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antipaladin
Promising
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of Ooohs and Aaahs
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posted January 20, 2009 04:02 PM |
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Fatah and Hamas Controll differnt Regions.
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types in obscure english
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del_diablo
Legendary Hero
Manifest
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posted January 20, 2009 04:06 PM |
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Quote:
Fatah and Hamas Controll differnt Regions.
And what about the several others? There is 1 military factions that don't intend to give up, they are not a part of the goverment but they are so big that Hamas can not stop them. As far as i know there was a problem during the truce.
And for the note: They ARE not the army.
And there are several others to.
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lexxan
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Unimpressed by your logic
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posted January 20, 2009 04:14 PM |
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Quote:
And there are several others to.
The main difference between Hamas and Fatah is that Fatah is willing to share Judea with Israel in return for Independence from it. Hamas does NOT want to share, and wants to see the State of Israel anhialated from the map. Completely.
As for the Middle East, each state/organization is either with Fatah (most countries like Egypt, Jordan) or Hamas (Hezbollah, Iran, Al Qaeda, Syria).
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Coincidence? I think not!!!!
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Minion
Legendary Hero
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posted January 20, 2009 04:20 PM |
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Edited by Minion at 16:21, 20 Jan 2009.
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Hamas 'implicitly accepts Israel'
Palestinian militant group Hamas has agreed to a document backing a two-state solution to the conflict with Israel, officials say.
BBC : June 2006
Is this not true?
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"These friends probably started using condoms after having produced the most optimum amount of offsprings. Kudos to them for showing at least some restraint" - Tsar-ivor
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del_diablo
Legendary Hero
Manifest
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posted January 20, 2009 04:22 PM |
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Quote:
The main difference between Hamas and Fatah is that Fatah is willing to share Judea with Israel in return for Independence from it. Hamas does NOT want to share, and wants to see the State of Israel anhialated from the map. Completely.
Hamash was elected because of Israel. Not much more. They had trade blockades and Israel broke the last truce. So?
Quote:
Palestinian militant group Hamas has agreed to a document backing a two-state solution to the conflict with Israel, officials say.
BBC : June 2006
Is this not true?
Hamash CAN accept it, the underlieing militant groups that have a major popularity does not.
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antipaladin
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of Ooohs and Aaahs
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posted January 20, 2009 04:31 PM |
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hamas is not very orgensied. if i the leader accept,and you my solider decideds not too,and will go kill people i will not tell you not too.
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types in obscure english
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lexxan
Honorable
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Unimpressed by your logic
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posted January 20, 2009 04:52 PM |
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On other words: Hamas itself accepts it, but it's supporters do not.
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Coincidence? I think not!!!!
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TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
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posted January 20, 2009 05:35 PM |
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Edited by TheDeath at 17:38, 20 Jan 2009.
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@Lexxan:Quote:
You misunderstood me. If people got along, we wouldn't need a discussion Forum; everyone would simply get along and share a similar opinion. However, this is not the case, and I, just like you, HATE it, when emotions, bias and Ignorance stimulate people to post instead of Wisdom, Insight and objectivity. If the Former occurs, like shown by Minnion and Xerox here mainly, you get OSM battles, I hate to see, but love to participate in ^^ ( )
What's objective here?
I tell you what: the statistics. The numbers. And even those are just approximations.
@mvass:Quote:
As for a religion, at least religious zealots believe that if they fight for it, they'll go to heaven, so it makes some sense, even though I don't agree with them.
ROFL.
I mean just lol.
Only rookies think that, it sounds nice at first you know.
"Respectable" ones (and I do mean, even if we find them disgraceful for what they're fighting for) are way above that and genuinely believe in it, even if they have to suffer -- they may be aggressive or bastards, but they are not primitively selfish (i.e only for pleasures; since you also seem to make Heaven an image of pleasure when it is completely the opposite ('happiness' or 'peace' are like on the opposite side to pleasure), after all according to most stories, the Devil promises instant pleasure).
You have no idea about the emotions that trigger stuff like ideology, patriotism, fanaticism, etc... do you? They are all relatively similar, so no, nothing to do with "going to Heaven". If it is, it's second on the list, or probably even third.
I'm saying this cause I have some ideologies myself
(also, remember "fighting for freedom" or "sacrificing for freedom" -- clearly no instant benefit, one might argue even if it is an 'emotional' benefit at all)
@anti:Quote:
you insulted me atleast 4 times in this topic.
Well xerox may have insulted Israel or the Israeli as a whole, but not individual members like you did (even though I agree that xerox writes mostly nonsense)
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DagothGares
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No gods or kings
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posted January 20, 2009 05:42 PM |
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Quote:
You have no idea about the emotions that trigger stuff like ideology, patriotism, fanaticism, etc... do you?
Ugh..; Ideology <=> patriotism
Patriots are usually the types who 'feel one with their country' and are proud of the 'grand nation of Flanders!' or something. Usually, there's no ideology behind it, except perhaps a nation's history, though I sometimes like to think I'm more familiar with mine, than the average patriot of (Belgium, for example).
It's usually nothing more but a tool for populists. Though, it did form the state of Italy...
I personally have no such sentiments whatsoever. Though, I can respect it from someone else to a certain point. A,d if people can reap emotional benefits, that's good for them 
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TheDeath
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with serious business
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posted January 20, 2009 05:45 PM |
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That was an enumeration, not an equal sign
They are pretty similar in the case that people "fight for" them.
Patriotism usually includes not just an ideology (the nation's) but more than that though.
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DagothGares
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posted January 20, 2009 05:53 PM |
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Quote:
That was an enumeration, not an equal sign
Just, to be clear... I meant them as opposites
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lexxan
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Unimpressed by your logic
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posted January 20, 2009 06:23 PM |
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Quote:
@Lexxan:Quote:
You misunderstood me. If people got along, we wouldn't need a discussion Forum; everyone would simply get along and share a similar opinion. However, this is not the case, and I, just like you, HATE it, when emotions, bias and Ignorance stimulate people to post instead of Wisdom, Insight and objectivity. If the Former occurs, like shown by Minnion and Xerox here mainly, you get OSM battles, I hate to see, but love to participate in ^^ ()
What's objective here?
I tell you what: the statistics. The numbers. And even those are just approximations.
Dude, you wouldn't even recognise a joke when it would dance naked infront of you, wearing Xerox's Helmet That part wasn't really serious, and it was off-topic. I'm only objective about the topic - the rest doesn't have to be like that 
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Coincidence? I think not!!!!
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TheDeath
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with serious business
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posted January 20, 2009 06:32 PM |
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I don't expect jokes in the OSM. Especially not in long paragraphs.
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted January 20, 2009 07:18 PM |
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If people were not so broadsided.....meh.
60 years war and it goes on and on.
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antipaladin
Promising
Legendary Hero
of Ooohs and Aaahs
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posted January 20, 2009 07:41 PM |
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Quote:
@anti:Quote:
you insulted me atleast 4 times in this topic.
Well xerox may have insulted Israel or the Israeli as a whole, but not individual members like you did (even though I agree that xerox writes mostly nonsense)
qouting xeroex
Quote:
But 99.99% of all Failsraelians on this website acts like that..
this is directly an insult to israel memmbers in this forum.
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TheDeath
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with serious business
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posted January 20, 2009 07:52 PM |
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Ok maybe I missed that part, but IMO you shouldn't offend him in return
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xerox
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posted January 20, 2009 08:36 PM |
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Yes, because im younger so that means you cant say anything
Okey, I like Genielord and Geny is ok.
And yes, Buddhism is about tolerance but there is limit. Israel killing 500-1000 civilians is beyond the limit.
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Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill
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DagothGares
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No gods or kings
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posted January 20, 2009 08:40 PM |
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Quote:
And yes, Buddhism is about tolerance but there is limit.
How very Christian of you
"Seven times seventy times I shall forgive another one's sins. Seven times seventy times, the Lord is also patient with me."
- Song that was sung in church, back when I was in catholic school. (roughly translated)
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Geny
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What if Elvin was female?
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posted January 20, 2009 08:43 PM |
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First of all,
@All
Things have calmed down a bit since Angelito issued his warning, please don't drag the thread back into a flame war state without pointless accusations and such. If you have something to say to certain member please do it over HCM.
P.S. Great, now you made me sound like a moderator.
@Mvass, Death and some others
I can honestly say that I haven't read any of your last posts concerning patriotism and whatnot. I'm not going to decide what's considered on topic here and what not, but maybe you yourselves should consider making a new thread about it and concentrate on it.
Now to the matters at hand...
@Minion
Sure, let's see:
Quote:
• Using powerful shells in civilian areas which the army knew would cause large numbers of innocent casualties;
That depends on how powerful they are. If they are powerful enough to bring down a big building, then I think it's ok to use them when a certain building is recognized as a weapons' storage, military HQ etc. This is especially because the people living in the building were notified before the assault.
However, if the shells are powerful enough to ruin a street, then I'm not so sure it's ok, simply because I can't think of a good use for it.
Quote:
• Using banned weapons such as phosphorus bombs;
I'm wholeheartedly against it. Using phosphorus bombs is too destructive and unnecessary, that's why they're banned. There are however several problems concerning that issue. Israel haven't admitted using banned weapons. From what I hear there are 3 reasons for it:
1. One of the proofs that Israel used those bombs are burns that could've been caused by phosphorus bombs. There is a big difference between could have been and have been.
2. Another proof is the sight of the bombs exploding in the air. However, there are different types of phosphorus bombs, some of them burn the dangerous substance high in the air before it reaches the ground and therefore is harmless/less harmful.
3. (And this goes well with 2) From what I gather, international laws do not ban the usage of phosphorus bombs, but phosphorus bombs of certain types and concentrations that are extremely harmful.
Anyway, I am against banned weapons and the Israeli army is conducting some inquiries to find out whether someone on our side has actually used any of them without permission.
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• Holding Palestinian families as human shields;
I'm totally against it, although I don't really understand what you mean by that.
Quote:
• Attacking medical facilities, including the killing of 12 ambulance men in marked vehicles;
This is again a slightly complicated matter. Of course that killing medics and destroying medical equipment is wrong. On the other hand, there have been sightings of HAMAS people dressed as ambulance men, for example, there was a case in which an ambulance came to a place with lots of injured (some of them severely), but instead of taking with them those who desperately require medical attention, they loaded some more or less healthy men and drove of, thus relocating some of the HAMAS forces. So in case of mobile ambulances it can be hard to understand whether their neutral or hostile.
As for hospitals, I personally think that hospitals should be a neutral ground. Meaning that even if there are hostiles inside it should not be attacked. However, if those hostiles attack from the hospital (or nearby) they are turning it into a part of a battlefield and then retaliation is acceptable. (speaking in general, not some specific cases here)
Quote:
• Killing large numbers of police who had no military role.
That's a bit of a tough call. I think that it's acceptable, because policemen are still armed people under the hostile government control who can be used in warfare.
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xerox
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posted January 20, 2009 08:45 PM |
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Edited by xerox at 20:46, 20 Jan 2009.
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There are religious schools in your country? O.o
Thats forbidden in Sweden
In Sweden school or the society as whole are not supposed to have any ties to religion.
I did go to "Churchs Children Hour" or something like that when I was like 4 years old though but it was not so dangerous, it was like "Once upon a time there was a man called Jesus. Jesus was a witch and could walk on water. So he got killed. But he used his magic to become alive again. Then he died again. The end.".
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Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill
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This thread is pages long: 
