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| Thread: Rant on the Degeneration of HC (feel free to skip this and go play the WAG) |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Wyvern
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted October 24, 2001 09:18 AM |
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Hmm... Should I say something here?
I'm not an old member. I don't know if I'm new, i'm just "someone". I remember the Heroes Community of August and if I compare it with the present condition... I don't see a big difference. Actually, there are two differences - there are more moderators and the profiles contain more information. So the HC is better now. For me it was enjoyable in August and it's enjoyable now.
Everyone is different and has his own opinion. Coldfyrius thinks that the HC is going down, other people don't think so. And they are able to say what they think. Some people gain bonuses, other - penalties, some don't gain anything. But that won't change their minds. They will think the same way. Some will give new ideas, others will resume present information. And there will be people only reading. This is their right. They can do what they want. Well, in some cases there are consequences...
"Good old time", "Good new time" - everyone thinks different. And this is good - there is a quote "If everyone thinks similar, no one thinks enough". There have to be different opinions, discussions...
I haven't been to other forums and I don't have experience but I like this place. And I feel that everyone is free to be here. The Heroes Community - the place where people share opinions for the game they like and not only. This sounds great, doesn't it?
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Hexa
Responsible
Legendary Hero
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posted October 24, 2001 09:26 AM |
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 Wyvern!@
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If you want to realize your dreams >>> you have to wake up!@
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rychenroller
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted October 24, 2001 09:33 AM |
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I'm an old member, I was posting back before they rebuilt this whole thing, when Zanuda was the bad guy (sometimes I wish he were back lol). I ejoy reading some posts, and some suck, thats just the way it is. Idont think HC is degenerating, just changing, you either like it, or you dont. If you dont like it, leave. If you like it, rock on. One thing that really annoys me though is like Shae said. Those people who think they know everything there is to know, because they have downloaded a few maps. You people dont know of the internal politicking that is involved with mapmaking for a hugely succesful tournament like ToH. Mpas have to be perfectly balanced, or people snow. People dont want to play XL maps which take 15 hours to finish online, they want a 4 week game, they want to be up and going early, hence the richness of a lot of ToH maps. A large percentage of ToH maps are made by a player called jb239, and he does an awesome job, trying to keep the thousnads of people who play ToH happy. What I'm trying to say is, for those people who arent in ToH, and think that ToH, or ToH maps suck. You dont know what you are dealing with, and you dont know what you are talking about.
Cheers
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Myctteakyshd
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Oh_Smeg
Adventuring Hero
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posted October 24, 2001 09:34 AM |
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Haha
That's funny.
Coldfyrius derscibres the HC as being in a pathetic state, accuses the members of posting 'worthless crap' and gets a quality point.
I describe his post as horse manure and lose a point.
Ok, RMS you can deduct another point now...not that I give a damn.
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Milena
Responsible
Supreme Hero
in supreme disgrace
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posted October 24, 2001 09:43 AM |
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*applauses*
Quote:
Coldfyrius derscibres the HC as being in a pathetic state, accuses the members of posting 'worthless crap' and gets a quality point.
I describe his post as horse manure and lose a point.
Ok, RMS you can deduct another point now...not that I give a damn.
Yes, I seem to agree here!
And Wyvern, you made a valid point. I agree with you
I have been on many forums but I chose to stay here because the balance b/n game and general chat is just great.
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 Milena
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Hexa
Responsible
Legendary Hero
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posted October 24, 2001 09:53 AM |
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Rychenroller
I (just talking for myself) was only stating the following.
For someone that has never played online ToH sounds interesting at first.
But ….. when new heroes read up on ToH in previous threads and learn some more about the kind of games that are played there the threshold will get bigger and bigger up to the point that people might think that ToH is only for someone that has spend countless hours mastering a map by playing it or dissecting it in the editor.
Of course, I realize that in such a large tournament as ToH its very difficult to keep people pleased.
You (seasoned ToH players) should also realize that for newcomers the ToH is very inaccessible.
I for one would like to play other players sometimes (I think I’m a good player).
But …. like I said earlier the threshold continues to grow.
Just my two cents (or what there’re worth to ya). I’ll sell them by auction!
LOL
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If you want to realize your dreams >>> you have to wake up!@
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UnkaHaakon
Responsible
Famous Hero
happily tilting at windmills
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posted October 24, 2001 10:23 AM |
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This thread: one moderator's view
Ok ..time for another two cents worth (darn ..there goes another 2 weeks pay here)
Let's examine (from my point of view) the QP bonus applied to Coldfyrius and the penalty applied to Oh_Smeg.
The penalty:
We mods are supposed to apply penalties for breaches of the code of conduct in the FAQ. It doesn't matter what my personal opinion of the issue is. If I see a blatant breach, I should hit the post with a penalty. That's one of my responsibilities. Once again, I strongly suggest that if you haven't, you read the FAQ.
The bonus:
Bonuses are supposed to be applied to outstanding posts. For me, this means a truly different idea, or perhaps an old idea given a new twist. In addition, a quality post is generally one which makes a point, and then supports that position with more arguments than "I say so". In addition, a "Top 2%" post usually generates interest and discussion (sometimes heated discussion). No where in that admittedly incomplete list of criteria does it say the idea has to be popular, or that I have to like it, or agree with it!
So, were the penalty and the bonus both justified? I think so. It's called integrity where I come from.
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Some people say the glass is half full..Some people say it's half empty... I say "What're you asking me to drink?"
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Oh_Smeg
Adventuring Hero
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posted October 24, 2001 10:40 AM |
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Unk...
...that's called horse manure where I come from.
PLEASE penalize me again, I want to see what happens when the stars reach -1
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Sha_Men
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jack-Of-No-Trades
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posted October 24, 2001 12:16 PM |
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You don't have to push it Oh_Smeg...
I personally start disliking you when you don't have anything to say but mock when somebody gets QP.
What I see in Coldfyrious post is wake people up and even if I disagree that HC is degerating I think we could use our time better than writing to this thread. I think he made good point and if some moderator gives QP from it...I wouldn't be complaining...
If you are begging for penalties Oh_Smeg I believe you will get them.
But as said I already have begin disliking you because you haven't really said anything but tried to push moderators to do something...or maybe you are doing it jokingly...I don't know....
Make another thread about QP's and penalties (like there hasn't been enough of them) and you can mock all the mods and posters there. Then we can have good laughs about your posts that starts thread.
Did I say that HC isn't degerating? I think it is now because people are trying to post to this thread and not to others. Unfortunately I am also guilty as one can be to this now as I am writing this.
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Catch the vigorous horse of your mind.
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rychenroller
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted October 24, 2001 12:40 PM |
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Hexa
You couldnt be further from the truth. Toh is extremely accessible to newer players, especially since it has changed over to the new server which Vesuvius spent 5 grand on. This is an extremely large and extremely well run rankings system, and I recommend it to anyone. Sure its competitive, but you can also play relaxed games with relaxed players. Try it.
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Myctteakyshd
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Hexa
Responsible
Legendary Hero
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posted October 24, 2001 12:43 PM |
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Edited By: Hexa on 24 Oct 2001
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hmmm I wasn't discussing the ranking systems. I like those.
Still remains my remark about the maps themselves!
Whats your view (coloured as it might be)!@
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If you want to realize your dreams >>> you have to wake up!@
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Oh_Smeg
Adventuring Hero
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posted October 24, 2001 12:45 PM |
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No Sha_Men...
Quote:
I personally start disliking you when you don't have anything to say but mock when somebody gets QP.
What I see in Coldfyrious post is wake people up and even if I disagree that HC is degerating I think we could use our time better than writing to this thread. I think he made good point and if some moderator gives QP from it...I wouldn't be complaining...
If you are begging for penalties Oh_Smeg I believe you will get them.
But as said I already have begin disliking you because you haven't really said anything but tried to push moderators to do something...or maybe you are doing it jokingly...I don't know....
Make another thread about QP's and penalties (like there hasn't been enough of them) and you can mock all the mods and posters there. Then we can have good laughs about your posts that starts thread.
Did I say that HC isn't degerating? I think it is now because people are trying to post to this thread and not to others. Unfortunately I am also guilty as one can be to this now as I am writing this.
I don't care about stupid quality points...or medals or any kinds of awards or penalties for that matter. I hope they do penalize me again...if describing Coldfyrius's post as a pile of horse manure breaks the rules, then so be it. That's what I think of his post.
Nice troll btw Coldfyrius...you even caught a couple of moderators.
Why do you dislike me Sha_Men? Am I the cause of this argument? Are my contributions to this forum so despised?
If I am so hated I will leave. I have enjoyed my stay and the Hexa's Quest thread has been a ball.
What exactly is Coldfyrius trying to wake people up to?
A dead game?
Give me a break...Heroes 4 is out next early next year...what is the point in discussing strategies or towns or whatever about Heroes 3.
Ok, there is a Heroes 4 forum...great forum...but what is the point in discussing what might be? It is already too late to discuss possible suggestions...3do have made up their minds and the product is probably in testing as we speak.
I am not mocking the moderator's except where they cast a prejudiced view. Coldfyrius described the heroes community as pathetic...maybe he was right...described it's members as posting 'worthless crap' and as a recent contributor I felt offended.
As did many others, or if not offended, shocked...a few threads have virtually stopped.
Do what you want, I'm leaving...had enough political garbage to last a lifetime.
Btw Vesuvius,
climb down off that TOH crucifix and join the real world.
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Sha_Men
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jack-Of-No-Trades
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posted October 24, 2001 12:57 PM |
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So...
You felt hurt about Coldfyrious message?
Like Wyvern said everybody has their opinion how board looks like.
Maybe I should have said that I quickly start disliking you if you continue to express opinion about how mods give QPs.
Thing is that I don't want to start judging moderators by asking where did someones QP or penalty come from publicly.
This is direct quote from you:
"Who the **** gave that load of ***** ********* a quality point anyway? Is this obsession with HMM3 and strategies and medals compulsory around here? "
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Maybe mod should have explained why he gave QP (I think in overall that is good policy).
Coldfyrious is sometimes touchy about this forum. I think many of us like you Oh_Smeg don't want to see this place go downwards or that people mock it. Coldie tried to express his view and mod give him a point. So what?
Otherwise Oh_Smeg I have no problems with you at all. Keep posting but I think this is just another thread about something non-HoMM and we need those kinds of threads too...in some sense.
Keep talking whatever you want if you don't break the rules of the board. I wish we have more talk about HoMM when the new game is coming out.
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Catch the vigorous horse of your mind.
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Milena
Responsible
Supreme Hero
in supreme disgrace
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posted October 24, 2001 02:50 PM |
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Well...
If I have to be fair, I don't think SMeg had to be punished. After all he was expressing his point of view. Right? Maybe he didn't put it in the right way IMHO. I guess he wanted to say he didn't give a cent for QP and posts and found others doing it petty. I at least do so. Fame is not a matter of posts. It's the matter of doing the right thing. I myself have suffered enough of simple misunderstandings like this and I feel Smeg didn't want to offend anyone. Be fair, Smeg. DId you mean to insult anyone?
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Milena
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Valeriy
Mage of the Land
Naughty, Naughty Valeriy
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posted October 24, 2001 09:30 PM |
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In this post I request that no more comments are made about what Oh_Smeg has said.
Oh_Smeg, following is an idea of what you did and how it caused what happened.
You've said:
Quote:
Who the **** gave that load of ***** ********* a quality point anyway? Is this obsession with HMM3 and strategies and medals compulsory around here?
The penalty was for using bad language, not your idea. Saying the same idea differently - "I disagree with whoever gave that quality point because ..." - would earn you no penalty. QPs are not about our agreement or disagreement with your idea, it's a rule that we abandon our judgment and look only at how you present your ideas.
Quote:
Coldfyrius derscibres the HC as being in a pathetic state...
I describe his post as horse manure and lose a point.
He managed to do it without any swearing or direct insults, hence did not earn a penalty. I personally disagree with the whole degeneration thing, but no penalty can be given since rules were not breached by him. You lost a quality point not for talking about his post, but for bad language directed at the moderators, which is a direct insult, a breach of the rules.
Quote:
PLEASE penalize me again, I want to see what happens when the stars reach -1
If you've earned one penalty it does not in any way mean that we'll be penalizing all your posts now or that we'll have a low opinion of you. Past does not affect the future, unless you let it. We know people make some mistakes once because they weren't aware of the system yet, which makes it no one's fault.
Now you are free to leave or you are free to stay. All I ask is that we move on from this issue. Other members, please do not comment on this post.
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You can wait for others to do it, but if they don't know how, you'll wait forever.
Be an example of what you want to see on HC and in the world.
http://www.heroesofmightandmagic.com
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Coldfyrius
Promising
Famous Hero
Vice-God for Marketing
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posted October 24, 2001 10:08 PM |
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Is HC actually degenerating?
That's a matter of opinion. I say it is, and I have my supports. Other ppeople disagree, and they have their supports as well. But:
If HC is degenerating, then making a thread to bring up the topic will spur people into better discussions in an effort to restore HC's old greatness.
If HC is not degenerating, then people will try to prove me wrong by making better posts, and as a result HC will be better than it has ever been.
This is not to say that I don't think HC is going downhill; I've yet to see a contradiction of my point about the higher percentage of posts being off-topic.
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"All the punks are gonna scream, 'yippee!'/ 'Cuz it's the thing that only eats hippies."
-The Dead Milkmen
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Shae_Trielle
Honorable
Famous Hero
of Heroes
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posted October 24, 2001 11:03 PM |
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You don't remember...
When threads like 'What is Honour', 'Hit and Run', 'Necro Castle' and a few others were right at the top of the list by a long way? And these were ALL to do with Heroes? You don't remember that?
I personally don't like it when people whinge about a certain state of something, yet that's all they do. Coldy, I haven't seen you make a half decent thread lately about Heroes (that honour would surely go to Oldtimer, lol!). You've just disappeared from the site for a month or more and then come back, found it hard to get back into a rhythm again and now, it seems to me, like you're griping and groaning about the same reasons which you posted for departing in the 'Leaving....' thread months ago.
We're all having a good time here. So far, the only person who seems to have real hang ups about the threads is you. Even Rychee, who's pretty nostalgic you know, can understand that as HoMM4 grows nearer, people are going to take a more relaxed frame of mind about Heroes 3. I still love the game, I still play it all the time, I'm still learning about stuff. You don't have to pay attention to threads like WAG if you don't want to. You don't have to read threads like Hexa's quest and Naked Girls Only. You just have to go and visit the Library forum. I can't understand why you whine about topics in a place as diverse as a pub, lol. Have you ever gone into a pub and told all the people in there that they're not talking about a 'specific' topic? LOL, you'd get your butt kicked right back out into the street again!
On another note, more people need to go and play ToH. That crap about it being inaccessible to newbies is pretty unfair. You obviously don't know what you're talking about. Veteran players being inaccessible to newbies however is another thing and after seeing the comments made on this board by plebes (i.e. some of you guys) about how crap the tournament is after playing ONE lousy game, then no wonder the vets don't bother to play you. I had trouble getting a game with the experienced players too. But you gotta chip away at it. Eventually you'll be part of the family, just like you are here.
You ToH knockers remind me of posters who only ever make one post about the board in their whole life and then never come back. Hardly fair is it?
Go and whine about ToH once you've become something more than a lowly recruit and then maybe some people will listen. Otherwise, just stick to your one player campaign maps please and let me and Rychee have all the fun.
*smile*
PS: 6 out of the Top 10 threads are related to Heroes, not 3 like you said. And the reason for Kuma's Tavern being so popular is simple. It's easy to talk about nothing. Much harder to say something intelligent.
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Milena
Responsible
Supreme Hero
in supreme disgrace
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posted October 24, 2001 11:37 PM |
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*applauses in the hall*
Quote:
PS: 6 out of the Top 10 threads are related to Heroes, not 3 like you said. And the reason for Kuma's Tavern being so popular is simple. It's easy to talk about nothing. Much harder to say something intelligent.
You really nailed him, girl, I like you! This is the best thing i have read on this thread so far.
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Milena
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Sha_Men
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jack-Of-No-Trades
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posted October 25, 2001 09:15 AM |
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TOH & this board...
Maybe this is wrong place but...
TOH has it's problems as newbie comes around people little bit reject them. Also some of the members play certain kind of maps that means newcomer possibly have no chance of winning. However through hard work...you can go into "the family" (Sounds like mafia, Godfather and his "right hand" we all know).
I don't really want to talk bad about TOH as I know how much hard work some people have done to make it so big. I have worked with few websites myself and that's been hard enough even if there have been more than just couple of guys trying to keep things running...
I personally have once whined about what kind of image TOH gave to outside person by reading messages in TOH board and hearing some comments from "lowly plebes". Of course I was pretty misunderstood which isn't new as my messages sometimes lack something...
There are always many kinds of problems with these kind of tournaments and especially if it's big as TOH.
However people can have good opinion something even if he is only lowly recruit or even outsider. Different perspective gives different view and you are also not "chained to be nice" and can say something totally relevant which may of course confuse people who are "chained" to be insider.
What I find kinda funny is that how TOH members are so defensive about TOH. Even slightest regard about TOH and they aren't asking what you mean but are already cutting your head off. It just shows how much people love the game and the tournament. I think the same thing is with this board. If somebody tries to "ruin it" people get quickly defensive and starts protecting it like angry bees covering their nest.
People should respect all. Period.
Whatever their score in some tournament is, whether they play HoMM or not, whether they play online or not.
In tournament the most important from my view is playing honorable games and in this board posting honorable messages.
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Catch the vigorous horse of your mind.
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Oldtimer
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Please leave a message after..
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posted October 25, 2001 10:40 AM |
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what hath oldtimer wrot...
Excuuuuse ME!
Where did this turn into an attack on TOH members and Tourney? My RANT hade to do with maps...Maps people, not toh, its people, and its edicate. As far as I can see its a good tournament, probably alot of fun, I wish I had time to be in it. But I don't, Its alot easier stealing 5 min. here and there to look at some posts than it is to invest 4+ hours to play a tourney game. But when I do go to zone and get a game it is usually with a kid who is trying out playing on the net, or someone who plays for 30 min. then drops. So my online playing experience maybe a bit lacking.
But I still maintain that the maps I have seen castrate the game, and make it less than it should be. Don't tell me that it must be this way in order to have all your creatures built and the main fight over within a 4 hour time frame. It is a strategy game! The strategy is how to beat your opponant using the limited resources that you have available, deciding which dwellings to build, deciding between buying creatures for short term or capitol for longer term. When you read strategy threads, you hear about how you can get your 7th level creature by day 7, I am sorry but if you have enough resources to build up that fast and still have money to buy out your creatures you are playing a crappy map, end of story.
Alot of the maps I see are mirror type maps with each player getting the exact same resources and artifact opportunities(and there are alot of high powered artifacts!)
Did you ever wonder why diplomacy became such a powerful skill? I maintain that the maps are so even and studied so well that any creatures gained by dipolmacy or extra movement of logistics can tip the balaced into that person's favor.
So if you are one of those thin skined people to whom I must assume that my comments cut so deep, you have my humblest sympathies.
(If anyone knows some good maps that are fun to play hotseat, please let me know where they are, Thanks.)
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<PLEASE DO NOT WAKE THE OLD MAN!>
"Zzzz...Zzzz...Zzzz..."
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