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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: Pick one of these - Part 2
Thread: Pick one of these - Part 2
phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted August 23, 2019 11:15 PM

Poll Question:
Pick one of these - Part 2

In the first poll you chose Expert Town Portal as your prefered bonus, for your main hero.
What would choose between these and why?

Responses:
Shackles of War
Wizard's Well
 View Results!

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The_Polyglot
The_Polyglot


Promising
Supreme Hero
Approaching meltdown
posted August 24, 2019 12:40 AM

Do we know anything about the map? Are we playing Vs AI or vs human enemies? What is the win condition? Is there a time limit? Is it a puzzle map?
____________
Meds have been adjusted, should be sane for now

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted August 24, 2019 07:27 AM

I did'nt specify it anymore in part 1 and neither will I in part 2.
Can you tell me when you would pick Shackles and when you would pick WW?
Guess I should have added a 3rd "It depends" option.

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Gravedigger
Gravedigger


Hired Hero
posted August 25, 2019 11:29 AM

I would choose shackles. Since most of PVP games the battle starts at the end of match and mostly there is only one deciding battle, this kind of artifact is pretty much useless anyway but when opponent will try hit and run tactic this artifact has a sense.

I like idea of wizard well but it takes useful slots, has only sense when map is large XL or G scale without wells, and you are far from city. Otherwise No

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The_Polyglot
The_Polyglot


Promising
Supreme Hero
Approaching meltdown
posted August 25, 2019 05:29 PM

I'd consider shackles more useful vs human enemies, as it counters hit and run. Most templates you don't depend much on magic anyway. That said, maps can be designed so that shackles become useless and well is crucial
____________
Meds have been adjusted, should be sane for now

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monere
monere


Supreme Hero
posted August 25, 2019 05:46 PM

The_Polyglot said:
I'd consider shackles more useful vs human enemies, as it counters hit and run. Most templates you don't depend much on magic anyway. That said, maps can be designed so that shackles become useless and well is crucial
in no situation will shackles become useless because it stops enemy heroes from getting away and in every HoMM game you fight against other heroes. So, shackles are useful in all situations

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted August 25, 2019 05:54 PM

Shackles are overrated by inexperienced players.

It's just a matter of planning, at no time a scout should be able to hit&run your main while carrying a full army, also is not that hard to perform the right actions in a battle thus AI will not think to run away before it is incapacitated to do so. Remember, AI is coded so such shortcuts are there inside the code.

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monere
monere


Supreme Hero
posted August 25, 2019 06:21 PM

yes, I am noob, I know. But there are times when an enemy scout can hit&run your main, like for example when you play Stronghold against Inferno / Conflux and the enemy gets sultans / phoenixes and has armagheddon. No matter how good you are he will still phuck you up if you don't have shackles. He'll hit%run you until you nervously break down

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted August 25, 2019 06:26 PM
Edited by phoenix4ever at 18:34, 25 Aug 2019.

@Sal AI is kinda unpredictable, all you know is it WILL run away when it "feels" it has lost the battle. You can do stuff such as Blind or Mass Haste/Slow and kill everything before it tries to escape, but it is often hard to know exatcly when it will try to retreat.
I would'nt say Shackles is overrated, it's essentially "The hero killer and artifact collector" and I think it's extremely powerful.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted August 25, 2019 06:34 PM

Guys, let be real, shall we? The only advantage AI has is to run away when it feels he lost the battle, so can keep that main hero a bit longer.

The big advantage YOU have is reloading every battle where AI got one morale more than allowed, right?

So there.

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted August 25, 2019 06:35 PM

What does that have to do with Shackles?

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted August 25, 2019 06:41 PM

because when you put the shackles, get blind and resurrect, there is nothing AI can do about, no matter how big army has, there is always a way to trick it.

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monere
monere


Supreme Hero
posted August 25, 2019 06:47 PM

well, yeah, the humans have way more advantages against the AI than vice-versa, but I was speaking about PvP scenarios. In a situation like I've described you can have all of the in-combat spells you want, but if a player gets sultans / phoenixes * armagheddon against your stronghold army he'll hit&run you till it gets out of your ears... if you don't have shackles I mean. This artifact is a must have in any game

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The_Polyglot
The_Polyglot


Promising
Supreme Hero
Approaching meltdown
posted August 25, 2019 06:50 PM

There are maps with no enemy heroes, or where fighting enemy heroes are but a distraction you cannot afford  rendering shackles moot.
____________
Meds have been adjusted, should be sane for now

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted August 25, 2019 06:54 PM

Salamandre said:
there is nothing AI can do about, no matter how big army has, there is always a way to trick it.

And that is exactly the reason why I dislike Shackles.

Thanks guys, you are really helping me making sure I made the right decision about Town Portal, Shackles and Wizard's Well.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted August 25, 2019 06:55 PM

monere said:
but if a player gets sultans / phoenixes * armagheddon against your stronghold army he'll hit&run you till it gets out of your ears... if you don't have shackles I mean. This artifact is a must have in any game


Armageddon? Then you deserve it, letting opponent inferno to survive until he built mage 4. Stronghold is quick power.

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monere
monere


Supreme Hero
posted August 25, 2019 07:23 PM

not me cause I never play against people, but I'm sure someone, at some point has stumbled upon a scenario like I've described without having any say in his defeat.

It doesn't matter, though. What matters is that shackles are more important than the wizard's well, because that's the topic of this thread

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ReinePedauque
ReinePedauque


Adventuring Hero
faerie
posted September 02, 2019 01:51 PM

monere said:
not me cause I never play against people, but I'm sure someone, at some point has stumbled upon a scenario like I've described without having any say in his defeat.

It doesn't matter, though. What matters is that shackles are more important than the wizard's well, because that's the topic of this thread


why no pvp?

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monere
monere


Supreme Hero
posted September 02, 2019 07:45 PM

Quote:
why no pvp?


1. no time anymore
2. i'm way behind in terms of skill, and I don't have reasons to improve my skill, also don't have the time either
3. the AI gives me a big enough challenge to keep me occupied for years
4. I'm too cool to play against people

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Avatar86
Avatar86

Tavern Dweller
posted September 05, 2019 10:52 PM

Shackles all day and night baby ^_^

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