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Heroes Community > Heroes 4 - Lands of Axeoth > Thread: Collection of Thoughts for Ideas in HOMM4 (repost)
Thread: Collection of Thoughts for Ideas in HOMM4 (repost)

Mage of the Land
Naughty, Naughty Valeriy
posted March 22, 2001 09:51 PM

Collection of Thoughts for Ideas in HOMM4 (repost)

Ironwill [guest] from Heroes Community  
Collection of Thoughts for Ideas in HOMM4  Posted 11-6-2000 21:18  

Ok....this is a collection of ideas for Homm4 in addittion to the summary I posted....they are just ideas from my point of view.....perhaps some are good and some are bad...but here they are:

---- new artifacts such as Offensive and Armorer Bonus artifacts. As well as elemental artifacts such as "Ice Bow" which does additional cold damage for all ranged attackers in that hero's army.

---- I think the taverns should be aligned to the town's alignment. If you have a castle town then all heroes available for hire in that tavern should be of GOOD or NEUTRAL alignment. If Necro then EVIL or NEUTRAL. If Stronghold, then any alignment hero is applicable.

---- Dungeon town should have either Alamar or Jedite wiped out. preferably Alamar. Having one Res hero available for one town type is ONE thing, but to have TWO of them and one has the ability to teach his spell, is totally another thing.

---- Stronghold and Fortress Creatures need to be reassessed. Stronghold lacks a solid 6th level fighting creature( too far away and half damage is done by cyclops, and get up close and personal to em and they do half damage again) Stronghold has only 3 durable effective fighting units: Ancient behemoths, Thunderbirds, and Ogremagi. If you will look at all other towns, they have 4. Example Rampart: Gold Dragons, Silver Pegasi, Dendroid Soldiers, and War Unicorns. Inferno: ArchDevils, Efreet Sultans, Pit Lords, Cerebri, and Horned Demons. the reason I dont include hobgoblins or wolf raiders in this is simply because they are too weak. In most cases they are not that many near the end game to make a difference and what of them that are available are easily destroyed in contrary to Centaur Captains and Battle Dwarfs.
Fortress is somewhat ok but overall slow as is Stronghold....a Mass Haste spell is required for these two towns to become effective at fighting, and Mass Haste is not common with either. In alot of fights its usually the first 3 rounds that decide the battle. and in those 3 rounds speed and initiative are critical.

---- On behalf of Mango2k(his idea) the ability to place multiple grails on maps in cases of allied games or what not, in order for each player to have the opportunity to build a grail if gotten in time.

---- Another note on Heroes....We all have a somewhat good idea of what "realistic" midevil characters should look like back in those fantasy filled days. For instance, Crag Hack an incredibly powerful barbarian fighter/leader with incredible aggressive prowess on the battlefield. Ok..got that thought in your head? now...can you REALLY see him casting a Meteor Shower spell or Chained Lightning?? the answer...NO I think this game has gotten the concept of Role Playing just a lil bit out of context. What I propose is that the Hero levelling system be REWORKED. Heroes have certain skills that are not available to them for instance, Wisdom should not be available for Barbarians. and BasicWisdom should be the Maximum for Knights or Overlords. This restriction goes both ways as in Clerics should not be able to attain offensive skill and only basic armorer. Wizards should not be allowed either offense or armorer. Death Knights should not be allowed Wisdom as they are only Undead Warriors. Witches huts are a Abomination of what is "normal" in that world and can teach a certain hero basic wisdom who would normally not be able to learn it through levelling through witchery. However...because of that hero's restriction in leveling, he cannot be offered an advancement in it. This is What a True Hero should be in this game. In almost ALL Dungeons and Dragon Games...Heroes are defined by their limitations to their specialties. Why should this one be any different. I just find it annoying how Alkin, lowintelligence, Highphysical Hero, can come to a point where he can cast 1700 damage Chained Lightning Spell. Lets keep it real folks.

---- Does the Creature Specialty thing really work? because I havent seen evidence of it when a hero (galthran for example) has reached 15th level. I havent seen 14/14 att/def added to his skeletons. If so then it needs to be fixed, because It is of no use to have a creature specialty if it doesnt properly reflect the exp and levels attained.

---- I think Heroes should come with a Minor Artifact already given to them at start of game because of the fact that a leader should have a REASON to be a leader...and bearing an artifact is one good one. this artifact should does not replace a starting bonus either

---- In Heroes4, you should have the ability to create your own Hero using a simple Hero creation Option in Main Menu should be available. Once within it, you are given 5 attribute points to Distribute to your blank hero. You also are allowed to pick a minor artifact for him, and 3 skill points(basic intell, basic air, basic earth/ or basic wisdom, adv earth/ or Expert Earth) Also you must choose alignment, specialty, and Heroe type(for skill restriction purposes) Also you are allowed to have a starting group of you Loyal Unit(see next item below for reference) on your hero.

---- Heroes should be assigned a Loyal Unit alignment. That hero will start with a group of that army in addition to his basic town assigned creatures. A Loyal Unit is that of which in ANY CASE if a hero encounters this creature on the adventure map, the option for Joining the Hero is always given, regardless of the "attitude" of the said creature. These Loyal Units should be restricted to level 1-3 creature types as for anything higher could give an unfair advantage on maps depending on random placements. If your Hero's specialty is a Creature specialty then it is Mandatory that your loyal unit be of that type as well.

---- Tower Town should have a Gremlin specialty hero, Rampart and Castle towns should also have lev1 specialty heroes. If the other towns can have the possibility of getting a hero in tavern with 3 stacks of that creature then so should those 3 towns.

---- Since Jedite is Evil aligned as a resurrection specialist, therefore Good Alignment needs to have a Resurrection specialist....Castle town would be a good choice due to its lack of a Powerful lev 4 hero.

---- A possible fix for stronghold might be to abolish goblins, move wolfriders(tone them down on stats just a lil) down to that slot, put Boars in lev2 spot, keep orcs at level 3, put Trolls in Level 4 spot, keep Tbirds(speed them up some also) in level 5, abolish cyclops, Move Ogres to level 6 and beef them up(because according to MOST D&D games Ogres are HUGE creatures with Offensive power) and keep Ancient behemoths(perhaps 7 starting speed and 11upgraded)

---- the only fix I could suggest for Fortress is to speed up a few of the units and perhaps beef up Wyverns a bit

---- there is a nasty trick that allows a fighter attacking a town to move a creature JUST infront of the drawbridge. At this point the drawbridge cannot be lowered. Even if that creature is killed the drawbridge STILL cannot be lowered, effectively trapping the army inside the castle with no chance to come out and fight. Now the reason this programming jinx should be changed is that a wizard with chain lightning can attack a town, Blotch up the drawbridge, and then simple electrocute the enemy to death. Its a programming error that should be rectified.

---- "Castle Gate" for infernos should work with allies as well as in single player games. As of now, they dont.

Thats about all I can remember...if I come up with anymore I'll be sure to send them in for input on the ideas.


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Mage of the Land
Naughty, Naughty Valeriy
posted March 22, 2001 09:52 PM

3lionshield from Heroes Community  
h4 suggestions  Posted 11-15-2000 20:27  

Maybe im just defensive about this cuz i love to do it but I don't like what you said about keeping heroes restricted (ex alkin with 1700 chain)Its one of my favorite things to do is take a magic hero and try to beef up his might, or a might hero and allow him to decimate army with magic. This helps keep a game balanced. (example: if your opponet was using alkin as main and he was restricted in certain ways then you could easily beat him because you would know his restrictions and be able to take advantage of his weaknesses). In short it would make the game and the heroes less variable and I like variation.

kudos to Iron on pointing out the drawbridge thingy-in fact I would hope that changes with the next pacth instead of waiting for h4

other than that I like the sound of most of those )


valera from Heroes Community  
Great ideas! some feedback...  Posted 11-20-2000 19:14  

Hi Ironwill, a nice set of ideas you got there!
I will make some comments if you don't mind.

Yes, heroes should have town preferences. How could crusaders let necro into their tavern and be happy if he is leading them??

I agree that fortress is disadvantaged, but ancient behemoths are so powerful with their special that cyclops are just fine. They also have a wall breaking abbility that helps.

Restricted hero developments - yes, by all rpg means it sounds a must. Look at might and magic for instance. It is heroes of might and magic and that aspect could be shared.

I've never seen a creature speciality do any good, except for 1 or 2 extra attack/defence. Cmon, that makes third of the heroes useless!

Hero customization - good! However, each secondary skill must have a different point cost, 3 to 10 points for example, and so should specialty.

Loyal unit - that would cheat many maps that have set unit positions.

Level one heroes for tower, rampart castle - they are not there because those level one units are already too powerful compared to others. Resurrection hero - no, not for castle, castle is already unstoppable.

Yes, theoretically creatures can prevent drawbringe from opening, but their dead bodies cannot hehe

My comments

Keep it up!


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Mage of the Land
Naughty, Naughty Valeriy
posted March 22, 2001 09:52 PM

AncientOne from Heroes Community  
True...  Posted 3-5-2001 03:27  

However, a dead body can keep a drawbridge from raising. If someone comes out of the castle, and stands anywhere along the drawbridge and is killed, then the drawbridge stays down. I'm a little unhappy about this.
Incidentally, I love the idea about customizing heroes.


Galactus from Heroes Community  
Good job  Posted 3-13-2001 07:14  

I would like to post some views.

- there was a heat and cold artifact(gone now?) and there still is a lightning one

- Stronghold is my favorite castle (don't ask why). It does need help however to make it competitive. The creatures are too slow. Speed up the birds and behemoths. Too much crystal needed to build armies. Ogres should be tougher.

- Barbarians should be kept dumb but should have bonus to attack.

- creature specialty is crap and should actually work.

- Monsters like Titans should appear waaay larger on battlefield. It would be neat if giants, behemoths, ect. could reach over castles walls.


- Necromancer skill is too powerful. When I play others we make an agreement not to play a necromancer. I once played an equally skilled opponent
and I went to final battle with 60 black dragons and over 100 red dragons. I thought I was unstoppable but found that his "legion" of skeletons was not 1 or 2 thousand...but over 12000! I lost this battle terribly.

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