 anyway.

"Donít ever split your Behemoths Ė if some of them get stoned the lonely Behemoth will die."

I wouldnt say "ever".

"It is possible to take a full Utopia with shooters (Grand Elves), or appropriate level 7 flyer (Archangels, Archdevils) very early if accompanied by Force Field spell (costs 12) and sufficient mana."

Make sure your opponent are willing to give you loads.

"In general, Utopias are late Week 2 or Week 3 fights."

On jebus that is.

"You can also separate the Archangels to 3 + 4 (never less than 3) so that you can resurrect twice. This will work even without Shield, but you will need a good Cure and a good hero (Tazar would be best)."

Hack RULES!

"STRONGHOLD
Crag Hack can take a full Conservatory w2d1 with 3 Ancient Behemoths, Wolf Raiders, Thunderbirds etc. even without (mass) spells if he has sufficient stats (10 or close in A/D)."

Sure he can!

"Therefore, if you have Dragons of any sort, it is important to position your troops so that the Flys cannot cause a Firebreath attack against your stack."

Just place single fodder on 3, 4 and 5.

"If you play almost any popular random template and see dirt road instead of a cobblestone road it usually means that the map is bugged, and restart is necessary."

I wouldnt say usually, but the chance of bugs seems to be higher.

____________
Crag rules, Orrin and Ivor suck

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rainalcar
rainalcar


Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
posted December 03, 2008 02:03 PM

Quote:
Dont count on it.


Yeah, I know, interesting but useless . Cheers mate
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maretti
maretti


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted December 03, 2008 02:19 PM
Edited by maretti at 14:21, 03 Dec 2008.

Thats not what i meant. Much of it is very usefull even in online games.
____________
Crag rules, Orrin and Ivor suck

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rainalcar
rainalcar


Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
posted December 03, 2008 02:39 PM

Quote:
I take my hat of to you. This is really great stuff. May I ask how the hell you found out about all this?


By testing, playing, talking with others, I had some people I knew on russian heroes scene as well in the old days. I told you I played decent back then . As for your comments, I won't even quote those that you are completely correct with, mate . And in my defense regarding specific battle tactics, large majority of it isn't mine . 9/10 things you saw wrong are leftovers from God knows where. I did introduce some mistakes, like PoS. K, on to the comments:

Quote:

If you have shooters in your army and empty slots place as many single shooters to the right in your line up as possible. The turrets will allways hit the stacks in the bottom of the screen first even though it is total overkill.


Nice, I've forgotten of this.

Quote:
"If the opponent has Expert Tactics he can never deploy his shooter stack in a way to cover both opposite corners, you will always be able to place a 1-hex unit (only) in one of those corners, and it will receive half the damage."

What do you mean? I dont get it.


I don't recall exactly, but I think this is from a very peculiar fight I had years ago. It means that you can't position your 1-hex shooter with Expert Tactics so that it covers entire field with full arrow. Either the upper right or the lower right hex will remain with penalty. Yes, useless . But there was one game where this was very interesting, I won because of this fact, but beats me what was it about.

Quote:
Dosent go for ammo cart and tent if no damage is to be healed from the tent.


Elaborate?

Quote:
"AI will never wait if it can attack."

Not true. But in most cases.


When will it wait?

Quote:
"It is possible to take a full Utopia with shooters (Grand Elves), or appropriate level 7 flyer (Archangels, Archdevils) very early if accompanied by Force Field spell (costs 12) and sufficient mana."

Make sure your opponent are willing to give you loads.


He, he. It's not all about winning, I managed this a few times (lost more then won in total of course, but I don't recall exactly), but the feeling when I did succeed was better then 99% of all victories.

Quote:
"Therefore, if you have Dragons of any sort, it is important to position your troops so that the Flys cannot cause a Firebreath attack against your stack."

Just place single fodder on 3, 4 and 5.


Yes, that's nice.


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