|
| Thread: Clash of heroes: battle #1 |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · NEXT» |
|
David_Ryan
Adventuring Hero
|
posted October 21, 2001 03:30 PM |
|
Edited By: Hexa on 26 Jan 2002
|
Clash of heroes: battle #1
Tell me, in general what hero would you rather start with?
1. Deemer
2. Solmyr
Edit: revived!@
____________
|
|
RMS
Responsible
Legendary Hero
-ing yummy foods
|
posted October 21, 2001 03:38 PM |
|
|
...there's no need to think about this one...Deemer, definately 
____________
This space for rent.
|
|
DVZ
Known Hero
|
|
posted October 21, 2001 03:55 PM |
|
|
Deemer is one of the only two heroes that start with 3 instead of 2 skills. However, Scouting's really a secondary skill you can live without.
I'd pick Solmyr any given day:
- Starting with Sorcery and Wizards' affinity to Air magic will make the CL devastating. This is not so true for Deemer because Warlock's affinity's Fire magic.
- Wizards can learn Archery more easily than Warlocks.
- CL's great against the AI's or human opponent in earlier round where a blast will most likely obliterate the weaker armies.
Besides why'd you compare Solmyr to Deemer? If it's between Solmyr vs Jeddite or Alamar, I'd pick the Warlocks.
|
|
RMS
Responsible
Legendary Hero
-ing yummy foods
|
posted October 21, 2001 03:58 PM |
|
|
...if you compare wizards with warlocks, I'll ALWAYS pick the warlock
...besides. Deemer looks cooler 
____________
This space for rent.
|
|
Mikai
Adventuring Hero
A Wise Warrior
|
posted October 21, 2001 05:02 PM |
|
Edited By: Mikai on 21 Oct 2001
|
I don't know...
...if I must choose between those two, but anyway I must say I always prefer Loynis from the Town Castel. His Prayer spell can be quite devastating in the early stages of the game not mention later in the game. With a quite nice amount of pikemen(halebardiers) beeing cast with Prayer I can manage very well attacking wondering monsters while I can protect my archers also...not mention if I can get Expert Water in the early stages...I really like Loynis.
Question: If Loynis has as two primary skills Wisdom and Learning, what skills is most likely to develop next? Are there some rules/paterns about this? How about the other skills? If the answer is yes, where can I find this information?
But, to answer your battle #1: Deemer
I like Solmyr also but you cannot use his CL if your enemy has fewer than 4 stacks (well, sure you can but... )
____________
Mik a'El
|
|
Motorschaaf
Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
|
|
posted October 21, 2001 05:26 PM |
|
|
No Question
Both heroes suck bad . Id rather concede than taking one of them for main .
Every barbarian/beatmaster is a lot better. 
shootsolmyranddeemerschaaf
____________
|
|
Zune
Adventuring Hero
of Tatalia
|
|
posted October 21, 2001 05:28 PM |
|
|
I would definately pick Solmyr!
For these reasons:
Advanced Scouting is very good for scouts, while for main heroes it's almost useless. Meanwhile, Sorcery is excellent for a magic hero, especially when he has a damaging spell as speciality.
Wizards are more likely to learn Air Magic than Warlocks are to learn Earth Magic (I think).
I like Chain Lightning better than Meteor Shower. While the enemies must stay close to make the MS damage many creatures, the only thing the CH requires is that one of your own creatures isn't very close (and, of course, that the enemy doesn't consist of very few stacks, but that's true for the MS as well). In addition, if the CH has to hit one of your own creatures in the end, it doesn't do much damage.
____________
You can have as many hit points as you care,
you're dead when facing the Mighty Stare!
|
|
DVZ
Known Hero
|
|
posted October 21, 2001 08:25 PM |
|
|
>>...if I must choose between those two, but anyway I must say I always prefer Loynis from the Town Castel. His Prayer spell can be quite devastating in the early stages of the game not mention later in the game. With a quite nice amount of pikemen(halebardiers) beeing cast with Prayer I can manage very well attacking wondering monsters while I can protect my archers also...not mention if I can get Expert Water in the early stages...I really like Loynis.
>>
Loynis is very overrated. Prayer costs a lot and he won't be able to cast it as often as he likes. But most importantly, the bonus to the Prayer is very minimal for level 1 troops to nothing for level 7 troops. Adela is a much, much better hero. Adela's Bless on level 1-2 troops will make them do more damage than the Offense-specialty heroes.
>>Question: If Loynis has as two primary skills Wisdom and Learning, what skills is most likely to develop next? Are there some rules/paterns about this? How about the other skills? If the answer is yes, where can I find this information?
>>
www.mmportals.com will have the list of the probability each classes will learn any particular skill. Clerics are almost always offered the Water skill.
>>But, to answer your battle #1: Deemer
I like Solmyr also but you cannot use his CL if your enemy has fewer than 4 stacks (well, sure you can but... )
>>
Wandering monsters may not be composed of 4 stacks but any of the AI's or human opponent's armies will, which makes Solymr deadly to use.
|
|
David_Ryan
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted October 21, 2001 10:56 PM |
|
|
DVZ
Why do I have the feeling you are familiar to me? Maybe it is because of your picture?
I would go for Solmyr as well. I like Warlocks more as a class because they advance on spell power, not knowledge and they have the unfair extra cheap super cool Mana Vortex. However, I do not like Deemer. I like MS but his minotaur face doesn't suit my taste. I'm joking, of course, but Sorcery is more useful in Solmyr's case than the Scouting of Deemer. Of course, unless we are talking about XL maps but I rarely ever play THAT big maps. On XL maps actually the scouting skill can be quite useful for your main hero. I also played a map where you need this skill to win the game- it's a trifle complicated to explain why. Oh, I'm getting off-topic. If it was Jeddite, maybe I would take Jeddite. But Solmyr vs. Alamar: Solmyer wins.
____________
|
|
Undead_Knight
Known Hero
Hero of Chaos
|
posted October 21, 2001 11:30 PM |
|
|
Deemer is better when map contains few artefacts because Solmyr will increase knowledge with levels much more than spell power and in final battle his CL will be weaker than MS of Deemer, btw CL is dangerous to your own troops when all creatures are fighting and for MS you can always find good target such as 2-3 enemy units
If map contains many artefacts and altar of sacrifice Solmyr is better because of opportunity to gain experiense by sacrifice useless artefacts and also artefacts will make differense in spell power of warlock and wizard less important
____________
|
|
DVZ
Known Hero
|
|
posted October 22, 2001 03:08 AM |
|
|
>>Why do I have the feeling you are familiar to me? Maybe it is because of your picture? >>
I believe I see your handle name on 3DO's H3 Tavern as well right? Or maybe you've watched too many Mandarin movies? LoL.
>> If it was Jeddite, maybe I would take Jeddite. But Solmyr vs. Alamar: Solmyer wins. >>
Fore me it depends on whomever available Jeddite or Alamar. True that Jeddite allows for more customization but I often find myself offered more useless skill than Scholar when playing Jeddite. First Aid or Mysticism? I'd pick Scholar anytime. Besides when playing a strong spellcaster like Alamar starting with Scholar's not such a bad idea because then you can learn all the various starting spells from tavern heroes, including learning Meteor Shower from Deemer. Not bad at all.
|
|
thunderknight
Promising
Famous Hero
|
posted October 22, 2001 10:57 AM |
|
|
I will pick Solmyr definitely, in any case, at any map size, at any difficulty setting, any.................
Why, coz Solmyr looks much cooler. much much cooler. With much cooler history as well.
OK, end of subjective reasons.
If look from a more "objective" way, I will pick.........
.....Solmyr as well.
1). Sorcery suit wizard (compensate for the lack of spell power) much more than scouting for Deemer. Why I need scouting for my main hero any way. I can just send those scouting expert to explore the map to reduce the risk of losing my main hero in ambush.
2). In the games that I use Solmyr as my main hero. He ALWAYS got air magic. Yes, I say ALWAYS.
3). CL is a more dangerous spell, both for you and your opponents. It is more complicated and more difficult to master. So, it is more interesting as well.
4). There are at least two better warlocks than Deemer(Alamar and Jeddite) and one excellent overload (Gunnar) to compete with Deemer. But Solmyr is definitely the best wizard. (with Cyra? followed closely).
Quote:
If it was Jeddite, maybe I would take Jeddite. But Solmyr vs. Alamar: Solmyer wins.
If ignore the factor of personal favorite (which I won't ),
my choice will:
Alamar first and Jeddite/Solmyr second (tie)
If I got Alamar, I would definitely upgrade him asap and teach resurrection to everybody else. Solmyr for smaller maps and Jeddite for large maps.
____________
Choose what you love
and love what you choose.
|
|
David_Ryan
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted October 22, 2001 08:34 PM |
|
|
~Throws wings up~
Quote:
I believe I see your handle name on 3DO's H3 Tavern as well right? Or maybe you've watched too many Mandarin movies? LoL.
Please, lady, don't shoot me, I'm going to behave, I promise! 
IM on its way
True that Jeddite allows for more customization but I often find myself offered more useless skill than Scholar when playing Jeddite.
I don't know why but it ALWAYS give me Fire magic on his second level. As a rule. Always fire magic. Good for warlock, I usually take it.
____________
|
|
zsa
Famous Hero
|
|
posted October 23, 2001 01:50 AM |
|
|
|
I would pick Solmyr any given day
|
|
Mikai
Adventuring Hero
A Wise Warrior
|
posted October 25, 2001 01:43 AM |
|
|
To DVZ...
<<< Loynis is very overrated. Prayer costs a lot and he won't be able to cast it as often as he likes. But most importantly, the bonus to the Prayer is very minimal for level 1 troops to nothing for level 7 troops. Adela is a much, much better hero. Adela's Bless on level 1-2 troops will make them do more damage than the Offense-specialty heroes.>>>
I don't think That Loynis is "very" overrated...Maybe for some Adela would be a better choice but still I think Loynis would be their second choice if so...In my case Loynis is the first and the best choise than Adela. Also Prayer (from its definition) works better on weeker troops. Yes I agree with you that Bless will provide more damage in the early stages. I will give you an example: Let's get 50 pikemen (basic damage 1-3)
Basic Bless will provide 50*3=150 damage always
Basic Prayer will provide an increase of damage by 10%
if 1 damage (1*50)+10%=55 damage
if 2 damage (2*50)+10%=110 damage
if 3 damage (3*50)+10%=165 damage
So you "can" inflict more damage than provided by Bless and also (don't forget) in the same time you increase your Defence and Speed also.Actually the Prayer gives you +2 Attack, +2 Defence and +2 Speed which I don't think is unusefull.Practicly it combines Bloodlust,Stoneskin and Haste which I believe is a better choice than Bless alone.
Also you have to look further in the game when I believe that in the middle stages of the game you will have more use from Prayer (Advanced gives you +4 Attack, Defence, Speed, and on Expert level you have the same but for all your creatures) rather than bless because will have it already by then...
This is what I think...
<<<Wandering monsters may not be composed of 4 stacks but any of the AI's or human opponent's armies will, which makes Solymr deadly to use.>>>
Not Solmyr is deadly but his CL...anyway normaly Basic CL does (spell power*40)+25. In Solmyr case (2*40)+25=105. with Basic Sorcery (+5%) it inflicts 110 at a first strike not much of an increase. And I still think that is a matter of luck if wandering armies are in more than 4 stacks but refering to the heroes encounters in Solmyr case first you have to have the upper hand(very dificult with slow Tower troops) and then you enemy may already have some magic of his own...
____________
Mik a'El
|
|
wiggy_wam
Promising
Famous Hero
local pirate
|
|
posted October 25, 2001 05:36 AM |
|
|
mmmm, good match up
it is obvious both choices are wise, and to me, this is a very difficult decision.
I believe one of these heroes would only be better in certain situations, like these (many are obvious):
- if you know opponent has tactics, pick solmyr.
- if you're looking for a scout, obviously deemer.
- if you possess the pendant of negativity, DEFINITELY SOLMYR!
- if opponent possesses pendant of negativity, DEFINITELY DEEMER!
- if opponent has expert resist or thorgrim, then probably deemer (if the first target resists CL, all is resisted, but one may still hit a target while another resists MS)
- if you're not worried of accidently getting your own troops, pick Solmyr
- if you ARE worried, pick deemer
overall, SOLMYR IS MORE POWERFUL, but CL also has certain drawbacks (more spell points, may damage own troops, etc)
I have a hard time deciding, because I prefer warriors over magicians. Not always, but in a majority of cases, I'll pick Solmyr.
____________
- wiggy ... who has a crush on Rob's models. Well ... the ones his age (18-26)
|
|
Murphy
Disgraceful
Famous Hero
banned
|
|
posted October 28, 2001 07:58 PM |
|
|
SOLMYR KICKS ASS!
\/\/
/\/
\/
/\
\/
/\
\/\
KABOOM!
'nuff said
____________
|
|
attila
Known Hero
Young Warrior
|
posted October 29, 2001 02:30 AM |
|
|
deemer not bad because not neckless 2 stop it. but he cant trade in artis. syolmar can so that makes him alittle better i think.
____________
¤¤¤ Attila ¤¤¤
|
|
lordlazy
Promising
Famous Hero
Wood cleaner
|
|
posted October 27, 2002 12:24 AM |
|
|
I'll pick deemer in all cases cause: 1. he will gain more power than solmyr. 2. meteor shower is cheaper 3. solmyr will have more knowledge, but dungeons mana vortex will help.... actually deemer will have almost the same amouunt of spell points as solmyr. 4. you solmyr is more likely to gain air magic than deemer is to gain earth magic...baah. you will almost always get earth magic with warlocks anyway. 5. So youre solmyr gets expert chain lightning, so now it will do damage to five units. That only means you wont get the opportunity to cast it as often as u used to when u had no air magic at all!!
By the way....I won't choose any spell specialty heroes as my main anyway. A hero like malekith is much more powerful. (and what bout other heroes that nobody talk about, like Fortress' Styg. She will gain much power and knowledge, actually only dungeon and inferno will get more power skill (correct me if this is incorrect)).
|
|
lordlazy
Promising
Famous Hero
Wood cleaner
|
|
posted October 27, 2002 12:27 AM |
|
|
I'll pick deemer in all cases cause: 1. he will gain more power than solmyr. 2. meteor shower is cheaper 3. solmyr will have more knowledge, but dungeons mana vortex will help.... actually deemer will have almost the same amouunt of spell points as solmyr. 4. you solmyr is more likely to gain air magic than deemer is to gain earth magic...baah. you will almost always get earth magic with warlocks anyway. 5. So youre solmyr gets expert chain lightning, so now it will do damage to five units. That only means you wont get the opportunity to cast it as often as u used to when u had no air magic at all!!
By the way....I won't choose any spell specialty heroes as my main anyway. A hero like malekith is much more powerful. (and what bout other heroes that nobody talk about, like Fortress' Styg. She will gain much power and knowledge, actually only dungeon and inferno will get more power skill (correct me if this is incorrect)).
|
|
|
|
