| Artifact question |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · NEXT» |
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Zaloy
Tavern Dweller
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posted December 29, 2001 07:33 PM |
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Edited By: Hexa on 28 Jan 2002
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Artifact question
Say you get an artifact that increases archery skill, but you dont even have that skill...does it do anything?
Edit: revived!@
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Coldfyrius
Promising
Famous Hero
Vice-God for Marketing
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posted December 30, 2001 04:01 AM |
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No. Artifacts which boost secondary skills boost them as a percentage of the existing skill, not as a percentage of 100. Same with things like Vidomina's specialty. For example, if you have Expert Necromancy (30%) and you pick up the Vampire's Cowl (+10%), your new Necro percentage is 30+(30*10%), or 33%, not 40%.
So if you picked up a Bowstring of the Unicorn's Mane (+5% to Archery), and you lack the Archery skill (0%), your new aArchery skill is 0+(0*5%), or still 0.
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"All the punks are gonna scream, 'yippee!'/ 'Cuz it's the thing that only eats hippies."
-The Dead Milkmen
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The_Gootch
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Kneel Before Me Sons of HC!!
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posted January 04, 2002 06:11 PM |
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I don't know about that one Coldfyrious. Are you sure?
If so, then why is boots of polarity considered a relic? Because it boosts your heroes expert resistance from 20% to 23% or to 35%? There should be a way to figure something like that one out. I'm not disputing your formulae for heroes' specialties, but as for artifacts boosting a skill I think it goes the other way.
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Tristan
Promising
Known Hero
illegally insane
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posted January 04, 2002 06:57 PM |
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I think that is because they increase magic resistance, not the skill, the archery artifacts increase your archery skill.
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If you learn so much by losing, why am I so dumb?
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The_Gootch
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Kneel Before Me Sons of HC!!
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posted January 04, 2002 07:39 PM |
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I don't think I made myself clear Tristan. That the bow increases archery isn't disputed. My argument is about the multiple that is applied. Okay, you know that a skill specialty hero adds a 5% per level bonus to the appropriate skill. We like to use level 20 for one of those heroes because 1, that is a level that is certainly attainable for a hero in a game. 2, that hero's particular specialty is going to be expert. And 3, the skill is just doubled. With me so far? If not, take Crag Hack and his spec offense. Expert offense gives your creatures a bonus of 30% in hand-to-hand situations. Level 20 Crag Hack gives a 60% bonus to his creatures' hand-to-hand damage. Why? 5% bonus per level times 20 levels equals 100% or double the skill. Now with skill increasing artifacts there is still(at least on my part) some debate. If you have expert archery your ranged do an additional 50% on their attacks. Hair of the unicorn's mane gives an additional 10% to your archery. I say it adds a flat 10%, which would make your ranged do an additional 60%. Coldfyrious says that with the artifact the same hero would do 55%(10% of 50 is 5). Which of us is right? Does someone know? By the way, I agree with him that a hero needs a skill to be able to apply a particular artifact's bonus to it.
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jex
Known Hero
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posted January 05, 2002 12:46 AM |
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ack!
Gootch, use the enter key plz. That is a horrible mess you made there.
Um well skill artifacts......I have never bothered to test the archery/eagle eye artifacts to see if they boost your damange when you dont have archery/eagle eye.........the best one is 15% thats worthless, considering expert archery gives 50%. Also eagle eye is fairly lame.
But I do know that the boots of Polarity will resist spells for you when you dont have resistance. I have seen them do that lots, very helpful. 
Personally I think if the red boots give you resistance when dont have resistance as a skill, then by the same logic the archery artifacts should do the same. The Nerco artifacts are prolly a special case.
To find out for sure a person would prolly haveta pull out a calculator and make a test map....too much work for an additional 5-30% with your archers for me 
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zsa
Famous Hero
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posted January 05, 2002 08:08 AM |
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Quote:
But I do know that the boots of Polarity will resist spells for you when you dont have resistance. I have seen them do that lots, very helpful.
Yep Jex, I tried it like 3 times (6 months or so ago) and the resistance artefacts work even without the skill. As for the others I can tell u that eagle eye and necromancy artefacts DO need the skill for them to do something.
As for archery I cannot say precisely; as I remember they do not help if u don't have the skill (I tested that out too but a while back too and I don't remember exactly).
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StormWarning
Promising
Famous Hero
Archmage of Thunder
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posted January 05, 2002 08:19 PM |
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With the Bow and the like, I'm not certain. I think it increases the skill, but one of my friends said that it increases the damage of range creatures regardless of whether you have the skill or not (it treats it as base 100% with no archery, 110 with basic, 125 with advanced, and 150 with expert, so all three with expert would give 30% of 150% for a total of 195%). I'm not sure which is right.
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The calm before the storm is about to end.
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Nebuka
Promising
Supreme Hero
Save me Jebus!
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posted January 07, 2002 02:51 AM |
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Archery artifacts doesn`t help hero who`s without archery skill...Useless if you don`t have all three.
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thunderknight
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted January 07, 2002 05:57 AM |
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My guess, too lazy to test
Well, my guess:
Archery artifacts: need archery skill (even the combo
"Bow of Sharpshooter" will only give you no range and obstacle penalty + projectile shoot but cannot boost your
archery damage.
Resistance artifacts: can increase creature resistance even you don't have resistance skill.
Necro artifact: need necro skill. But combo "Cloak of Undead
King" is an exception, you can get 30% of the dead enemy troops as skele even you don't have necro skill.
Anyway, just too lazy to check them out.
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Choose what you love
and love what you choose.
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Batvanio
Adventuring Hero
Archimage
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posted January 09, 2002 10:32 AM |
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xxx$xx
I have tested these artifacts a long time ago.
Here are the results:
When it is written in the artifact help: X% over XXX Skill
then this means:
1. You must have the skill to use
2. The compute is (the skill %)*(X%artifact boost)=new% of skill boost
On the magic resistance artifacts it is written:
Boost the "magic resistance" not the "magic resistance skill". So they act independently boosting the skill even if you dont have it and on base 100.
Exceptions: with the combined artifacts.
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...and give my best regards to your family
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Tristan
Promising
Known Hero
illegally insane
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posted January 09, 2002 06:12 PM |
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Thank you Batvanio for saying clearly what I was trying to say in the first place. <bows>
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If you learn so much by losing, why am I so dumb?
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Sorcerorkyle
Hired Hero
Sauron
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posted January 09, 2002 07:09 PM |
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oh yeah, real frickin clear!
what the hell was all that SH*T!
5 times 10 to the fifth square root of 5 times pie = absolutely nothing
yep cleared it all up, about as clear as a blizzard!
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those who appose me will be shot, willies be beaten.
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Fantusta
Known Hero
who wishes he was high
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posted January 11, 2002 01:10 AM |
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Instead of complaining about not getting it, how bout saying what you don't get and maybe someone could help you. I understand it fine, and I was actually wondering about the same thing. Thanks, people-who-posted-the-solution!
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You're unique, just like everyone else. I'm just better.
I'm challenging preconcieved notions you haven't even thought up yet!
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ToWeRH3
Hired Hero
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posted May 02, 2021 04:11 PM |
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Can I get 'tome of air magic' 'tome of earth magic' or 'spellbinder's hat' from random 'art4' placed on the map (I'm asking about Shadows, not Horn)?
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heymlich
Famous Hero
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posted May 02, 2021 08:15 PM |
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ToWeRH3
Hired Hero
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posted May 03, 2021 11:49 AM |
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What is the probability of getting these artifacts from 'art4'? Is the chance to get the same for all relics, or are some more frequent and some less?
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phoenix4ever
Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
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posted May 03, 2021 12:51 PM |
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Exactly the same chance. If 24 relics are allowed, the chance is 1 out of 24.
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heymlich
Famous Hero
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posted May 03, 2021 05:25 PM |
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Edited by heymlich at 17:26, 03 May 2021.
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However, the RNG is somewhat broken, it tends to run into a loop. If you try to restart with the same settings until your favourite artifact appears it may actually never happen, no matter how many attempts you make, giving you the impression that some artifacts cannot spawn randomly. The way he is asking sounds like he tried exactly this. 
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Phoenix4ever
Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
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posted May 03, 2021 05:33 PM |
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Could be.
Yeah the RNG is not always so random, rather it seems to be stuck in certain cycles sometimes. It also happens with Refugee Camps for example.
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