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Heroes Community > Heroes 5 - Modders Workshop > Thread: Map making questions!! Thread for anyone asking any mapping questions!
Thread: Map making questions!! Thread for anyone asking any mapping questions!
HeroicDman81
HeroicDman81


Hired Hero
posted November 03, 2016 03:34 AM

Map making questions!! Thread for anyone asking any mapping questions!

On my quest to making my first full and complete map, I have come up with many questions... I think most, I resolved, or I moved past without, but... now I have question concerning Cartographers!

We have TWO Cartographer buildings that get placed on the map... one for the land, and the other for the water... Obviously in respective to where they are placed, determines what is revealed upon the map, this I know!!

However... I thought, it only made sense, in respect to the SubTerranean barrier, if the Cartographer's are built on the map underground, they reveal their respective map underground!!

So why is it, playing the map in test play mode, those under ground only reveal those above??

I'm only using the Water Cartographers on my map, only in the waters between main lands native to each player. My map is 8 players, with 4 under ground in similar pattern laid out to those above, but invertedly. For those familiar with map making/modding; the only way to include water underground, is by using the River tool in the tile paint tool tab, and stretch the waters wide, and deep, it still appears to be bodies of water, lakes.

I have Cartographers placed in same fashion, in the waters between the main native lands for each player, with the assumption that these "Underground Water Cartographers" would reveal the "Underground Waters"...

... it does NOT!!

Anyone know why? Anyone know how I can edit the Cartographer in the map editing to reveal the underground instead of the above ground?? Any ideas? Please advise!!

Thanks.

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bloodsucker
bloodsucker


Supreme Hero
posted November 03, 2016 09:18 AM
Edited by bloodsucker at 09:23, 03 Nov 2016.

There is a recent thread here about map making, the author knows what he is doing just made some of the best maps ever, maybe you should take a look.
H3 The Mapmaker's Thread

in respect to the SubTerranean barrier, if the Cartographer's are built on the map underground, they reveal their respective map underground!!

There is also a Cartographer for the underground, look in the subterran page

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HeroicDman81
HeroicDman81


Hired Hero
posted November 03, 2016 04:32 PM
Edited by HeroicDman81 at 16:35, 03 Nov 2016.

Heroes 5 Cartographers

Thx for the input, I will look into that thread, maybe see if I can get ahold of the writer.

As for the Cartographers, I double checked. In Heroes 5, map making, the placement tool of objects, there are two sections to the tool, one section is non interactive objects for the terrain, rocks and trees and stuff, and than there are interactive objects, buildings and shrines and stuff. Some times, under the non interactive object list, you will also find one or two buildings that can be interactive with a certain group of land, like the Oasis for Sand.

The only "Subterranean" object list is that under the non-interactive section, though I double checked it, and there are no Cartographer buildings.

I double checked the list where most buildings are found, and there are no Subterranean Cartographer, just the one Cartographer used for land above ground.

The Water Cartographer is under the Water Obejects list, and only one is found there as well!

I happened to notice, the reference to a thread you gave me only referenced H3, or I'm assuming Heroes 3. You do know we are talking about Heroes 5 right?? Two different games.

Maybe you got confused which game we were talking about?

As for Heroes 5, the map I been making, and currently testing in a play through... the Under ground Water-Cartographer ONLY reveals the waters ABOVE ground! Hence why I'm asking the question, how to set it up to reveal which side of the Terranean barrier it's on, because it does not.

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HeroicDman81
HeroicDman81


Hired Hero
posted November 08, 2016 05:09 AM
Edited by HeroicDman81 at 08:19, 08 Nov 2016.

Restricted lands for Asha?

I have another question...

Placing the Grail Artifact, the Tears of Asha, is their any limitations on the LAND that it can be dug up from??

I placed the Tear of asha on the map, so I know the general location, though it's got a limit of upto 15 tiles, to be anywhere on specific island of the map. Trying to DIG for it, the Hero sat still for entire day, the following day, without moving, the DIG button near the action wheel, is GREY out, so Digging is NOT Available? Anywhere on map.

I have mountains and trees placed throughout the area, to limit the access where heroes can pass, with alot of free passing land in between blocked by some Keyguard gates... it's quite a maze!!

SO i'm wondering, Where ever I place this GRAIL, will it automatically place it in a safe passage spot within the random zone specified, a free passage of the land, where the heroes will have access to dig it? Or is their Chance it will end up under an IMPASSIBLE terrain like a mountain or tile with trees?

Even considering that possibility, it doesn't matter where the Asha ends up right, any time the Heroe meets the "lack of movement" requirement to dig, it still allows digging, just to find nothing... where the Island is, all the heroes for 8 different players are trying to "Dig" around the area where I setup for the Tear, and every hero, though already sitting for 1 turn, even 2 turns, still has no access to Dig on the spot he sitting. So this has to be a problem with the Land Tile, right?

Another possible thought I tested... some of the land has various "Swampish" grass or leaves, on a greenish swampish land tile, like it's in a swamp idea. So even though some of the free tiles are "passible", they still have Grass laid out, as well as passable weeds. However, when I thought that's to be, I moved hero on tiles without ANY grass or weeds, and had him "wait" til his/her next turn... and he was still unable to "Dig".

Any ideas?? If anyone knows specifics of what Tiles can hold the Tear of Asha artifact... please let me know! If it's something as simple as changing the Tile paint... i will, but I'd like to know what I can use.

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markkur
markkur


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
posted November 08, 2016 04:39 PM

HeroicDman81 said:
I have another question...

Placing the Grail Artifact, the Tears of Asha, is their any limitations on the LAND that it can be dug up from??

.........

Any ideas?? If anyone knows specifics of what Tiles can hold the Tear of Asha artifact... please let me know! If it's something as simple as changing the Tile paint... i will, but I'd like to know what I can use.


Make absolutely sure you have not put it somewhere where there is any other object on the same tile. Also if you added Fire or water around it after placement? that could block digging it up as well. And make sure you did not MASK-over it's trigger-cell.

I have "physically" placed it on any terrain so that is not the issue, just make sure you "Allow" the ToA in the Artifact list.

Hope that helps.

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HeroicDman81
HeroicDman81


Hired Hero
posted November 08, 2016 07:59 PM

markkur said:
HeroicDman81 said:
I have another question...

Placing the Grail Artifact, the Tears of Asha, is their any limitations on the LAND that it can be dug up from??

.........

Any ideas?? If anyone knows specifics of what Tiles can hold the Tear of Asha artifact... please let me know! If it's something as simple as changing the Tile paint... i will, but I'd like to know what I can use.


Make absolutely sure you have not put it somewhere where there is any other object on the same tile. Also if you added Fire or water around it after placement? that could block digging it up as well. And make sure you did not MASK-over it's trigger-cell.

I have "physically" placed it on any terrain so that is not the issue, just make sure you "Allow" the ToA in the Artifact list.

Hope that helps.


Trigger Cell? Explain please. Are you referring to the Tile it's on?

I have tried setting it on tiles with nothing on where the Grail is set, though 2-3 tiles in either dir, there are trees, mountain, and Cliff to water... all 2 tiles away. I'm trying to place it on an Island. Normally I want it placed in Middle of Isl with a radius of 5 or so, but there are "ogject" lakes and Mountains near by, including the corners of. If you picture an "Object" Lake placed 4x caddy corner to each, so a 2x2 square in between the 4x lakes with nothing... i'm trying to place it there is where I initially wanted to place it. Nothing else on the same four tiles, however the 1st or 2nd tile exiting from the 2x2 center, going out, are Random stack of Tier 7 creatures, all four directions.

TOO Much? Idk! I don't see why. Although the problem appears to be, I can't dig up the Grail... the problem isn't digging it up... I don't think it's related to where it's placed. THE Problem, is, as I've tested, the HERO is not allowed to DIG anywhere on this "island" i'm placing it on. Setting up a test, I removed the Grail from the original loc i wanted, found another open area of isl and placed the Grail. Open terrain, Conquest Mud tiles, all 4x dir, atleast one tile space... so a 3x3 box of nothing surrounding the Grail. I place a hero for player 1, 2x tiles from the grail.

Running test, at start, without moving... Hero is not allowed to dig. I first move him on the tile I know I placed the grail. I used references on the map where I placed it, to know specifically which tile. Before ending turn, the other hero for player one starting at castle... i move to open land away from castle, and end turn.

Next turn, the hero looking for grail, is NOT allowed to DIG! No movements! No actions at start of turn, not allowed to dig! After checking and noting that...  I than move hero as far away from the grail as I can... 10 or so tiles, til he runs out of movement. The other hero, not moving... in area of castle but away from it, CAN DIG. So he does testing theory. Completely diff isl, desert sands.  When I end turn, and the next turn comes... the Hero looking for the Grail whom has sense moved as far from grail as could, fresh turn, no movement... STILL unable to Dig!

So in my theory, it has nothing to do with the grail or how i'm setting it up... it has to do with the Isl the Grail is on. Only theory i see... still can't figure out what is different about where the hero is. I still don't think it's related to the grail though. If I took the grail off the isl and put it somewhere else... i still wouldn't be able to dig on that isl, where as the Desert sand island I could, without the grail!

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markkur
markkur


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
posted November 08, 2016 09:34 PM

I'm sending you an HCM
____________
"Poetry is a felt change of consciousness"

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frostysh
frostysh


Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
WHY?
posted March 23, 2017 06:23 PM

I am looking how to create a cool map for multiplayer with AI

I have spent almost few hours looking for a whay to create a normal map of Heroes 5: ToTE, I have read markkur's guid-wikia, or whatever it's called, and I still have not realized what I need to do. Why I have spent time for this nonsense, I dkn, but, well frostysh will try himself as a map designer

The future map crucial factors

--- The landscape like a one of ma' favorite maps for multiplayer - "War", with few islands.

--- AI friendly map (actually I prefer to play with machines that with peoples, Idkn why .)

--- Map will have four players, two teams, each team will have two players, - (this is for me and ma' friend games)

--- The factions must be optional. I mean on the start of the game players can choose what they want.

--- I will try to make a map with some balance, symmetry, etc..

What buttons I need to push in this crazy frigging Map Editor to make a cool map.

Questions:

--- Can I use those insane Random Map Generator to help me to build ma' snow? I mean, may I need to create some special template, etc. And how I can to perform that???

--- Why, if I am trying to create a game with RMG map that I have modified for teamplay 2x2, ma' friend cannot join to me via hamachi, tunngle and other snow, coz' "Heroes 5: ToTE" program saying that we have a "different patches" or something like that, but with the default maps it's working ok???

Thanx for the answers! *going in GIMP to create a sketch of the map*
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dredknight
dredknight


Supreme Hero
disrupting the moding industry
posted March 23, 2017 07:46 PM

If you want to play clean ToTe with nice random generated map, my advice is to make 2 game folders.
1 - ToTE
2. MMH55

Use the MMH55 Advanced RMG to make a map of your choice (and mapmixer to fix the water if you want water) then put the map in ToTe folder and play clean ToTe on it.

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frostysh
frostysh


Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
WHY?
posted March 23, 2017 08:00 PM
Edited by frostysh at 20:12, 23 Mar 2017.

dredknight said:
If you want to play clean ToTe with nice random generated map, my advice is to make 2 game folders.
1 - ToTE
2. MMH55

Use the MMH55 Advanced RMG to make a map of your choice (and mapmixer to fix the water if you want water) then put the map in ToTe folder and play clean ToTe on it.

Where I can find this Advanced RMG?

/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

Another question - If I want to balance the early game for a faction on Heroic difficulty:

--- If you starting with Dungeon, the placing as a monster for a mines, etc the magically protected guys: Golems for an example.

--- If you starting with a Necropolis, more creature that protected from Dark Magic, and more monster that cannot be raise from the dead, after the battle.

--- If you starting with a Haven/Sylvan, more monster combined with AoE spells users, more archers, etc: 3 Mages + 20 Squares, etc..

How I can to configure ma' map for that? Which thing I need to edit?

Thanx.

And yeah, which monster will be harder to beat in the early game for: Dungeon with invis and stuff, for Sylvan, and for Haven, and for Fortress with their rune-stuff?
____________

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magnomagus
magnomagus


Promising
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
posted March 23, 2017 08:31 PM

Quote:
Use the MMH55 Advanced RMG to make a map of your choice (and mapmixer to fix the water if you want water) then put the map in ToTe folder and play clean ToTe on it.


NO! that is impossible, clean TOE will not recognize the new artifacts and adventure objects.
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frostysh
frostysh


Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
WHY?
posted March 23, 2017 09:14 PM

magnomagus said:

NO! that is impossible, clean TOE will not recognize the new artifacts and adventure objects.
As I have said before - the hell. And curse-curse this Ubisoft, Heroes 3, 4 was even more cool in case of multiplayer than those crazy stuff with Heroes 5.

Anyway the pre-sketch of ma' map is ready, so for now I need to realize how to use the help of this crazy program - Map Editor to create ma' map.
____________

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dredknight
dredknight


Supreme Hero
disrupting the moding industry
posted March 23, 2017 11:51 PM
Edited by dredknight at 23:54, 23 Mar 2017.

magnomagus said:
Quote:
Use the MMH55 Advanced RMG to make a map of your choice (and mapmixer to fix the water if you want water) then put the map in ToTe folder and play clean ToTe on it.


NO! that is impossible, clean TOE will not recognize the new artifacts and adventure objects.


True but it works.

However have in mind that this is tested with scripts not activated only so the map elements are in RMG state (Elements have no static IDS defined, so map is rendered in game on day 1).  Map elements and artifacts are set to what Tote has in its database.

If scripts are activated and map is saved random elements are set to statics and then it is possible issues to occur.
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magnomagus
magnomagus


Promising
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
posted March 24, 2017 12:11 AM
Edited by magnomagus at 00:12, 24 Mar 2017.

Quote:
True but it works.


if it works technically doesn't mean it works as a game, if you pickup artifacts without properties etc. This is not a way to give people useful advice.
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dredknight
dredknight


Supreme Hero
disrupting the moding industry
posted March 24, 2017 07:58 AM
Edited by dredknight at 07:59, 24 Mar 2017.

magnomagus said:
Quote:
True but it works.


if it works technically doesn't mean it works as a game, if you pickup artifacts without properties etc. This is not a way to give people useful advice.


I agree with you, but this is not the case.
Setup and went on a huge ARMG map with 5 AIs.
Gave myself some cheat army and went to see what is going on.
cleared out 2 zones, all artifacts were on place.
The only issue I did found is that there was an OrcBurrow which had no text or description.

When the hero enters inside it is like fighting elemental stockpile (4 stacks of elementals, one of each type). The prize you get is also what stockpile gives (resources of all kinds).

I also met a stone Vault which was acting like default stone vault.




The experience is not as MMH55 but compared for ToTe players it is just fine. I will be away for a few days so i will be able to do more tests next week.


I admit that this should be unsupported but if ToTe players can use it, why not?
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magnomagus
magnomagus


Promising
Legendary Hero
modding wizard
posted March 24, 2017 01:05 PM

you can fix artifacts using random blocks, but many objects will be removed from the map making areas very empty. Besides Simonak already had created RTMG tool to deal with H5 TOE RMG maps. All in all 2 H5 installations for this seems to me wasting lot of disk space for doubtful improvement.
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dredknight
dredknight


Supreme Hero
disrupting the moding industry
posted March 24, 2017 03:57 PM

It is true that areas are a bit empty and no special sites are present.

Frostysh explore this as far as you want on your own or use Simonak RTMG. Sometimes heroes is not about playing but finding how it works best for you.
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frostysh
frostysh


Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
WHY?
posted March 24, 2017 09:05 PM
Edited by frostysh at 14:27, 27 Mar 2017.

The curse to all of that. It is too complicated....
For now I have start to build ma' own cool map 2x2, with Rocks, with cool terrain, even a some little sea is present. The size is "large", like in my favorite default map with Island - "The War".

Bot son of the preacher man "Map Editor" saying me about multiple errors, especially after I have use "Rise" program under existing object such us "Ore Mine" and "Sawmill". I have briefly read markkur' guide, and I have a first very simple question:

How the hell I can to make "Delling" building on the map be the same as a Base nearby. Same as on the default ubi map - 'War'. coz I have 4 Bases, all is "Random Town" so I need to make some dwelling nearby that can be captured to each one. I hope whoever read this is understand ma' snow question.

P.S. I am not using hard language, that replaced by a word "snow" I am directly typing "snow" instead.

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

I have successfuly made a basic terrain. and basic roads. and after I have used "Lower"/"Rise" tools I have obtain such messages in the log stuff:
Quote:
Map has no restrictions for Max Hero Level
Map has no rumours!
Object and craig intersection: 6:83, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 5:83, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 5:84, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 5:85, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 4:85, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 4:86, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 3:86, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 3:87, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 3:88, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 96:4, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 95:4, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 94:4, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 93:4, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 92:4, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 95:3, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 92:3, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 91:3, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 90:3, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 89:3, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 73:164, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 73:165, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 73:166, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 72:167, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 73:167, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 72:168, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 72:169, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 73:169, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 71:163, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 72:163, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 73:163, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 73:170, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 74:170, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 75:170, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 76:170, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 77:170, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 153:55, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 154:55, ground floor.
Object and craig intersection: 152:55, ground floor.
There are towns without specialization! It's coordinates are: 8:86 93:7 169:85 74:166

Is this ok, or is this I need to fix something coz' the map will not work?

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

Added to the ma' map many trees (scorched ones), almost the all necessary mines to each tow, shipyards, many mountains, few rivers, and two bridges - it's look ice!

After I will done the second team terrain and adjust the first one, for little bit, I will start to add the monsters, treasures, etc.
How many monsters, treasure I approximately need to reach the ~20 level for the player' main heroes???

P.S. It's looks like a nobody have any interest anymore in the map-making for the Heroes 5 :S .
____________

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emil6011
emil6011

Tavern Dweller
posted April 20, 2017 08:46 PM

Cannot create user campaning

Hey guys sorry idk if its correct thread for it but im new to forum and i need quickly help.I cannot create user campaning when i click to create user campaning in map editor and i click to add missions to my campaning i dont see any maps to choose! But all of my maps which i made are in folder maps.Please help

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