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Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: Popular Culture
Thread: Popular Culture This thread is 4 pages long: 1 2 3 4 · «PREV
markkur
markkur


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
posted February 17, 2017 04:07 PM

But Artu...that blue dot is not...like...Pale...man.

Sagan's title for his description kinda misses a connection too? If so? I just painted in 3 minutes, a large square canvas...Red. Under it, I have a framed yellow poster listing "Quotes in black" given in Soviet-Communist speeches. Only 42,000 smackers...it's is a steal.

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted February 17, 2017 04:33 PM

Isn't that totally beside the point?

I mean, OP linked to a video in which a guy rants about marxist-leninist conspiracy to destroy "culture" by producing shallow crap and corrupting all standards.

The video is a load of nonsense. If you want a simple explanation for why things are the way they are, marxist theory is providing the solution. It's the economy that determines the culture (not the other way round), so what we have is the (mass) culture that capitalism brought forth - and it fits the picture.

Culture is more than ART, though. Culture includes things like clothing style, eating habits, even advertisement, furniture and a lot more. Whether a blue canvas is sold for a couple million bucks or a few cents, doesn't matter in this regard, and whether it IS art indeed and what kind of art or whether it's bollocks is irrelevant, especially with a view on the content of this video.
You may find a lot of "trash" in today's culture (you don't have to look further than the plethora of "reality shows" in TV), but that is mistaking ART with ENTERTAINMENT: there IS some overlapping, but as there is food that just fills your stomach, there is also "entertainment" that isn't artful - but still entertaining in some way.
Entertainment plays a big role in our society - not only for SOME, but for all. Because we have a lot of time now. Entertainment. Not necessarily ART. People like to be entertained. So what?

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markkur
markkur


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
posted February 17, 2017 04:49 PM

JJ, It was a joke. <imvho> You need to laugh a bit more, here at HC...like you used to?...well, at least when you were not engaged writing critical-reviews on HoMM.

ps let's don't pursue OP & derailing. I've witnessed much derailing lately and at least mine was or a lighthearted-laugh. (truly...and not because I could think up modern-art all day everyday)

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frostysh
frostysh


Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
WHY?
posted February 17, 2017 04:51 PM
Edited by frostysh at 17:18, 17 Feb 2017.

markkur said:
But Artu...that blue dot is not...like...Pale...man.

Sagan's title for his description kinda misses a connection too? If so? I just painted in 3 minutes, a large square canvas...Red. Under it, I have a framed yellow poster listing "Quotes in black" given in Soviet-Communist speeches. Only 42,000 smackers...it's is a steal.
mr markkur,

1. If somebody do not see "art" when looking in the modern art, - it is their personal problems. It is a matter of habits, it is a matter of a choice and tastes. For an example - this stuff of mr Kazimir Malevich

Quote:
Kazimir Malevich, 1915, Black Suprematic Square, oil on linen canvas, 79.5 x 79.5 cm, Tretyakov Gallery, Moscow


For somebody this piece of .. of a square,  is a bloody-hell art. For somebody it it no difference from a paper-target for shooting practice, for somebody it is just a Geometric graph. etc

Today with a help of "GIMP" like graphical program, you can create your own stuff like that:

Quote:
Leonardo da Vinci, Mona Lisa - Wikipedia


And this is a one of the greatest and famous paintings of the all times! If mr Leonardo may look at modern 2D Graphic, like this one  - https://www.deviantart.com ,

=== there was a cool image ===

he may say - "WOW! Dude, it is an Amazing..." .

You are forget that the things called "a classic art" today, in the time when those things born - well this things was more like a popular culture today .
Perhaps this "Blue Dot" after ~500 years will be like a "Mona Lisa" today, who hell knows... It is a matter of habits and tastes, as I said.
But of course the industrialization placed in the mass-production the "art" too, so it is have a many disadvantages.
The matter of art, is not how many time you have spent to create it , or how many peoples you may persuade in your "idea", or how many money you will gather...

P.S. Perhaps I have poor a sense of humor too , anyway a nice joke mr markkur .

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Galaad
Galaad


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Forge activist
posted February 17, 2017 05:05 PM

frostysh said:
Galaad said:
Can you stop IMAGESPAM in OSM? It's freaking annoying. And replacing them with a thousand smileys doesn't make it better.

Thanks in advance!
Well me sorry if my images bothering you, mr Galaad, but ah, I thought this image will looks cool, "right on topic" of ma' post about those song. But okey-dokey, I will try to not post many images in this "OSM" .


Really I mean, please pretty please with sugar on top?
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frostysh
frostysh


Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
WHY?
posted February 17, 2017 05:15 PM

Galaad said:

Really I mean, please pretty please with sugar on top?
Well, I have deleted those image from my post from the topic about music - because those image was unnecessary.
I am trying, but in this case - the graphic art is large part of the modern culture, both shallow and deep, so it is hard to avoid of posting the images of pictures.
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Galaad
Galaad


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Forge activist
posted February 17, 2017 06:40 PM

frostysh said:
Well, I have deleted those image from my post from the topic about music - because those image was unnecessary.
I am trying, but in this case - the graphic art is large part of the modern culture, both shallow and deep, so it is hard to avoid of posting the images of pictures.


You could always link them? You always put big images with little text, and you put all these colors and multitude of smileys all the time, don't you want to make a Herculean effort like the rest of us and try to make your posts not look so much like eyesores? I am sure it would be very appreciated by everyone, unless you really have a very very poor care about this forum and its users, even though you daily post in it.
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"Corribus is a teddy bear" - Blizzardboy

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markkur
markkur


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
posted February 17, 2017 06:55 PM

frostysh said:
...If somebody do not see "art" when looking in the modern art, - it is their personal problems.

I suggest "tastes" and not "problems". "Eye of the beholder" and all that jazz.


frostysh said:

P.S. Perhaps I have poor a sense of humor too , anyway a nice joke mr markkur .


Laughter is good Medicine, for humanities basic emotional-woes. And is even a "plus" for serious bodily illness.

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted February 17, 2017 08:06 PM
Edited by artu at 20:07, 17 Feb 2017.

Look, the thing is, people usually pick some iconic masterpiece from the past and then unproportionally compare it to the first thing they stumble upon. However, imagine some baron from 15th century, commissioning a portrait of his daughter or some picnic scene etc... Now, is that art exceptionally elevating or does it decypher the meaning of life to you (or to him)? Now, look at a corner from a modern living room such as this:



Do you really think that picture looks ugly? Do you think a traditional painting would fit better in there? If you are reasonably wealthy or even upper middle class, paying something like 30.000 dollars for such a thing is not much of a big deal for you, besides, for some people, it's also an investment. Yes, it's not Guernica but it doesn't pretend to be that either. Should it necessarily have the most direct or most exquisite meaning? What was the exquisite meaning of the picnic scene? One shouldn't consider every piece of art work as some kind of manifesto.
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I hope I am mistaking - frostysh

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frostysh
frostysh


Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
WHY?
posted February 17, 2017 08:42 PM
Edited by frostysh at 20:45, 17 Feb 2017.

Galaad -

What is mean eyesores? ahh, nevermind, I think it is something that harming the eye, I will google that...

1. I am downloading and reading my posts by myself, and I am very happy and very enjoyed of posts of mine. So I do not know, why it may be such pain to read my post for somebody else.

2. Most of users not responding to posts on this forum, I do not know, if they reading my posts or not, but I can make a prediction - they are not .

3. I trying to use a small-size image, that does not restrict of reading any other posts , i.e. as some large downloaded are size images in the browser program.

4. My images (the images that I am using in my posts) does not restrict any rules of this forum (COC or whatever it's called), my images is family safe.

Counting the all of above mentioned factors, I can achieve the conclusion that my images is not so big problem, as you describing mr Galaad. And as I said, I trying to decrease it number (despite this is not so easy for myself ), you can see this attempts in this topic, for an example - I have deleted one "direct link" for an image.

markkur -

Yeah, frostysh is like to laugh and smile to . Well, I have a very sad examples in my life when my dark humor, and "permanent-smiling-face despite of situation" grabbed me into a ... difficult situations So I can add - that laughter is not only a good medicine, it is also may be a very fast and painful way to the places and conditions that better to be avoided yeah...

P.S. What is means "Eye of Beholder" - it is something from a mythology or what?

artu -

30k for such piece of a .. of a wall, I will never completely understood the rich peoples . Just give ~100 cashi for frostysh, and I will copy-past in GIMP a better picture . I am joking.

P.S. this living room on the picture - sux.
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Neraus
Neraus


Supreme Hero
Emperor of the Bromans
posted February 17, 2017 08:44 PM
Edited by Neraus at 20:48, 17 Feb 2017.

I have a painting in my living room, you could assimilate it to an impressionist painting... I think, there are no outlines no prospectic study, yet there is attention to color...

My mother's tastes in art are besides the point, that painting was made some years ago and we bought it at an art gallery in my hometown.
If you saw it you could clearly see it's not that state of the art painting from the likes of the greats of the Renaissance, yet it's beautiful in its way, or so I think.
The great difference between that painting and other contemporary paintings is that it is figurative, by the way, opposite to it there is a more modern painting, of the likes of the one posted by artu, although of course, with colours more in line with the room.
And we even have in the same room a painting of flowers made in a more classic way.

As I said, besides the aesthetic tastes, the only painting in the room that I skim over is the modern one, it looks more like decor to me than a real painting.

Lastly, since I'm an elitist villain, I also have more traditional paintings over at my childhood home, of which one has a distinctly refined frame to the point of being baroque, and it's exquisite in that living room, since that is a room in a more old style.

All of this tangent is to say, I don't get why people buy modern non-figurative art, it's not necessarily a sign of the ages, and you don't really need to spend a fortune to get a decent painting, the aforementioned impressionist style painting was actually pretty cheap, and it looks quite beautiful.

So pardon me for the off-topic, I needed to chime in for this.

EDIT::

frostysh said:
P.S. What is means "Eye of Beholder" - it is something from a mythology or what?  


"Beauty is in the eye of the beholder" simply means that beauty is subjective, you like what you like, not necessarily what others like.
A beholder is one that beholds, which is another way of saying one that observes or sees.
For this reason there is a monster called beholder, since it's a disembodied eye that looks at things.
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Wait, where is my clever punchline?

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted February 17, 2017 09:07 PM
Edited by artu at 21:13, 17 Feb 2017.

Neraus said:
All of this tangent is to say, I don't get why people buy modern non-figurative art, it's not necessarily a sign of the ages, and you don't really need to spend a fortune to get a decent painting, the aforementioned impressionist style painting was actually pretty cheap, and it looks quite beautiful.

I mentioned the price because people think they are too much but they are actually not, I mean, some people pay a thousand dollars to unlock a character on a mobile game. Of course, you can find something more traditional for similar prices but as weird as it may seem to you, people actually like non-figurative art. When you're familiar to it, you grow a taste for it. Keep in mind that some tribes, when first meeting European settlers, gave the same reaction to figurative art! They had no concept of paintings at all, so they were simply blind to them, they used to just pass them by. Like anything abstract, non-figurative art is like a language you should first learn a little to enjoy, people who don't like poetry can't comprehend layered metaphors for instance.
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I hope I am mistaking - frostysh

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Neraus
Neraus


Supreme Hero
Emperor of the Bromans
posted February 17, 2017 09:18 PM

That's why I added modern, looking at Al-Hazin's examples of Arabic calligraphy I can see the beauty in it, but when I criticise (and I'm not even really criticising I'm more surprised) modern non-figurative art I'm referring to sprays of paint on a canvas, cuts on a canvas or piles of shoes or other things...

I get that it's art, it makes me question what passed in the mind of the artist, but I can't really see the value in it...

Shame on me for not making it clearer.
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Wait, where is my clever punchline?

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frostysh
frostysh


Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
WHY?
posted February 17, 2017 09:21 PM
Edited by frostysh at 21:24, 17 Feb 2017.

<imo>

1. Elitism sux. It is ineffective stuff. To become a proffesinal in some field, in generally you do not need any of "ancesty" . Even more - sometimes newcomers with a fresh views, can be much more effective that "traditional template guys". Well, anyway, if the society want to be effective in terms of culture and stuff, not fatalism in the any stuff must be.

But yes, to obtain a professional in some field, you must educate this professional from the his/her birth.

2. I was a somekind of a painter too, when I was much more younger, I like paintings like that



Well, my own snow looks like a vandalism, , anyway who need your barocco bla-bla-bla , if you have such cool modern "wall-art".
Suddenly I have no money for the cans *crying*.

Neraus said:
"Beauty is in the eye of the beholder" simply means that beauty is subjective, you like what you like, not necessarily what others like.
A beholder is one that beholds, which is another way of saying one that observes or sees.
For this reason there is a monster called beholder, since it's a disembodied eye that looks at things.
Thanx.
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Neraus
Neraus


Supreme Hero
Emperor of the Bromans
posted February 17, 2017 09:27 PM

Street art is fine by me as long as it's some kind of a modern fresco, some are really talented artists of the spray can, and the best thing is that they are sensible people that avoid ruining the walls of important buildings.
Then there are the autograph maniacs, I'd round them up and throw them in a cell.
I actually would want to punch that miscreant that vandalized Walter's statue, come on, one of the greatest heroes of Sicily gets his statue treated with what would be the worthy treatment of Garibaldi's statue?
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Wait, where is my clever punchline?

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frostysh
frostysh


Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
WHY?
posted February 17, 2017 09:35 PM

Neraus said:
Street art is fine by me as long as it's some kind of a modern fresco, some are really talented artists of the spray can, and the best thing is that they are sensible people that avoid ruining the walls of important buildings.
Then there are the autograph maniacs, I'd round them up and throw them in a cell.
I actually would want to punch that miscreant that vandalized Walter's statue, come on, one of the greatest heroes of Sicily gets his statue treated with what would be the worthy treatment of Garibaldi's statue?
Whahahha..........

. Well, as for myself I am not left ma snow on the statues (for some exceptions , but those monuments have a zero cultural weight...) or the other similar stuff, like a hospitals, cemeteries etc..
But some peoples just like to "paint" anything and everything, they jsut don't give a ... about. It is like a freedom - against the system, you know a drill .

Beside, I wonder why you so easy making a labels such as "hero" . You know, mr Neraus, the paper and peoples can told things, and this thing maybe a very different from what actually happened .
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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted February 17, 2017 09:43 PM

Here is your four-stage nightmarish horror tunnel of abstract thought, Neraus: Start from 1: 09

(Now, this is perfect example of quality popular culture for instance, it's fun and it teaches kids some basics.)
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I hope I am mistaking - frostysh

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Neraus
Neraus


Supreme Hero
Emperor of the Bromans
posted February 17, 2017 10:27 PM

Remind me to watch some new Disney, I'm legit surprised at that.
That also reminds me of an observation of the Hegelian theory of art, as he stated mankind began with pure symbolism, in which form was exaggerated and not definite and in which the concept was buried deep within this form, then as art progressed it became more concerned with the concept and less on the form, so we passed through classical art (according to Hegel the perfect form of art), renaissance art, baroque and finally on romantic art, where the basis of modern art were laid.

As Hegel, I understand, said that after Romanticism there would be no more art, as it would devolve into formless concepts.

Which, if I remember my philosophy correctly, means that he foresaw modern art in some way, which is not really that big of a surprise if we consider that there has been a constant drive on deconstructing figures in art during the last centuries.
It's funny, that scene basically describes that, first, simplified forms in colour, then bidimensional figures and lastly "primitive" shapes of colour.

Or at least that's my take on it.

Although, I'll admit, after thinking about it in these terms it makes me want to look at some modern art now...
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Wait, where is my clever punchline?

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