Heroes of Might and Magic Community
visiting hero! Register | Today's Posts | Games | Search! | FAQ/Rules | AvatarList | MemberList | Profile


Age of Heroes Headlines:  
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
6 Aug 2016: Troubled Heroes VII Expansion Release - read more
26 Apr 2016: Heroes VII XPack - Trial by Fire - Coming out in June! - read more
17 Apr 2016: Global Alternative Creatures MOD for H7 after 1.8 Patch! - read more
7 Mar 2016: Romero launches a Piano Sonata Album Kickstarter! - read more
19 Feb 2016: Heroes 5.5 RC6, Heroes VII patch 1.7 are out! - read more
13 Jan 2016: Horn of the Abyss 1.4 Available for Download! - read more
17 Dec 2015: Heroes 5.5 update, 1.6 out for H7 - read more
23 Nov 2015: H7 1.4 & 1.5 patches Released - read more
31 Oct 2015: First H7 patches are out, End of DoC development - read more
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
[X] Remove Ads
LOGIN:     Username:     Password:         [ Register ]
HOMM1: info forum | HOMM2: info forum | HOMM3: info mods forum | HOMM4: info CTG forum | HOMM5: info mods forum | MMH6: wiki forum | MMH7: wiki forum
Heroes Community > Heroes 4 - Lands of Axeoth > Thread: Convert H3 maps to H4
Thread: Convert H3 maps to H4 This thread is 3 pages long: 1 2 3 · «PREV
Baronus
Baronus


Promising
Legendary Hero
posted December 17, 2021 08:54 AM

H4 troglodite has 8 xp

h4 stats

8 x 15 = 120 AI p
H3 troglodite 59 AI p
1 h4 troglodite is more than 2 H3 troglodite. All is ok.
Ive calculated whole army not only 4 and 7 lvl units. So 5 units for H4 =7upgraded units H3.

Better calculation Ive done here:
H3 unit calculation
I can give better values than xp ai points made by my like this one.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Bytebandit
Bytebandit


Promising
Famous Hero
Soul Merchant
posted December 17, 2021 08:01 PM


I would like to thank both Nimostar and Baronus for their analytical calculations and I'm not disputing the facts you have come up with in any way. Just the opposite. Calculations have been made for our conversion project to equal what's found in H3 as allowed. Creature selection is what's limited in H4, so, because of that, it could never be equaled as to what's in H3. For instance, you may not do battle with Pit lords in the H4 Chronicles. Instead, it might be with Nightmares. And everything is taken into account within the conversion as to how to handle that. And the numbers both of you have come up with are more or less on par with what we've been doing all along throughout the conversion afaik. We'd place something to replace something, wouldn't like it or it made no sense, and have to figure out what would work instead. Conversion is not a gimme that's for sure.

And that's why we like hearing from outside sources. Keep 'em coming.
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
NimoStar
NimoStar


Honorable
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted December 18, 2021 01:35 AM
Edited by NimoStar at 16:53, 18 Dec 2021.

Well, this is for automated, not manual, conversion.


manual conversion is actually much "harder" in that it requires personal criterion.

You may have such criterion. I think I do too.
But most players and mapmakers would benefit from an automated approach.
Playing both H3 and H4 to a level where you can accurately instictively gauge the strtenght of all creatures from both games and compare them, requires at least *hundreds* if not *thousands* of hours of mapmaking and gameplay. We take such as granted because we are old players to old games, but really we shoudn't.

To say something really basic: What really visually tells the newcomer that Manticores are level 6 and Pegasi are level 4?

That's why XP/AI conversion is a useful tool.


* * *

On the other hand I think it is incorrect saying "h4 has less stuff than h3".

I don't actually think H4 has any less artifacts (not counting combination ones, that were planned and not implemented; this can be seen in the Artifact table), and it actually has more adventure objects.

The number of creatures in H3 and H4 is, not counting upgrades, quite similar. H4 towns actually have 8 creatures each, 1 more than H3 towns, and there is an abundance of (aligned) "neutrals".

Of course, if your base is H3, you are going to notice the creatures H4 lacks (such as Fortress ones, and more demons), but if you converted from H4 to H3, you would see (non-hota) H3 doesn't have Gnashers, Sorceress, Leprechaun, Satyr, Gargantuan, Waspwort, Mantis, Goblin Knight, etc. etc.
____________
https://www.moddb.com/mods/heroes-iv-ultimate/

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Baronus
Baronus


Promising
Legendary Hero
posted December 18, 2021 01:07 PM

For real proportional conversion it needs both h3 and h4 new values calculation. As you know its not the same when you fight with upg zombies or upg air elementals. Both is lvl 2. The same H4 ogres and genies both lvl 3. But these values are needed only to convert neutrals or in small part of maps hero starting armies if its more than only usually some starting units. For rmg and standard maps its only for neutrals. One neutral army can be strongest another weaknest but it was always in heroes game maps. Its interesting and give some additional characteristics for each gameplay beacuse its randomly generated. In h3 rmg you can change neutral monster power so after conversion the same will be in new H4 maps. In high lvl H4 maps neutrals are overpowered and ofen AI is dead fighing with them ) Its completly stupid. To correct.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
iliveinabox05
iliveinabox05


Responsible
Famous Hero
posted December 24, 2021 01:30 AM
Edited by iliveinabox05 at 06:26, 24 Dec 2021.

Moving right along. I've addressed the last list of things I posted that I wanted to get to.

Currently I'm looking at converting special win and loss conditions.

I'm also starting to look at mapping artifacts, so if anyone would like to help with that, feel free to post them here.

Things like: Pendant of Second Sight -> Helm of Seeing.

They both make your troops immune to the Blind spell. Just want to be as similar as possible to the effects of the H3 and H4 artifacts.

Edit. Here's a link to the conversion document: link.

Same format as the one for creatures. Feel free to comment on any you think would be a good map from H3 to H4.

Right now all but maybe one or two on the H4 side are just mapping to RANDOM.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
NimoStar
NimoStar


Honorable
Supreme Hero
Modding the Unmoddable
posted December 24, 2021 06:28 AM

Quote:
put(H3Artifact.SPELL_SCROLL.VALUE, H4Artifact.RANDOM.VALUE);


Well, I can think of one...
____________
https://www.moddb.com/mods/heroes-iv-ultimate/

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
iliveinabox05
iliveinabox05


Responsible
Famous Hero
posted January 14, 2022 08:48 PM

Added a lot of the mappings for artifacts, but I haven't updated the list I posted in here.

I've converted / transferred the majority of the most used interactive map objects. And by that I mean the objects I've actually been seeing on the Heroes Chronicles maps we have been converting, so there are still some that I haven't gone through yet.

I'm actually looking to start into landscape objects now, which is going to make passability start to become fun. I'll have to start looking into an alogrithm to map passability from the h3 maps to passability in h4 maps. So I'll also probably want to start keeping a map of the h4 grids and their passability.

This would be a major step towards an H4 RMG as well. Little by little we're getting there

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Jump To: « Prev Thread . . . Next Thread » This thread is 3 pages long: 1 2 3 · «PREV
Post New Poll    Post New Topic    Post New Reply

Page compiled in 0.0269 seconds