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| Thread: NATO? |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 · «PREV |
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JollyJoker
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posted March 09, 2023 08:25 PM |
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Salamandre said:
Russia sold 3,5 tones of gold, not 12.
You should take a bit more time for your researches.
Other wise you are completely beside the point.
If you look beyond the narratives, which you claim to do, what is left are a lot of dead and suffering people, a lot of destruction, a lot of waste of money and productive power for military expenditure and so on. And that's RUSSIA's fault and no one else's because THEY started it. It's no "just" war or some crap they have been starting, so stop trying to pretend it was.
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Salamandre
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posted March 09, 2023 08:39 PM |
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Your article is lying, HERE is the source of Minister of Finances
Please spare me the moral aspect when you have no longer factual ground.
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gatecrasher
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posted March 09, 2023 09:59 PM |
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Galaad said:
JollyJoker said:
How can anybody in their right mind think Pitin attacked Ukraine out of FEAR? That's absurd.
That's not the point. The point is, if Russia really sees NATO as a threat to them I find it unwise to not at least consider it. I believe a clever dialogue between the West and Russia could have prevented Putin's "special operation".
I don't think because this alleged threat wasn't the reason for the invasion. Swollen-faced lunatic had a lot of visitors in the end of 2021 / the beginning of 2022. He promised to keep his fingers off Ukraine yet weeks/days later....
Probably there wasn't anything which could have dissuaded him out of his plans (apart from a look into the crystal ball). Those talks were a pure farce.
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JollyJoker
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posted March 09, 2023 10:43 PM |
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Salamandre said:
Your article is lying, HERE is the source of Minister of Finances
Please spare me the moral aspect when you have no longer factual ground.
What I said. Look at the DATE.
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Salamandre
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posted March 10, 2023 01:42 AM |
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It can say whatever it wants, as long as there is no source given.
Anyway, your claim is that Russia sold 12 tons of gold, therefore Russia is in trouble. Russia has around 2300 gold tons. Peanuts.
Bad diagnostics lead to bad decisions. If Putin has multiple terminal cancers or is a fool, if Russia is economically in trouble, if Russia lost 200k military, then there is no reason to back down, Russia is almost done so NATO should double efforts for a quick defeat, right?
But if none of those is true and Russia can without any problem sustain a several years war, if Putin is in excellent health and casualties are minimal, we are going into a very dangerous position by fueling the war, as Ukrainian forces are exhausted and on the other side NATO will never concede defeat with their big mouth, so what next, troops invading Russia? I did not yet buy an anti-atomic bunker, did you?
What we should consider is push where Russia is really sensible, which means China and India. Make deals and secret negotiations with, instead of stupidly and constantly insulting about how autocrat and dictatorial they are and threatening if any weapon trade with Russia, which we btw massively put in place with Ukraine. If Russia sees any risk of losing support from its allies, that could undermine their determination.
Then the US should say to Zelensky "shut up and take notes".
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JollyJoker
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posted March 10, 2023 07:51 AM |
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No, not right, and disagreed. Why? Because we are completely in the dark about what is actually going on. About what were the Russian goals, what were their expectations.
I think, it is safe to say: NOT THIS, because had they known what would happen they would have delayed and prepared better.
They didn't, though, and whatever their goals were and still are, how many gold they still have, they are in a bad situation because their options are limited and they depend on support of China, India, and others.
On the other hand Russia must not "lose" the war they started themselves. Unthinkable for them. For a couple of reasons, actually. So the West MUST NOT force anything because that may lead to desaster.
On the other hand, Russia shouldn't "win" either, simply because we have no idea what the actual goals of them really are an whether they are limited to Ukraine or not.
So we have a dilemma here, and one of the reasons is the inability to put ourselves in the Russian position, because no matter which way this is looked at it's difficult to find a perspective that makes this step - outright war against Ukraine - understandable. And the fact that this war is still on and Rusiia didn't make any progress so far shows that the Russians themselves seem to have miscalculated something.
So this goes on.
But that's actually not what you were talking about.
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Drakon-Deus
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CONTINUITY IS POWER
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posted March 24, 2023 01:59 PM |
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24 years ago NATO started the bombings of Yugoslavia.
I don't know if there's a "good" side and a "bad" one, but I don't want to be on the nato side.
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Ghost
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posted April 03, 2023 06:22 PM |
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You talked snow something.. Tomorrow we are NATO member.. 
Congrat NATOs
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Drakon-Deus
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CONTINUITY IS POWER
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posted April 03, 2023 06:26 PM |
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Ghost said:
You talked snow something.. Tomorrow we are NATO member..
Congrat NATOs
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Ghost
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Therefore I am
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posted April 03, 2023 06:49 PM |
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Drakon-Deus said:
Ghost said:
You talked snow something.. Tomorrow we are NATO member..
Congrat NATOs
Why?
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Drakon-Deus
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CONTINUITY IS POWER
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posted April 03, 2023 06:54 PM |
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I dislike nato.
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