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Heroes Community > Heroes 4 - Lands of Axeoth > Thread: heroes IV vs heroes 3
Thread: heroes IV vs heroes 3
jacktrades
jacktrades


Hired Hero
posted March 25, 2003 10:58 PM bonus applied.
Edited By: Lich_King on 29 Mar 2003

heroes IV vs heroes 3

I've posted this file this site to see what the HOMM fans have to say about it's content

to 3DO and HOMM fans
Hi,


-please excuse my bad english,it's not my first language.
I would like to thank you guys for the extraordinary games like HOMM2 & HOMM3,and also for not so good(in my opinion)compared to those 2,HOMM4.
Heroes 3 is the only game that i've been playing for almost 2 years and i still love it.I've played HOMM2 for again,about 1.5 years because my pc was not good enough for H3 and it gived lots of fatal errors (blue screens).
As for Heroes 4,i like it,but i don't love it,and i'm bored already of it.
Don't get me wrong,i think it's a great game,just that is not like heroes i had known,game that made me fall in love with it.-don't get me wrong now...
In my opinion,this game doesn't deserve the name of HEROES,coz is simply not Heroes.
Just think,was any of the other heroes parts so controversed ?I Think not .
What i don't like :

A) Things that are not really so bad...just different :

-fog of war (it's not a RTS)
-heroes die in fights
-no upgrades
-lack of resources-_on H3 i didn't know where to go first,and here i could stay relaxed in the castle,coz i don't have where to go,or what to go for.(little resources,just a few mines,a few castles-the maps are poor,and besides the good looking of the decors,there are only a few (big,to big) resources,like boxes,money...
-where is the capitol ?H 3 solved the money problem of H 2,and H 4 has less money to give than
H 2 ?
-changes to the role of some buildings,removing other important (like the resource silo),it's not good,giving this role to the heroes skills(mining for example).
-having the creatures crawling down the map is something that i don't like,even if it is a custom aspect
-compared to h3,the hero doesn't have many points to move,at least at the begining,and anyway he can't go further because of the missplaced creatures.There is almost nothing that is not defended by some stinky creature,that is hard to beat in the first weeks,relativly,but in most cases.

B) Things that really bother me :

-castle fights are poor(one door,no towers)
-getting the buttons out of the 800x600 screen is not fair
-lack of buttons(in H3 at 800x600,there were all the buttons,big enough,and not like "half" screen button or picture of a hero in H 4
-little numbers-big pictures of heroes/resources etc.
-no barinfo and no infocreatures like in H3 battles,which are more interesting
-no DIRECT3D or OPENGL support,from where the "choppines"
-lots of crashes on many PC's
-game runs choppy even with tripled hardware specifications than recommended
(i dont like to wait 2-3 minutes or more during the end turn,or to look at the cursor sitting there doing nothing for 4-5 seconds in some battles.)


The rest,like classes,new magic system,music,sounds,etc. is very good,i think,even revolutionary in HOMM series,that's why many people,including me,had problems in accepting the game as it is

I respect the ideas you (3DO) came out with,the new stuff that this game has,but i just don't have the attraction,the emotions that Heroes 2 or 3 gived me,and i've never dreamed with H_IV,while the H3
gived my many agitated nights,as a sign of it's obssesive gameplay.
I try to play,but in 1 hour i get bored.Something's wrong.And it's not just me...I have obssesed friend of H 3 that hate H 4.
-maybe i would playmore and i would like it much if there were not so many crashes,long waitings and lockups that make 4-5 months in the game played for nothing,coz i can't go further,due to the problem repeting.
I'm not saying that i don't like it because it's new and different,it's not that...i think is good enough,in it's new way...
For example,playing Heroes 3 never get me bored ,because there was always something new on the way,an artifact :i gotta get it !,a dragon utopy left to fight,knowing that what i might find there could have a significant role in the course of the game.
Playing heroes 3 was like having a hope all the time,and you know how important having a hope is.
I always wanted to make the hero more and more powerfull,to get more artifacts,more experience,thing that played a big part in the game,leading me to victory.
And the AI of H3 is good enough to give me a hard time(ok ,only with more opponents)
In H4,there are no artifacts that could have an impact like in H 3,relativly,the hero/heroes,no matter how strong they are,if the enemy came with 20 dragons they are all dead and burried.
The thing is that there in nothing in the course of the game,that will make me want to go on,and do that thing.
I like it ,i play it,but is not what i expected,and i don't play it with enthuziasm,at least for now,coz i've been playing HOMMM_4 just for a little time.
I'm not saying that i don't agree with it,i like it,but in other way that is different from how i liked heroes 3.It has no power of atraction like heroes 3 had for me.
It's different from heroes 3,it's another kind of game,and is cool.It's like i'm playing something else,which is fine but is not heroes,so i'm waiting for the real heroes,that could be V.

For heroes V,here are some sugestions:

C) Necessary,i think :

-d3d,opengl support
-interface,animations,smaller,h3 like,regardless of resolution
-if more resolutions,keep all butons in place,don't get them out.Think at the RTS games like warcraft 3-if i change the resolution to 640x480,are the buttons going somewhere ?
-the battle is fine,but it could be added some info panels like i said before
-o,yes,before i forget,more options regarding everything,like the image quality,rendering options,color depth,and more,to give us a chance to make it playable on more pc's,not choppy,taking it as it is.
-about the campaigns of H_IV ,there are good,more than good,the story is cool,but the campaigns are just campaigns,we finish them and we remain with maps and multiplayer,and that's were the real artwork should be used in H_V.
-the high complexity of H_IV should not be forgotten in the making of H_V.

D) not quite necessary,but worth considering :

-don't make the game to allow looking from different perspective-it's hard to realize and it will take more time and is not so important
-bring back more elements from H2 and H3-from the gameplay(i don't want another H3,so don't get me wrong)
-RETURN OF THE UPGRADES (you know what i mean)
-you could keep in a way the classes,but changing a few aspects will be more fun
-the four skills in H_3,attack,defense,power and knowledge,and their purpose,is much more fine,i think,and these could be kept,the other classes being added as something in plus,secondary skills,and even named different,like abillities,or native skills,who knows...( a hero could be a ranger,have Attack 30,defense 23,power 52,knowledge 25,and he could also be grandmaster in scouting with expert combat)I'm just giving an example,i'm not saying that 3DO should do that,after all you are the experts that created Heroes 3 and other HOMM games,not me.

-anyway,i'm sure you know exactly what to change and what to add,and i know that after this Heroes IV,which was a some sord of test or atleast became that,Heroes V will be more played and loved than Heroes 3(game that is a reference in TBS genre) or IV ...
-i hope you release a FINAL,not like the heroes IV,a game that had no multilayer,and was folowed by a lot of patches,being full of bugs.-cool it will be if you release a  demo,beta,or something,to receive info on how it should be or what is wrong/good.
-it wont be good if after the release of Heroes V,you will start imediatly work on Part VI,coz heroes V wont be liked by many gamers.
So,H_IV was a turn,not so good,but that was a good thing,i hope,and it will make you know exactly what we,gamers,like or dislike,love or hate.
That's just a few things i wanted to say,and i don't want to bore you with more.
If i think of something important,i'l let you know.


I'm waiting for HEROES V with my fingers crossed
Please make me and all HOMM fans fall in love again...

GOOD LUCK !!!


(jacktraddes@personal.ro) 10.03.2003


25.03.2003

After playing for two weeks HEROES IV, i think now that is a great game,and the only things i
sustain now from those above are B & C,others being so and so.
Me staying till 4-5 AM playing this game...after all i said ...must be something of it...
For those who don't like Heroes IV,a little advice : give it a chance,play it some more...
You will change your mind...
Jack

Edit by Lich: +Qp applied for a post of the Month.
Good job !

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The Undead Hero

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Odvin
Odvin


Promising
Famous Hero
posted March 25, 2003 11:14 PM

Sorry if I misunderstood you, but at the end you write that only points B & C (some minor technical troubles and suggestions for the future version) are left in your mind, so WHY posting point A?!?
In general I must agree on some points. H4 took me in for quite a few days (nights ), then I left it... H4 is a good game, but IMHO, there's lack of one important component which was present in all the previous Heroes parts: it's the addictivity of the game (that is, amount of hours you spend on the game daily ). This is not the only thing, of course. Homm4 was incredibly unpopular compared to other parts (I mean by the sales), and that's a sign for NWC that they made a mistake by adding those revolutionary new features. These features may not be bad, LOTS of people really enjoy it, but still, HoMM4 isn't as addictive as HoMM3. In past several weeks I don't play it at all, BTW... But that's my point.
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jacktrades
jacktrades


Hired Hero
posted March 25, 2003 11:26 PM
Edited By: jacktrades on 26 Mar 2003


i left point A because i wanted you to see what i thought first,before i played more...
thanks for your opinion
we'l just have to wait for heroes V,don't we ?


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The Undead Hero

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gamebro
gamebro

Tavern Dweller
posted March 27, 2003 08:48 AM

Heroes 4 vs 3? wow!...

Heroes 3 was the BEST HEROES game IMO. But heroes 4 is still great stuff!

You are right that it was not what we grew up and fell in love with!!! But I am addicted to the RPG elements of building up heroes! Soo cool that a heroe can become more powerfull than a black dragon!

I really miss heroes 2.. I like the graphics style the best in that heroes. Why? don't ask!
It was simple, clean fun!  It is a shame there is no server site that hosts mulitplayer rooms for that game.

Heroes 3 had great music, great creatures, great artifacts, cool heroes like drakon, and many many goodunique castles types that were all pretty well balanced!

I have spent many an hour playing hotseat with my friends in H2 and H3. And we all like H3 the best.

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jacktrades
jacktrades


Hired Hero
posted March 29, 2003 06:31 PM

Quote:
Heroes 3 was the BEST HEROES....

Yeah,you're right.It WAS the best.Now Heroes IV is the ruler,despite all it's been said about it.
Thanks for your reply.
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The Undead Hero

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Diorj
Diorj

Tavern Dweller
Wisdom shine your light on me
posted April 11, 2003 10:25 PM

Having just got the game, I understand what you are saying.  I installed it, patched it, so the sound worked(thanks to folks here on the boards for the help), then began.  IT took me a little while to get used to things, and then I could start playing.  The thing that seperates it form HOMM3 was that after two hours, I stopped, saved my game and played a different game.  It just didn't grab me.  The night before I played HOMM3 until 1 in the morning until my wife "reminded me" I had to work in the morning.  It seems to be the little things.
  The interface was muttled with colors and designs and much harder to navigate.  The same interface took up way too much screen, even in 1028 mode.  The heroes and creatures were way too small and undistinguishable on the map also.  Theese (other than the adventure map being too small)are pretty insignificant, but they take away from the general lure that HOMM 3 had.
  It doesn't seem like a bad game in any respect, and it seems I'll have fun playing it. I just hope that HOMM 5 has that same "it" that HOMM 3 had.  
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"The world is full of kings and queens who blind your eyes and steal your dreams. It's Heaven and Hell"

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SHADOWXIII
SHADOWXIII

Tavern Dweller
posted April 11, 2003 11:40 PM

IMO Heroes 4 isn't bad ... I like idea of fighting heroes (make a bit RPG game), but there are not enough towns/spells/creatures, and it's performance is really bad ... and expansions have nearly nothing new ... usually plenty of maps, only a few units, but I'm playing H4 instead of H3, I like to have heroes at 20th levels, etc.
I think if H5 will have performance of H3, heroes feature from H4, graphic better than H4, and diverse from H3 it will be the best, anyway my vote for H4/H3 is ... :/ ... H 3,5 ... I can't say which I really like more ...


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Vortigern
Vortigern


Hired Hero
posted April 12, 2003 02:42 AM

I understand what Jacktraddes is saying, and I agree with just about everything he's outlined. I've come up with a solution to the problem some of you players may have with the game. If you think it's too easy (even at Champion, which sometimes seems to hurt the computer more than it does you) then try playing maps with advanced or expert difficulty at Champion. That is what I have tried in the past few days. I'm glad I did because I found I was motivated to play the game with everything I had. The higher difficulty map gave me a rude awakening because on maps (like Jester's revenge, a new map from one of those patches)sometimes the computer blitzes you with an uber army and catches you right after a huge battle or out of your safe and pristine castle. This drove me to play better to beat the computer, and to be a little more careful about leaving too much ground unseen around my town. I'm pretty sure you'll know what I mean when (or if) you play this map. Just to give you an idea of how well I can play: I made a score of 1108 from the map I was just talking about, Jester's Revenge, and I reached the rank of Black Dragon! My jaw dropped when I saw the screen flash to the score screen, and I jubilantly typed my name beside the portrait of the Black Dragon. Has anyone else made that kinda score?
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nasty
nasty


Known Hero
castor nebun si orb pe cinste
posted April 18, 2003 02:05 AM

Indeed heroes 3 was the greatest of heroes but heroes 4 it's a new thing we should accept it as a first try....i bet heroes 5 will impress us.
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You can trick me with food.Possesions mean nothing to a navajo.

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SHADOWXIII
SHADOWXIII

Tavern Dweller
posted April 18, 2003 08:59 AM

I think makers will back to hereos3 in heroes 5 (((
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grunancross
grunancross


Famous Hero
King of the Underdark
posted April 18, 2003 09:06 AM

I think that homm 3.5 should be made into a box game and labeled homm5 they can adjust this game a bit and thas a good game way better than homm4 that game just feels like it was missing something how can they have some much then take it out in homm4? homm3 is the current best game this site proves it! to think other wise in not a fact but your op. i think that homm3.5(tuned up i bit) boxed up shipped out is money in the bank...that would be cool no crazy insane d/l just homm....
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jacktrades
jacktrades


Hired Hero
posted April 19, 2003 01:37 AM

Quote:
homm 3.5 should be made into a box game and labeled homm5

I agree 3,5 was very good,but...is not more than 3 with custom stuff in it !
I loved it ,but now I play only H IV.
I had enough of H 3.Thanks for the replys/to all of you guys.
Heroes 3 or IV ,who cares ? ;>> Is HOMM ,THAT IS IMPORTANT !AND WE ALL LOVE HOMM GAMES ;>>>>>>>>

bye bye
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The Undead Hero

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