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Heroes Community > Other Games Exist Too > Thread: What do think about Baldurs Gate 2
Thread: What do think about Baldurs Gate 2 This thread is 5 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · «PREV / NEXT»
Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted February 04, 2017 08:10 PM

It's a completely different experience. When you have finished the game as many times as I have and with almost every possible party configuration, you look for different things
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frostysh
frostysh


Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
WHY?
posted February 05, 2017 04:56 AM
Edited by frostysh at 05:06, 05 Feb 2017.

Elvin said:
It's a completely different experience. When you have finished the game as many times as I have and with almost every possible party configuration, you look for different things
My playtrough was till Illithid city, and completed every quest, and subplot that was aviable till that moment.

I cannot realize how you can defeat a Dragon, on 12 lvl, with your solo-hero, with my configuration with max possible difficulty (modes etc) - I think it is just impossible.
Dragons, with SCS pre-cast and "Improved Dragons" have something near 800 HP, as I remembered, and this guys can kill anything and everything on that level, with single blow.

You will lose many plots that can be resolved only if in your party included some Chars.

The game is not developed for solo, you will face parties that attack you from ambush, and they will be strong, corresponding to your level ("Improved Random Encounters"), they have mages, clerics, shooters, and fighters, including invisible fighters - they will tear apart any solo char.

And third off - this is just boring, companions tells a jokes in fights and in peaceful times .

And HEY! You have walktroughed with all possible character's plots, So you have slaughtered those idiotic guys to help those stupid Dorn? Well, I do like those idiotic pity guys too, but too slaughter them - it is too much .
Dorn is too creepy, imho.    
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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted February 07, 2017 06:09 AM

Have had some funny incidents so far.

- Took down the lich at the city gates soon after escaping Irenicus dungeon with next to no spells ^^ Staff of terror ftw!

- Later I removed the ring of 18 charisma and died on the spot Turns out abusing the staff drains your charisma to negative levels which.. causes you to die!

- I could not carry the poisoned guy so I used the strength booster and barely managed to carry him till the adventure mart to buy the belt of strength!

- Since I could not use the healing scrolls on the empathic manifestation, I summoned a planetar to heal it.

- Holy cow there is a slingshot that does not run out of +5 bullets! Helped me take down Kangaxx since dragon's breath and horrid wilting won't work on it in enhanced A demilich went down with improved haste/meteor missiles/magic immunity and a slingshot!

Heh, fun times.


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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted February 07, 2017 11:47 AM
Edited by Doomforge at 11:52, 07 Feb 2017.

I have very mixed feelings about the whole BG saga. Perhaps it even demands its own review.

BG1 was terribly paced, and there was a level cap (of 7? i don't remember), making it a game where most of the time you couldn't sense even a hint of progression. The character walking speed was slow, and the interface was dreadful. 90% of the time you were looking at your party walking across the screen, or navigating the crappy interface. Combat animations were dreadful as well, and the engine was ridiculous, it couldn't even display 1 or 2 attacks per round, it displayed 5, out of which only (your attack number) were non-dummied animations. WTH!?

On top of that, the NPC had absolutely no character whatsover and pretty much never spoke at all except for their initial dialogue. I guess that left a lot to imagination, but... yeah. And the bugs. There were so many.....

But I still enjoyed it as a part of the whole saga, because, once you look back, you realize that you're playing a hero LITERALLY from a level 1 weakling challenged by dogs straight to an almighty demigod. Something that has never been properly done ever again.

Plus, the game has a very pleasant atmosphere, nice (albeit simple) ambient music, and feels just right if you can live with the pacing.

BG2 was faster, even a bit too fast, more akin modern RPGs. The locations vary a lot and change rapidly (spellhold, underwater world, underdark), making your head spin. And ToB is terrible. Rushed and unfinished, which none of the developers tried to hide (albeit the content that has been introduced is very interesting).


In the end, the game shows true colors when modded. Nowadays, there's the EE Trilogy that combines all (including Siege of Dragonspear - guess you could call it quadrology now?), Sword Coast Stratagems that makes it properly challenging (the original game is stupidly easy and filled with abusable exploits - some are really ridiculous. Like planetar army. Heh.), plus there's a ton of quality mods that improve the companions, flesh them out and expand upon the romance options (ranging from amazing, such as BG1 NPC project that FINALLY gives NPCs of BG1 personality, to small but cool like the Banter pack for BG2). Only by modding one can get the definite BG experience (and fix the bugs, of course).

I kinda wish ToB was a proper game and not a crappy,rushed expansion, but BG (in the form of EET) still is one of the most epic western RPG adventures to be played. And there's SO_MUCH_POWERGAMING possible!

Also, traditionally, 99% players point to wrong things as the strongest or most abusable, but that's the LameFAQs generation for you
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Galaad
Galaad


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Enrothian Conservative Party
posted February 07, 2017 12:25 PM

I only played Shadow of Amn as a kid and really enjoyed it, but I never finished it. Lame I know stfu
It's been a while since I'm thinking of launching it again, but I have been hesitating between the original and EE, so you would recommend the latter Doom? What are the best mods?
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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted February 07, 2017 12:54 PM

I've played both and would say go for enhanced. Original has way too many bugs most of which seem to be fixed in enhanced - though I'm pretty sure there are unofficial patches for those. Be sure to take care of those if you are to play the original, otherwise go enhanced.
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verriker
verriker


Honorable
Legendary Hero
No Use Crying Erwin Spilt Milk
posted February 07, 2017 01:11 PM

to be honest though beware that the expanded edition literally has a lot of fan fiction in terms of the writing (the entire Siege at Dragonspear, although not bad, is a fan fiction and in the main game several new companions are shoehorned who are HUGELY jarring and all stick out like sore thumb), so if you want a purer experience mate be ready to discern between the original content and the stuff Team Trent shoved in lol
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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted February 07, 2017 01:36 PM
Edited by Elvin at 13:37, 07 Feb 2017.

Not really a problem, you can ignore those. I remember I didn't care much for Meera(annoyingly talkative) and Rassad(boring but he's a monk) but I'd be interested to check Hexxat and Dorn. Hexxat had a rather interesting introduction though I didn't keep her.
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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted February 08, 2017 02:07 PM

Galaad said:
I only played Shadow of Amn as a kid and really enjoyed it, but I never finished it. Lame I know stfu
It's been a while since I'm thinking of launching it again, but I have been hesitating between the original and EE, so you would recommend the latter Doom? What are the best mods?


go Enhanced, it introduces some new stuff, adds quests and has more polish in general.

Best mods IMHO:

1. Sword Coast Stratagems (pretty much a must to me, it requires some customization but it helps with the game's low difficulty. BUT the game remains fair, ie. the enemies only do what they should and you don't meet level 1 wizards with a million spell sequencers containing level 9 spells... which is what I like).
2. BG Tweaks (aTweaks in regular version, too) - because there's plenty of rules in BG2 that just don't make sense and are not very faithful to D&D books.
3. BG NPC project - while this is a BG1 mod, if you ever play BG1, be sure to install it
4. EET - combines all the games in one.
5. Ascension - it changes ToB ending a bit to a more fitting one IIRC it now works with SCS properly.

If you're into some NPC interaction, there's plenty of NPC related mods that expand their dialogue. My personal favorite is Imoen Romance, because of excellent writing and very atmospheric music.


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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted February 08, 2017 02:36 PM

Not familiar with mods, should give it a try the next time

I was checking an online comparison between mage/thief and fighter/mage/thief at various points in the game and holy crap, the latter does not in any way lag behind. It is probably better till lategame. I've always thought that splitting your xp between 3 classes would be a big drawback but apparently your mage class will be only 1 level less at any given time!
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Doomforge
Doomforge


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Retired Hero
posted February 08, 2017 06:22 PM
Edited by Doomforge at 19:01, 08 Feb 2017.

Fighter/Mage/Thief is fantastic in small parties

You know, us ol'powergamers know a funny trick. Or rather, a few funny tricks. Wanna hear?

The Super Saiyan class

Fighter/Mage/Thief specialty. Cast "Mislead"(a level 6 mage spell) but away from enemies (easy if you prepare i.e. in another room or a different location within the same map). Mislead creates a copy of you while putting an invisibility spell on you and when dispelled, it reapplies the invisibility effect unless the image you left behind has been affected (dispelled or revealed with the likes of "True Sight" spell). But if you left it somewhere behind, it can't be affacted because it's physically not_there, thus, you're essentially permanently and unbreakably invisible for the duration of the spell.

And, that means that every attack you do is a backstab. So grab a Staff of Ram +6, use Greater Whirlwind and enjoy 10 APR with a x5 damage modifier with the strongest weapon in the game. Or, go for persistence, using a greater haste instead. If you want to lessen the burden of casting each spell individually, I suggest a "Spell Trigger" containing "Mislead", "Greater Haste" and "Tenser's Transformation". And voila, a super sayian mode for you, you press a button and you become GOD. Now, for some overkill Super Saiyan power, use the HLA "Critical Strike" so that every backstab you do is also a critical hit. Damage times 10, baby!

Happy carnage!

(unfortunately, as getting lvl 6 mage spells takes a good, long while... and you'll be stuck on crap amount of spells a LONG time. plus, pretty much every bigger enemy is immune to backstab. This includes stuff you'd want to backstab in the first place - Dragons, liches, etc. But, there's a couple places where it's useful. My favorite place is Underdark. Drow fighters have a lot of HP and there's plenty of them... and they are vulnerable to backstab. You know what to do )

Empire Strikes Back: Attack of the Clones

the true gamebreaker of this game is... project image. Why? because of its interaction between Helm of Vhailor (it's a fighter-only item, but Fighter/mages, FMTs or bards can learn HLA "use any item" to use it). You can make copies from copies, and the 2nd copies will have the project image/simulacrum restrictions lifted, allowing you to produce even more copies, and due to a bug, the copies can actually bypass the celestial summon limit, meaning you can i.e. produce a Planetar army this way. That's why I like SCS, it has an option to get rid of that cheesy stuff.

Master of Magic and Cheese

But, even SCS isn't perfect. BG2 fans are pretty familiar with the age-old debate: who's the strongest mage class in the game? A lot of players will point to Sorcerer, but that's a wrong answer the strongest mage in the game is Wild Mage. That's because of a bug/exploit that allows the "Chaos shield" spell to stack when used in spell sequencers/spell triggers, meaning you essentially get 100 in every wild surge roll (100 = spell cast normally). This means 6 extra "free" casts of ANY spell in the game out of the level 1 spell "reckles Dweomer". And, through the spell "Limited wish" that ALWAYS offers you an option to restore 1 instance of spells of level 1,2,3,4 you get a maximum of 15 free casts of any spell of the game, assuming that you have memorized 6 x Reckless Dweomer and 9 x Limited Wish. You can get 9 level 7 spell slots because you naturally get 6, and you get one extra level 7 from a HLA, Circlet of Netheril and Ring of Wizardry.

With 15 free casts without resting, you're bound to get at least one "rest and rememorize" (level9 spell) Wish, which means Wild mage is the only mage that can actually dish out infinite spells without reloading the game or resting the traditional way

And even if you play legit (I do) and don't stack Chaos Shields, Wild Mage has a 78% chance to get "Spell cast normally" effect from Wild Surge on his final (31th) character level, assuming you're using the best gear possible, so it's pretty reliable.

Of course, any wizard can get infinite spells per day with a bugged interaction between spell trap and project image, but let's not go there...

Me Smash!

perhaps the least "gamebreaking" stuff here: a properly developed Half-Orc Fighter/Thief can actually become a natural 25STR (without using Crom Faeyr) powerhouse that's also 100% magic resistant. All of that while restoring his HP like crazy 8 times per turn with Foebane. if there's an "autoattack idiotproof AFK" kind of character, I'd point to this one Also, he makes monk a sad panda.

And the eurovision winner is...

... any bard. Just give him a helm of vhailor. Start duping your images. And sing. Improved bard song stacks. Enjoy your +40 damage, +40 thac0, magic immune party

How many of these tactics/bugs/exploits were you aware of?

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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted February 08, 2017 07:00 PM

Doomforge.. You scare me.
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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted February 08, 2017 07:01 PM
Edited by Doomforge at 19:05, 08 Feb 2017.

yeah I know

Obviously, using any of these (except the FMT thing and Halforc stuff) is pointless, but it does make you wonder about the competence of beta testers in general

And the Halforc Fighter-Thief is my favorite character. Partially because he can go on autopilot and not piss himself of fear of mages, and partially because a 25 STR Chaotic Evil Orc feels GOOD.

ME CRUSH!
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Verdadero_Foe
Verdadero_Foe

Tavern Dweller
posted February 09, 2017 01:11 AM

But those are exploits that get old fast. It is almost the same as giving the killsword to each character. You can also write a script with auto cast and some other nasty things. It's funny, but the game gets too easy.

Some spells where taken from obscure sources, or had a bad implementation. With those spells, mage and sorcerer were too powerful.

Barbarian and monk are well implemented. Sorcerer not, in my opinion. In 3rd edition, mage and sorcerer can cast almost the same number of spells per day. And I like mages more, because intelligence gives more ability points. In Baldur's Gate II, a sorcerer can cast like three spells more for each level compared to a mage. Too much.

About Throne of Bhaal... Baldur's Gate II lack a difficult, hard final battle. Throne of Bhaal got that right, but as a whole, it's behind vanilla BG2. Too much powerful weapons, unimaginative enemies ("burning man", "chromatic demon"... ok) and weird ways to kill some monsters (when all the foot soldiers and their childrens had a long sword +3 you need normal weapons to kill a mighty beast). I'm not saying that it is not fun, but I prefer BG2 without this expansion.
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Galaad
Galaad


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Enrothian Conservative Party
posted February 09, 2017 12:36 PM

Thanks for the advices all, I have no time for it right now but I'll be sure to post in here when I get to it.

PS. IMO Doom's post deserves a +QP.
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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted February 09, 2017 12:41 PM

Throne of Bhaal is just a small part of what baldur's gate has to offer. Certainly enjoyable but not quite there.
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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted February 09, 2017 05:55 PM

Verdadero_Foe said:
But those are exploits that get old fast. It is almost the same as giving the killsword to each character. You can also write a script with auto cast and some other nasty things. It's funny, but the game gets too easy.


I agree. I have most fun when avoiding exploits. But, if you're digging deep into the combat mechanics trying to understand them and squeeze most of them, learning the exploits is a byproduct.

My personal rules for the game usually include playing as the game was intended. Did the devs intend a planetar army? probably not. Thus, I don't use them. I only stray from developers' vision when it comes to making games harder - and only within legit game rules (i.e. by improving the AI - not by multiplying monster damage by 100).

Fun fact: people have been using Ranger/Cleric dual or multiclass for ages, and that, technically, is also an exploit. Rangers/Clerics were never supposed to obtain Druid spells above level 3. This was fixed in BG2:EE, but a wave of negativity from the fans forced Beamdog to add an ini command that allows to re-enable the engine bug responsible for level 3+ druidic spells for Ranger/Clerics. Huh.


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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted February 09, 2017 06:57 PM

Doomforge said:

Best mods IMHO:

1. Sword Coast Stratagems (pretty much a must to me, it requires some customization but it helps with the game's low difficulty. BUT the game remains fair, ie. the enemies only do what they should and you don't meet level 1 wizards with a million spell sequencers containing level 9 spells... which is what I like).
2. BG Tweaks (aTweaks in regular version, too) - because there's plenty of rules in BG2 that just don't make sense and are not very faithful to D&D books.
3. BG NPC project - while this is a BG1 mod, if you ever play BG1, be sure to install it
4. EET - combines all the games in one.
5. Ascension - it changes ToB ending a bit to a more fitting one IIRC it now works with SCS properly.

Any specific order of installing?

I bumped on this, hope the guy wasn't missing anything. I'd hate to cause any bugs due to incompatible mods.
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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted February 09, 2017 07:31 PM
Edited by Doomforge at 19:32, 09 Feb 2017.

It's best to use Big World Setup. It will automatically set the install order of all supported mods for you (and warn you if there are incompatible mods). It has a very simple interface.

It supports most of the mods nowadays (at least those that are worth playing, there's some obscure stuff missing but honestly, screw that )
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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Tastes like chicken
posted February 09, 2017 07:34 PM

What happens if I try to mod the game DURING a playthrough?
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