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| Thread: Look into the Future -- H5 Divisions/Clans | |
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted May 26, 2003 07:36 PM |
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Look into the Future -- H5 Divisions/Clans
I seen Ves make some comments on the Myths board about bringing this massive tourny back. I think this is one of the best tournies on the surface. I think some fine tuning would make it even better.
Maybe we could use this thread to cultivate some ideas.
First of all, I think that there should be a 1 war limit. Having 3 wars going at a time is great for the clans that have all the time in the world, but gives un fair advantage, to real life clans players. Not to mention would cut back on forfiets.
Think of this... Set a 2-3 week base deadline. ( which clan leaders have option to extend if they both agree) If both dont agree then initial deadline holds. But if players get forfiets then war is in danger of disbanding or being penalized, so would be in best interest of clans to agree to small extentions to get war finished, or else remove the clan member that isnt playing. Also the extra initiative to finish wars would be so you could start another war. Couldnt expand on map if you were finishing wars. As it is now, some clans just start 3-4-5 wars and maybe finish 3/5 ratio.
Also all the lands wouldnt get cobbled up so fast. Looking at the tactical map as it is now, it is almost full. The tourny be over in couple months at best, and we still have 2 years before we see H5, or are we gonna restart the land clans over again for a season 2 lol?
Just some thoughts.
Jinxer
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vesuvius
Hero of Order
Honor Above all Else
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posted May 26, 2003 09:44 PM |
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I would disagree with a 1 war limit, especially if homm5 was a lot more active. It would simply curb gameplay which is never a good thing.
About the deadline, its only because of homm4 data transfer speeds and slow gameplay that we have made the deadlines much longer. If homm5 achieves faster gaming, you can expect deadlines to be no more than 2 weeks.
Jinxer, you are missing one thing about land based clans though; clans are not over when all lands are taken, thats just the first half! Then the fight continues for control over domination of the map, which in a sense is the more exciting part. Eventually there will be 2 or 3 clans remaining -- and a grand finale is set up with them.
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jb239
Famous Hero
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posted May 27, 2003 05:02 AM |
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Divisions used to be 1 of my favorite tourneys
Back in the day when they started, some things that used to go that I like were
Originally, when 2 divisions wanted to battle it out they chose a new map, or a map never used in divisions, played it out, and deadlines were fairly strict and for the most part they were completed and the competition was great
Then 1 team would be crowned for example *Battle for Honor champion* and 1 person would win an artifact if they qualified under the rules. and then a new war would be initiated, but under a new different map. Got boring when the same ole popular maps were used over and over
anyways, should keep it how it was with the simple formula
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I will not lose.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted May 27, 2003 05:41 AM |
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Actually JB that is great idea, and would be super easy to implement in this format. Just assign a secret different map to each of the lands. When you ask for that land you must play the map that is associated with that land.
Would eliminate the same map being over played over and over etc.
Jinxer
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Sir_Stiven
Honorable
Legendary Hero
banned
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posted May 27, 2003 05:43 AM |
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and no toss like the "suprise wars" at MAH tourney where about 70% of all maps were set ones and only 30% random.
Otherwise it sounds good tho.
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Blue_Camel
Famous Hero
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posted May 27, 2003 06:32 AM |
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hehe wow... h3 players making positive posts in h4 forum! daym..
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted May 27, 2003 07:50 AM |
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Because Orifice of many camel, we are taling everyones language here  .
I mean if heroes 5 makes it a grand hit, with all players combined theres got to be more then 100 players & then some.
I know you guys like JH, Jinxer & all that it wont be the same without some of the older retired players but we will do our best
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Dreaming of a Better World
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vesuvius
Hero of Order
Honor Above all Else
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posted May 27, 2003 09:12 AM |
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true, maps can be preset for specific lands, so it has to be fought on that specific map, pretty cool.
But why it wouldnt work:
You need sufficient amounts of playtested maps. So we would have to wait a long while in homm5 so there would be a good number of maps to apply to clans/divisions.
Thats why it could not have happened in homm4 ToH, because just now we are seeing the variety & choice of good maps. Imagine if we had waited till now to start homm4 clans??
So think beyond short-sighted philosophy. If there is ever a homm5, the clans/divisions would start about a month of its release. No way would there be enough good multi maps by then.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
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posted May 27, 2003 03:05 PM |
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At start of clans all maps played will be new anyways, so wont be any need to assign maps. But say 1-2 months into it as the maps start coming in. WHen ya post them on TOH, go assign that map to an un claimed l clans land. So by the time people start learning the maps and getting facvorite maps there will be about 40 lands getting unique maps. It is a great idea, I think it is worthy of spending some time trying to find a way to make it work.
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AndiAngelsla...
Disgraceful
Famous Hero
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posted May 27, 2003 03:16 PM |
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Quote:
and no toss like the "suprise wars" at MAH tourney where about 70% of all maps were set ones and only 30% random.
Otherwise it sounds good tho.
you are such a bullshiettalker sometimes Stiven, man if it would have been 50% or more Random Maps in a surprise War than where is the surprise, where is the difference to a normal War on a random Map?
The main surprise is the Map, just coz you can only handle playing Randoms on gras heaven dont talk smack...
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Tc_Fear
Famous Hero
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posted May 27, 2003 04:42 PM |
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enough of thouse devisions.Simple Clans is much beter.
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Blue_Camel
Famous Hero
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posted May 27, 2003 06:05 PM |
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Quote:
At start of clans all maps played will be new anyways, so wont be any need to assign maps. But say 1-2 months into it as the maps start coming in. WHen ya post them on TOH, go assign that map to an un claimed l clans land. So by the time people start learning the maps and getting facvorite maps there will be about 40 lands getting unique maps. It is a great idea, I think it is worthy of spending some time trying to find a way to make it work.
i dont have much experience w/clans or divisions but seems to me like there is no hole to be punched in that ^ ^ ^
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jb239
Famous Hero
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posted May 27, 2003 09:06 PM |
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Quote:
true, maps can be preset for specific lands, so it has to be fought on that specific map, pretty cool.
But why it wouldnt work:
You need sufficient amounts of playtested maps. So we would have to wait a long while in homm5 so there would be a good number of maps to apply to clans/divisions.
Thats why it could not have happened in homm4 ToH, because just now we are seeing the variety & choice of good maps. Imagine if we had waited till now to start homm4 clans??
So think beyond short-sighted philosophy. If there is ever a homm5, the clans/divisions would start about a month of its release. No way would there be enough good multi maps by then.
It's possible  I made nearly 100 maps for H3..prolly more altho I lost some b4 they could really be played. Sure, lots didnt get played or got ignored, but it was weird how it worked, for example, I created Giant War and no one played it, then like 6+ months later it became popular
But if H5 is good, Ima go back to makin as many maps as I can. I didnt make too many for H4. I think maybe 10 total? but that was only in a month or so's time. Then there are the other map makers out there now, throw them in, and in a month you can have plenty of maps (assuming the H5 map editor isnt harder to use than h4's)
But in H3 my favorite thing to do was make a part 2 to a map, so what u could do, is if a map was made initially for it, if it became out dated, re create the map with the proper fixes and call it version 2
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I will not lose.
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Jinxer
Legendary Hero
*****
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posted May 27, 2003 11:12 PM |
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New feature in Heroes 4 JB is that the version 2 of the map is obsolete. Now we mark the new verison of the version 1.0 and if there are any updates or fixes that need done along the way you simplly upload it and call it version 1.1 etc.
Now ofcourse if there is a TOTALLY differnt map design created but its in the same basic idea of the first then you could call it Version 2 hehe.
Jinxer
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Sir_Stiven
Honorable
Legendary Hero
banned
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posted May 28, 2003 07:17 AM |
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Quote:
Quote:
and no toss like the "suprise wars" at MAH tourney where about 70% of all maps were set ones and only 30% random.
Otherwise it sounds good tho.
you are such a bullshiettalker sometimes Stiven, man if it would have been 50% or more Random Maps in a surprise War than where is the surprise, where is the difference to a normal War on a random Map?
The main surprise is the Map, just coz you can only handle playing Randoms on gras heaven dont talk smack...
As you say - the main suprise is the map... but why does that only mean set maps?
Isnt a rndm template as much as a suprise? The fact is that there are many set maps and random map players.. and by having 3/4 suprise wars at set maps... how many rndm players do you think wanna try em.
Exactly, its not fair to start with.
Then if you get BOB2 or dorw tunnels temp... where is the difference in the suprise?
Exactly, there is none.
And you still doing a bad job ignoring me andi, so instead of us starting an off topic fight here i can tell what will happend:
You make dumbass statement and i correct (what just happend), then we go back and forward for 2-3 posts and after that i have proved that you are wrong and you say that im a n00b and you will never talk to me again.
But it wasnt 70% that were set maps tho, it was 75% (48/16)
http://www.toheroes.com/myths/nations/suprise.htm
ON topic:
Like Jb says i also believe that if the game turns out to be really popular many maps will be made fast.
But i dunno... think for example if a land has a set map... just for an example: if we had this in h3 and flamingos clan would get control over DW map.. how many would have been able to take that land from them then?
And also..lets say that many maps gets made first month and we have this tourney starting and all lands has set maps. What if better maps comes along later or if H5 releases a rndm generator a few months after the first game is released?
IMO there must be better ways to solve this one, and "good" part is that if i know 3doh right we will have really long time to solve it before the game itself comes out...
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jb239
Famous Hero
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posted May 30, 2003 09:23 AM |
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uh, actually when i originally posted about set maps...
I was referring to how the old division style was. not sure if yall talkin bout some new division style or clans lol
I loved the simple concept of how divisions were originally...are they gonna be the same or different?
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I will not lose.
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GrunanCross
Famous Hero
King of the Underdark
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posted June 02, 2003 07:49 AM |
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Quote:
I seen Ves make some comments on the Myths board about bringing this massive tourny back. I think this is one of the best tournies on the surface. I think some fine tuning would make it even better.
Maybe we could use this thread to cultivate some ideas.
First of all, I think that there should be a 1 war limit. Having 3 wars going at a time is great for the clans that have all the time in the world, but gives un fair advantage, to real life clans players. Not to mention would cut back on forfiets.
Think of this... Set a 2-3 week base deadline. ( which clan leaders have option to extend if they both agree) If both dont agree then initial deadline holds. But if players get forfiets then war is in danger of disbanding or being penalized, so would be in best interest of clans to agree to small extentions to get war finished, or else remove the clan member that isnt playing. Also the extra initiative to finish wars would be so you could start another war. Couldnt expand on map if you were finishing wars. As it is now, some clans just start 3-4-5 wars and maybe finish 3/5 ratio.
Also all the lands wouldnt get cobbled up so fast. Looking at the tactical map as it is now, it is almost full. The tourny be over in couple months at best, and we still have 2 years before we see H5, or are we gonna restart the land clans over again for a season 2 lol?
Just some thoughts.
Jinxer
HMmmmmmmmmmmm this will be a real long look into future, cause homm5 is going to be a while now...even if it makes it at all!!
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