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| Thread: Saddam On Trial |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · «PREV |
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Wolfman
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Insomniac
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posted July 02, 2004 07:54 PM |
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Excuse me? He has a team of lawyers ready to defend him, they don't want to enter the country, how is that my problem?
I understand what a fair trial is, but I'm not sure you understand where this legal counsel is. They are in Jordan, you can go and talk to them if you want. But there is no need to yell at me over something I have no control over. And the preliminary things shouldn't be held up by some cowardly lawyers.
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Peacemaker
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Peacemaker = double entendre
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posted July 02, 2004 09:14 PM |
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LOL -- It appears I am not needed here...
Seriously though, I may be lulled into a state of catatonia by the diminutive aspects of employment and discrimination law, but all they were asking him to do was sign the list of charges. I didn't hear anything about a plea. Now I am certainly no expert in war crimes tribunals or anything, and I know nothing of the Iraqui criminal process. So I may be talking through my hat.
But this really doesn't seem like something a couple of phone calls couldn't clear up. I am assuming of course that the phone system is up and Saddam is allowed to make a phone call to his team of lawyers. But I have to agree that I think this was a rather pathetic escuse to stall and make trouble. I've certainly had my share of that nonsense.
I guess it really all depends on how this little document fits in to the due process system in Iraq and what signing it legally establishes there...
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grendal
Adventuring Hero
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posted July 02, 2004 11:02 PM |
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Lawyers claiming to represent him were refused standing at the first court appearance and according to them they were fuming. The judge visited him the previous day to explain the situation and itenery. At that time he was told he would get a half hour to ask questions. Without legal counsel those questions were much less pertinent to his situation then they could have been.
Im no fan of him either and could care less what happens to him as long as he isnt acquitted. Im much more interested in what details he provides about his "friends" of the past. But i suspect that will be ruled inadmisable and we will hear nothing of it.
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Life is full of frustrations, heroes should help release it!
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privatehudson
Responsible
Legendary Hero
The Ultimate Badass
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posted July 02, 2004 11:16 PM |
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I believe my initial question centered more around whether alternatives will be arranged if needed or if they'll proceed without him being given counsel, not on the nature of his apparent representatives. I'm wondering though how he would "go and see them" since he is presumably locked up, which leaves him either without counsel, or relying on the phone. Of course it shouldn't hold things up, but it will be interesting to see what solutions they find to the problem, he has the right to legal counsel at some point, possibly not right now, but sooner or later. If they won't go, representation should be provided, and the US/UK should ensure this. Not your problem, but then again no-one's saying it is either, we're saying it's your (and others) country's problem.
Quote:
But what you're saying is that there is no difference between the US and Europe. We have a trial too
Uhmmm no, utterly wrong. I remarked that we don't use the extreme system or sentences adopted in the states and my opinion that they are excessive. I further remarked that there should be a proper legal system set up and used unlike say... guantanamo bay for example. I don't recall saying there was no difference.
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Asmodean
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Heroine at the weekend.
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posted July 02, 2004 11:16 PM |
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Well the situation is brutal.
Here we have a man who can only be found guilty of war crimes against the Iraqui people.
And there are extremists who are bombing and killing in the misguided hope they can free him and set him back in power.
If the Iraqui's have any brains they'll get the trial done quick and execute him within the year.
I know I'm gonna get flamed for saying it so harshly, but it's the brutal honest truth.
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To err is human, to arr is pirate.
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Wolfman
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Insomniac
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posted July 02, 2004 11:52 PM |
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I had no idea we were so extreme, PH.
Asmodean, you're right. No flame here. 
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Svarog
Honorable
Supreme Hero
statue-loving necrophiliac
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posted July 07, 2004 12:33 AM |
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Do you guys know who's going to try Sadam? I really dont have that info, so if someone knows may they please tell me.
And what is the legitimacy of the court that is trying him?
On the other hand, Americans wouldnt have this burden if they hadnt been that paranoic about the International Criminal Court (or maybe they are just afraid that justice wont be on their side completely this time), which was created to deal with these kind of cases in the first place. And is there more legetimate court to try Saddam, who was put down of power by another country which had no legal mandate for that, than an international court, ratified by the country whose national Saddam is (i.e. Iraq)?
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The meek shall inherit the earth, but NOT its mineral rights.
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Peacemaker
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Peacemaker = double entendre
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posted July 07, 2004 01:06 AM |
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Savarog --
It's my understanding that the Iraqui interim council and American/British judges have been working together for the past several months on putting their justice system pretty much back together the way it was before Saddam took over and turned it into a process he was in control of. The Iraqui court system as it has been reconstruced is where he is going to be tried.
That system, of course, bears the legitimacy of the government of the Iraqui nation-state, which has been transferred back into the hands of the Iraqui leadership.
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted November 19, 2004 04:39 PM |
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Re-iteration
I simply wanted to make sure this thread doesn't fall too far back in the file cabinets of Heroes Community.
Also, the trials will, in fact, be conducted by the Iraqi governing council. The U.S. will only participate by detaining Saddam. If he dies before the trial, or someone harms him, it will be our fault(to be more precise....Bush's).
I was also thinking this might be the trial the world had always wanted to hold for Hitler and Stalin but were never afforded the opportunity. It seems his most enduring trait, narcissism, has preserved the man for trial. He might have otherwise committed suicide.
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Roses Are Red And So Am I
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Wolfman
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Insomniac
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posted December 17, 2004 12:12 AM |
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Glad to see things getting underway...
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privatehudson
Responsible
Legendary Hero
The Ultimate Badass
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posted December 17, 2004 10:45 AM |
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Quote:
I was also thinking this might be the trial the world had always wanted to hold for Hitler and Stalin but were never afforded the opportunity. It seems his most enduring trait, narcissism, has preserved the man for trial. He might have otherwise committed suicide.
Perhaps, like Goring he will take the opportunity to defend himself vigorously and humiliate others before cheating the verdict.
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We're on an express elevator to Hell, goin' down!
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted December 17, 2004 05:25 PM |
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Edited By: Consis on 17 Dec 2004
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Hmm...
Yes but regardless of the fact that Hermann Goering had slimmed in captivity, had been taken off drugs, defended himself with aggressive vigour and skill, and frequently outwitted the prosecuting counsel. With Hitler dead, he stood out among the defendants as the dominating personality, dictating attitudes to other prisoners in the dock and adopting a pose of self-conscious heroism motivated by the belief that he would be immortalized as a German martyr. Nevertheless, Goering still failed to convince the judges, who found him guilty on all four counts of conspiracy to wage war, crimes against peace, war crimes and crimes against humanity. No mitigating circumstances were found and Goering was sentenced to death by hanging. On 15 October 1946, two hours before his execution was due to take place, Goering committed suicide in his Nuremberg cell, taking a capsule of poison that he had succeeded in hiding from his guards during his captivity.
I do still believe the world was slightly robbed of its justice in the case of Goering.
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Roses Are RedAnd So Am I
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