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| Thread: Undead help |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 · NEXT» |
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Mocara
Famous Hero
what?
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posted March 30, 2001 08:35 PM |
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Undead help
Here are some things I was thinking of for the necropolis who kind of got pushed around in heroes3 and maybe needs a little help.
Instead of a skeleton transformer make it a 'Killing Machine/Flesh Stripper' That will turn any creature put into it into the bone version of it. Bone versions lose their special abilities in exchange for more undead like abilities.
ie Arc Angel can cast animate dead now instead of ressurect. Unicorns cast fear instead of blind. Etc.
It's entirely feasible and no real stretch of the imagination for this structure.
By the way all creatures should keep same stats except speed up 1 because now they are lighter.
Also Necro really needs an artifact to greatly affect the power of death ripple. It is such a weak spell and a series of artifacts making it 2x,3x,4x more powerful would really make him a lethal foe.
Vampire lords cannot drain blood from every unit it attacks. I have a hard time believing a vamp is going to penetrate dragon scales or drain BLOOD from a phoenix. This needs to be corrected.
Also in mythology undead traditionally could not travel across water. Undead troops should be halfed each day they are on water to illustrate this inability to sail. Make a common artifact availible to negate this.
Replace the old holy shout spell with something called rising sun which would be a 5th level spell which would do damage to undead. Of course artifact are needed for this as well.
All undead creatures can cast fear when attacking but fear causes afraid creatures to go into computer control where he randomly attacks, even out of turn and has frenzy like stats. In other words he attacks randomly and hard out of fear but has zero defense and maybe even attacks his own units or have a 5% chance of suicide.
-Mocara
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Mystery
Famous Hero
Hatebreeder
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posted March 30, 2001 09:22 PM |
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Nice ideas but...
Nice ideas but u have some mistakes:
1. Vampires drain energy, not only blood.
2. Why should undead be unable to travel across water, they are on a ship, not in the water.
3. Transformed creatures should lose flying ability because their wings will be just bones which can't lift them.
4. Not all units should be able to be transformed because of two reasons:
1)Elementals, genies, wraiths, ghost dragons, and non-physical units dont have bones and dont have an actual physical existance.
2)Strong units should not be able to be transfromed because I think a black dragon or a titan would be able to destroy the transformer or escape before it will start working and stripping its flesh off.
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D3@th t0 Fals3 m3Tal!
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Mystery
Famous Hero
Hatebreeder
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posted March 30, 2001 09:25 PM |
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P.S
Only 1st level units should be affected by fear except of familiars and undead because only the low level units are stupid enough to be afraid of undead, and the higher level ones are brave and are used to undead and other legendary and fearsome creatures.
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D3@th t0 Fals3 m3Tal!
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raZor_X
Promising
Known Hero
The mysterious Warlock
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posted March 30, 2001 10:27 PM |
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Well this killing machine is interesting, but dont you think that with this structure necropolis will become too powerful, they are already powerful enough. I like it very much, it will add many undead creatures, but I think it will disbalance the game. How about only low level units to be transformed.
Vampires should drain life from any living creature (this is solved very good from 3do).
Death ripple spell should be more powerful.
raZor_X
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Mocara
Famous Hero
what?
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posted April 01, 2001 09:20 PM |
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All excellent points Mystery. I brainstorm when I write and my ideas always benefit from revision.
As for making the necropolis too powerful with the Killing Machine, I do not think so and here is why;
You only have so many slots for creatures anyway. It is not as if you would be able to use 20 different 'boned out' units.
Also in order to get a Bone Angel or something like that you would need to build and transport or get one from a refuge camp.
As for the unit losing it's fly ability I disagree only because Bone Dragons do not seem to suffer from not having flesh on their bones and in heroes3 you can put a Dragon in the transformer and it will come out a flying bone dragon(try it).
I think maybe certain creatures like Arc Angels or Unicorns would have a 20% chance of suiciding when attempting to bone them because of their purity.
As for the Vampire Lords draining life that is not consistent with Vampire lore. Vampires need to drink blood for their life. Sure they have the power to mesmerize but if they are going to drain life from a creature having no blood they should be called Psychic Vampyres.
Also I totally agree Mystery, a unit w/o bones does not come out of the Killing Machine.
-Mocara
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Anfi
Known Hero
Computer Puppet
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posted April 01, 2001 10:33 PM |
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i think non-1st level units should cost some gold to skin them. and maybe you should have to meet requirements of army strength to skin some monsters... i would like to see 20 skeletons hold down an arch angel while his skin is being ripped off.
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kuraizen
Adventuring Hero
Welcome to the Killing Fields
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posted April 02, 2001 02:58 AM |
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about your slaughter house...
maby if you convert level 1 to skells, 2-3 to skell warriors, 3-4 wraiths, 5-6 vampires, 7+ into dread knights or bone dragons (beastial = dragon, huminoid = dread knights)
and about vampires, thats too complicated, for the most realistic aproach, have it depend on evolition of vampire,
1 vampire = regens from level 1-4 liveing,
2 vampire lords = regens from 1-6 liveing,
(if they have splitting upgrades like i am praying for)
3 psycic barron = regens from 1-6 any,
3 transing barron = regens 1-8 liveing,
4 ancestor = regens all and higher amount,
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Mystery
Famous Hero
Hatebreeder
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posted April 02, 2001 11:33 AM |
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Good idea...
Good idea Kuraizen,
You have a great idea with Vampires and why not make a 5% chance that if a stack was attacked by vampires and its members are equal or less than the vampires in the stack, the attacked stack will turn into vampires, or will just attack their own army.
P.S: Does Kuraizen mean "A dangerous man" in Japanese?
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D3@th t0 Fals3 m3Tal!
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Mystery
Famous Hero
Hatebreeder
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posted April 02, 2001 07:59 PM |
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P.S.
By the way, I also think that undead shouldn't have neutral morale because only zombies and skeletons are animated dead that just do what they are magically "told to do" but vampires wraiths/wights, liches and dread/death knights are self-conscious, and that is well known fact, and they should have morale and ghost dragons should have morale too but bone dragons should not because they are just magically animated bones.
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D3@th t0 Fals3 m3Tal!
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Mocara
Famous Hero
what?
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posted April 07, 2001 10:34 AM |
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And another thing...
Necro should not be able to get skeletons from gargoyles,golems,etc
These creatures don't even have bones.
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SirDunco
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted April 07, 2001 04:41 PM |
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Necro Sucks!!!!
I know they should not be able to do that. They have wayyyyyyyy to much advantages! And you fight then in most of the campains! I can't stand it! Reduce the Necro advantages!
Sir Dunco
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raZor_X
Promising
Known Hero
The mysterious Warlock
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posted April 07, 2001 08:49 PM |
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I should rather say: Necro rulez...
I really like necro towns. They are too powerful.
And about your ideas, they are all cool. But there is only one problem... Necro will be too powerful if they have these advantages you mentioned, lets say morale. It will happen' that the dread knights will do double damage plus the morale bonus and again double damage. This will be devastating. I remember a game on zone, in the final battle I had dread knights and the oponent had Titans (I was thant), i kicked his a$$ animating and doing double damage.
All I wanna say is that necro is powerful enough, but maybe in heroes4 all towns will be more powerful so lets continue with our ideas...
raZor_X
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Mystery
Famous Hero
Hatebreeder
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posted April 08, 2001 01:43 AM |
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Undead still has disadvantages like no blessing and along with the morale thing they should lose the blind immunity.
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D3@th t0 Fals3 m3Tal!
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Anfi
Known Hero
Computer Puppet
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posted April 08, 2001 10:30 AM |
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well, they have no eyes to blind, so lets say a new spell specially designed to have the same effects as blind on undead.
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Mystery
Famous Hero
Hatebreeder
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posted April 08, 2001 11:44 AM |
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Why no eyes?
Only skeletons and zombies (maybe zombies have something that was eyes a week ago), and bone dragons don't have eyes and they shouldn't have morale also, but vampires and liches and wraiths and dread knight and GHOST dragons are self concsious and should have morale and not immune to blind, because they have eyes, even if they are magical, they still have them, because the blind spell is not just pierce the eyes out of a unit, but also cloud its vision magically.
Also, what do u think about Cyclops and Beholders suffering from Blind at expert level even when it's cast at basic level.
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D3@th t0 Fals3 m3Tal!
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SirDunco
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted April 08, 2001 04:01 PM |
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Advantages
Some of us agree that they should have some advantages taken off of some of them. Now I still say that I HATE Necro. They can be powerful ,but I HATE them.
Sir Dunco
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Mystery
Famous Hero
Hatebreeder
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posted April 08, 2001 05:17 PM |
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Necro...
I don't care if u hate necro, I never play them myself either but we are talking about ideas for them whether we like necro or not.
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D3@th t0 Fals3 m3Tal!
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SirDunco
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted April 08, 2001 07:23 PM |
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sorry once again
I know that we are talkng about ideas. About those advantages. Don't you think there should be some way to get rid of them?
Sir Dunco
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kuraizen
Adventuring Hero
Welcome to the Killing Fields
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posted April 09, 2001 07:44 AM |
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kuraizen = dark/gloomy enlightened/complete my rpg chars were the odin type,
i think that moral should NOT be given to necro, because the low levels are mind controled so they don't have moral, but the others are knowing of the cause enough that their moral doesn't change, they don't care if their army is totaly undead or full of angels, they don't care if they are fighting against a million or one, they are doing their job in their cause, necromancers are known in myth and legend for "doing what needed to be done" so their moral should ALWAYS be nutral,
also i think that they should have a "tag" on creatures, saying "skelletal" or "non skelletal" if a creature is non skelletal it can't be striped of fleash, or reanimated as a skelleton after combate, but ALSO can't be resurected during combat with resurection spell,
they should have a spell called "re charge" for genies and ellementals and such creatures who are entirely energy (ghost dragons too) which regenerates the energy that supported their existance, thus reincarnating them,
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Undead_Knight
Known Hero
Hero of Chaos
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posted April 09, 2001 11:27 AM |
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necro town
I think that necro town is almost the most weak town in heroes3.It can win vs other cities because chance of finding animate dead in guild is better than finding resurrect in other town guilds but without animate dead necro is very weak and if opponent (for example tower or castle) has resurrect necro hero must be much stronger to win.And legion of skeletons can be rised only on maps that contained many monsters,but most time sceleton advantage doesnt help much.
So i have some ideas :
necro troops must have more hit points than living creatures but does less damage and have less attack/defense(it seems to me that u must wound undead very seriously to kill and living creature can be slayed with a single blow   except skeletons of course .
Wights\wraiths can have phisical resistanse(50% less phisical damage) and magic vulnerability (50% or even 100% more damage done by magic)
and there are too many dragons in heroes I think, that 7th level creature must be not a bone/ghost dragon
It can be Death lord that can fly and after upgrade cast animate dead once per battle (this creature can have 400 hp 25-40 damage 21 att 19 def or something like this) and reduse morale -2(-1 before upgrade)
P.S. Do u know that skeleton transformer in heroes3 transforms any dragon or hydra into bone dragon?
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