|
| Thread: Second civil war in the US? |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · «PREV |
|
fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
|
posted January 27, 2016 07:49 PM |
|
|
Minion said:
The us police is pandering to these occupants WAY TOO MUCH. Why do they allow food donations to them? Why don't they cut the power?
I guarantee that if it was any other group than white rightwing americans they would not be allowed to occupy a federal building this long.
you forget who is backing them up. actions taken against them can be seen as actions against all americans, simply for standing up for what they believe in; and especially when regarding the u.s. constitution.
the feds got involved, because it involves federal land. they are intelligent enough, not to go in there, guns blazing. they SHOULD be, after what happened in waco. your pov on this isn't taking into account the other side of this issue at all.
do you see these militia men as terrorists? because terrorists kill people without asking questions. they don't stage peaceful demonstrations, last i checked. they don't occupy and intend to defend their position with firearms, IF NEED BE. that's what MILITIA'S are FOR.
the very reason they are willing to go that far, is BECAUSE PEACEFUL DEMONSTRATIONS DON'T CHANGE ANYTHING. why do you think they go this far in the first place? because american voices AREN'T BEING HEARD.
i don't get why anyone would really be against a militia. especially when that militia challenges ANY government(which are corrupt to the core, may i remind everyone).
|
|
Minion
Legendary Hero
|
|
posted January 27, 2016 08:08 PM |
|
Edited by Minion at 20:12, 27 Jan 2016.
|
No I never want feds to go guns blazing anywhere, unless someone is in danger of course. But there is no reason NOT to cut the power from the place, they will come out. It costs tens of thousands of taxpayer money every day that they are there. That is not right.
They also threaten with violence, that is NEVER ok.
I don't have anything against peaceful occupations when people are making a point or demonstrating.
____________
"These friends probably started using condoms after having produced the most optimum amount of offsprings. Kudos to them for showing at least some restraint" - Tsar-ivor
|
|
kipshasz
Undefeatable Hero
Elvin's Darkside
|
|
posted January 27, 2016 08:53 PM |
|
|
I actually don't blame the feds. in the end those in the field are just pawns. rank and file soldiers.
This oregon insurection is the bleepslap of karma for all those color revolutions that the yankeestani government funded. I kinda look forward to it escalating.
____________
"Kip is the Gavin McInnes of HC" - Salamandre
"Ashan to the Trashcan", "I got PTSD from H7. " - LizardWarrior
|
|
fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted January 27, 2016 09:28 PM |
|
|
kipshasz said:
I kinda look forward to it escalating.
lol. you're just in it for the fun, aren't you? i can relate to that. 
|
|
fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted January 27, 2016 09:32 PM |
|
|
Minion said:
I don't have anything against peaceful occupations when people are making a point or demonstrating.
are you aware that these people are targeted much more than a group who are armed? they get slapped in jail, beat, etc. the firearms let the authorites know that they are to be taken seriously. they know how things can escalate, and they are prepared for it.
you take your average hipster protester, getting maced in the face and beaten by simply sitting on the ground in a peaceful protest, and you'll see why these guys feel the need to carry firearms and go the extra mile, to make a point.
it's an escalation of force, only this time, FOR the people, instead of AGAINST them. some of you are looking at this entirely the wrong way. when people are pushed, they push back.
|
|
kipshasz
Undefeatable Hero
Elvin's Darkside
|
|
posted January 27, 2016 09:53 PM |
|
|
fred79 said:
kipshasz said:
I kinda look forward to it escalating.
lol. you're just in it for the fun, aren't you? i can relate to that.
It's only fair I suppose. The U.S. government had been funding groups like mujahideen for decades. A lot of support for ukrainian maidan comes from the states. meanwhile may of the US army vets are sitting in the street with a begging bowl. Detroit had become a ghost town. and that's just a few of the domestic issues in the US.
Any sort of insurrection was bound to happen sooner or later. US citizens are pissed off at the government policies. The US senate and the prezident need to take care of their own people first, that's why they were elected in the first place.
But I guess the allmighty dollar is more powerful than the needs of your voters.
____________
"Kip is the Gavin McInnes of HC" - Salamandre
"Ashan to the Trashcan", "I got PTSD from H7. " - LizardWarrior
|
|
Minion
Legendary Hero
|
|
posted January 27, 2016 09:53 PM |
|
|
Ok this is USA and not Europe I get it. You can be armed when occupying stuff. I guess my main concern is that some of the people occupying the place have threatened to kill all the police they will see. I don't like the rhetoric at all - they don't sound smart. Just say that you will defend the area or anything else than you will "kill people"
Ok that is not all of them, just some. So far things have gone pretty ok, except that that they have already killed each other! One was shot dead (drunk) by another one for self defense. Oh yeah did I mention they are drinking the money people send for them in support, lololol.
And all this to avoid being sentenced for arson. WHICH THEY DID! I don't see the nobility of this cause fred, I just don't. So they should get free land because they are armed??? I don't thinks so.
____________
"These friends probably started using condoms after having produced the most optimum amount of offsprings. Kudos to them for showing at least some restraint" - Tsar-ivor
|
|
fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted January 27, 2016 10:15 PM |
|
Edited by fred79 at 22:16, 27 Jan 2016.
|
@ kip: yeah, a lot of people are incensed about government policies and abuse of foreign and domestic people, but not nearly enough to make a difference. or at least, they don't think it's that big of a deal, because "safety" and "technology".
@ minion: i agree, that many people out there are dumbasses, no matter what they stand for or do. behind you 1000% there. i'm also behind you, that occupying for the current reason they are, is stupid. they aren't exactly picking the battles they SHOULD be picking. there are far more pertinent(and absolutely heinous) things to rally against. abusive land use by civilians isn't one of them, imo. i'm behind the feds on that, that the government should protect land from dumbasses.
but then, many in government ALSO think they should have a right to private land, to drill for whatever, or run a pipeline through whatever. as kip pointed out, it's all about the dollar. everything in the human world is, and it's disgusting.
my point is, is that a militia, existing and standing up for the populace, and standing AGAINST a corrupt entity such as the government, is a good thing.
think about it like this: if you didn't have traffic lights, people wouldn't know when to stop, or go. it'd be a free-for-all, and everyone would likely suffer.
now, the traffic lights could either be the feds stopping dumbasses from ruining land, or the militias stopping the government from encroaching on people and land. both sides do stupid things, that much is obvious, because both sides contain idiots.
BUT both should be there, to always give the other the idea that they can't just do whatever the hell they want.
do you understand where i'm coming from now?
|
|
fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted January 28, 2016 02:59 AM |
|
Edited by fred79 at 03:18, 28 Jan 2016.
|
more on the feds' reactions to members of the group:
Quote:
About two hours after the initial confrontation, authorities also arrested Internet radio host Pete Santilli, a supporter of the occupation who has documented the case on his program and via live stream since it began.
this guy only documented and displayed his support for the group; and he was arrested. but... "freedom of speech", right? this is what the "patriot" act is capable of. arresting actual patriots. 
edit: the plot apparently thickens:
or maybe this guy is an fbi informant. i'm not looking at the validity of this internet website(since sites like these are questionable at best... at least as questionable as cnn, anyway ), but how they mention anonymous being the group that gave them the info. if anonymous did indeed find that this guy was working with the feds, then i'd say it's most likely true. anonymous likes to reveal the truth about people, and they're damn good at it... no one can deny that they have a history of discovering the truth.
then again, this could just be a slander attempt by the feds. who knows. 
|
|
Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
|
|
posted January 28, 2016 09:54 AM |
|
|
I always wondered why there's no civil war at Detroit/Destroit.
That place is such a ruin. It makes Pooland look good.
____________
We reached to the stars and everything is now ours
|
|
fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted January 28, 2016 01:45 PM |
|
|
Doomforge said:
I always wondered why there's no civil war at Detroit/Destroit.
there are no sides. everyone is for themselves(most are just regular people trying to get by). and gangs almost never unite with one another unless there's a much more beneficial goal in mind for them. like say, looting or rioting.
|
|
fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted January 28, 2016 11:34 PM |
|
|
|
friendofgunnar
Honorable
Legendary Hero
able to speed up time
|
|
posted January 29, 2016 06:01 AM |
|
|
Well the video is out of Finicum's last minutes, and there's a very clear transition from "holding both hands up in the air" to "one hand is pulling back the jacket and the other hand is reaching for a firearm." My impression though wasn't that he was intending to kill anybody, but that he clearly intended to die. In other words he was enacting a "death by cop".
This is not a fictional thing, it happened just a block and a half away from me a few years back. This one dude was having all manners of difficulties with his spouse and with finances and had pretty much decided that he was at the end of his rope. He got hammered drunk, took out his assault rifle, and starting making angry threats to anybody within earshot. Eventually the police came and he decided to end his own life by pointing the assault rifle at them. He fell under a hail of bullets. I could hear the gunshots clearly from my own apartment. The irony is that even though he got hit by several bullets he's still alive.
This was Finicum's dilemma. He'd reached the end of the line. Like I said, I don't truly believe that he would have actually murdered anybody given the chance but I'm quite sure the thought of becoming a rural martyr was a more fitting conclusion to his life than an anti-climactic several years spent in federal prison.
And this illustrates a problem with American white conservative culture that's a direct analog to the problem with Islamic extremism. These are all people who are steeped in gun culture and the culture of the "true american revolutionaries" who see that "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." (Thanks Fred for keeping that rolling!). When they decided to take their grievance to the public they decided to do it with long guns. Because they have such an insular culture, and also because they were stupid, they weren't aware of how terrible that looked. They would have gotten much more traction with some type of clever publicity stunt - like for example blocking traffic somewhere with a pile of dead cows. Lol, in this day and age something like that could have gone viral in a few hours. Instead they decided to frame their publicity stunt in the form of an insurrection. What a waste.
|
| |
|
|
