|
|
DagothGares
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
No gods or kings
|
posted December 15, 2009 09:57 PM |
|
|
Have I ever used the word reincaranation and what would you know of life being an ordeal and what would God know? It's hard enough as it is, life, ask most psychologists about how hard birth is to deal with, your single most traumatic moment of your life.
I mean, how can it honestly be a reward to dwell here again with good people and, no, it won't be what you believe to be good people, it will be a rather arbitrary list of what defines good people. Who wants to be chained down to this existence? How come it's inescapable, except by not living virtuous (which has nothing to do with being good or bad FYI). I can think of a few dead people who I'd prefer not to have been given life again and of whom I can safely say they also would not want that as well, though this is speculation and kind of horrible to say, especially to people (like you) who hold life to be this really special and awesome thing and in a way it is, but it's good for a run and it's good for perhaps a few more runs, if you have a clean slate every time and a loss of memory. Though, again, it must be quite atrocious to remember it ALL after you died.
Obviously, I didn't really expect much of an answer from you. That would've been too much to hope for. I don't know what i wanted. I guess it was understanding. Pleasure to have been talking to you elodin and, see? Dagoth is always right, I knew there was a resurrection 
Which comes from the latin word resurgere (perfectum: resurrexi) which means "to stand up again".
Also, elodin, I'm seventeen and more well-read than you, for shame!
____________
If you have any more questions, go to Dagoth Cares.
|
|
TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 01:37 AM |
|
|
Can we please drop the Christianity issue? Elodin is right on one thing, it's the Bible who defines it, just like a technical specification defines terms used in a standard or protocol. If that was not the case standards would be impossible -- and really it would change nothing because it's just a freaking definition, not the VALUE that it represents but just the NAME.
It's like arguing whether to call food 'food' or 'doof' -- if you disagree with the formal specification of 'food' it isn't helping anyone and is NOT changing anything, it's not changing the hamburger from being a hamburger and something you eat, even though it would be called 'doof'.
Can we FINALLY DROP this issue? k thx bai
____________
The above post is subject to SIRIOUSness.
No jokes were harmed during the making of this signature.
|
|
DagothGares
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
No gods or kings
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 01:38 AM |
|
|
NO TRUE SCOTSMAN ARGUMENT FALLACY
____________
If you have any more questions, go to Dagoth Cares.
|
|
TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 01:45 AM |
|
Edited by TheDeath at 01:45, 16 Dec 2009.
|
It's a matter of adhering to the specifications. It's a definition that embodies certain characteristics, nothing more, nothing less.
A "true" web browser adheres to the web standard specifications exactly, that is not a true scotsman fallacy.
The true scotsman doesn't work here because the scotsman definition does NOT specify what you mean. If the definition of scotsman was defined (in a specification with the authority, usually it's the one who makes it, like the Bible in this case) as "no one that watches TV", then you COULD say that no true scotsman would watch TV, because that's what scotsman would mean -- not very helpful though.
But by that definition then scotsman wouldn't mean a "man with scottish nationality" anymore, obviously!
And I don't see WHY Elodin makes such a fuss over it, as if being a "Christian" means much if not for the characteristics it embodies -- you might as well enumerate them, same thing, except that it would be longer to type.
EDIT: Look at this example:
A true scotsman does not have french nationality.
____________
The above post is subject to SIRIOUSness.
No jokes were harmed during the making of this signature.
|
|
DagothGares
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
No gods or kings
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 01:57 AM |
|
|
Listen I didn't even talk about what a christian is, so...
Yeah...
Maybe this says more about you than it does about me
____________
If you have any more questions, go to Dagoth Cares.
|
|
TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 02:00 AM |
|
|
My rant was mostly addressed to Elodin's last post 
____________
The above post is subject to SIRIOUSness.
No jokes were harmed during the making of this signature.
|
|
DagothGares
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
No gods or kings
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 02:04 AM |
|
|
Okay, sorry (I apologise), it's these talks with elodin, since he didn't address the points I myself was really proud of, so I got all defensive, you know?
It's probably the osm getting in my brain. We need some more humour in here...
I'll be back with a good post, soon.
Though, I'm sure elodin won't appreciate it. He needs to lighten up about his religion, you know?
____________
If you have any more questions, go to Dagoth Cares.
|
|
TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 02:06 AM |
|
|
Yeah no probs, btw I think your posts were a really good read, if it helps.
____________
The above post is subject to SIRIOUSness.
No jokes were harmed during the making of this signature.
|
|
DagothGares
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
No gods or kings
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 03:06 AM |
|
|
|
Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 03:36 AM |
|
|
@Death
Quote:
Elodin is right on one thing, it's the Bible who defines it, just like a technical specification defines terms used in a standard or protocol.
From a strict "Philosophy of Language" point of view, I have to disagree. Anyone is free to define a word however they wish, of course, but defining a word in such a way that nobody agrees with you precludes any sort of mutual understanding or enlightenment.
____________
I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg
|
|
Elodin
Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 08:29 AM |
|
Edited by Elodin at 08:30, 16 Dec 2009.
|
Quote:
Have I ever used the word reincaranation and what would you know of life being an ordeal and what would God know? It's hard enough as it is, life, ask most psychologists about how hard birth is to deal with, your single most traumatic moment of your life.
No, you did not use the term "reincarnation" but you said "Hey, elodin, why is it considered a reward to have to go through this ordeal called life again?" That sounds like reincarnation to me. Perhaps that is not what you intended.
God would know about ordeals because he knows the suffering everyone goes through. He also suffered quite a bit when he walked the earth as Jesus Christ.
I'm sorry if you find life to be hard. I don't. I've had my share of problems but I find life enjoyable. And certainly eternity with God will be enjoyable.
Oh, I don't buy into everyone being traumatized for life because of the birth experience.
About the pictures. I prefer this video montage and song as a portrait of Christ.
Behold the man who is God.
Quote:
From a strict "Philosophy of Language" point of view, I have to disagree. Anyone is free to define a word however they wish, of course, but defining a word in such a way that nobody agrees with you precludes any sort of mutual understanding or enlightenment.
Of course anyone could just make up their own definitions but that is not what we were talking about.
The New Testament writings are the sacred writings that tell what a Christian is. It would be ludicrous to say a Christian is a person who worships Adolph Hitler. Sure, you could say it, but such a statement would have no validity at all.
|
|
DagothGares
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
No gods or kings
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 11:35 AM |
|
|
Awww, elodin you don't play by the rules
Oh, well, then we can't talk about Jesus' image. Maybe we can, but I'm disappointed.
____________
If you have any more questions, go to Dagoth Cares.
|
|
angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 12:09 PM |
|
|
But I am sure there have been millions of people all over the world who fitted pretty well in the bible definition of what a Christian is, until they "turned to the other side". Like priests who molested childs, like priests who killed their wifes, like popes who didn't do anything against mass murder, etc...
And this is Elodin's trick (and the bible's of course). As long as you follow the bible's rules, you can call yourself a Christian. When you break them, you are no Christian (and probably have never been )
So if a Scotsman changes citizenship, let's say to a french, he is no Scotsman anymore...but has he ever been? Maybe he ALWAYS wanted to be french his entire life and just wanted to wait until the right moment came? He had it in his genes! No real Scotsman would ever change to a french citizemship.....
____________
Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
|
|
Clay_Man
Known Hero
TOH gamer
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 01:05 PM |
|
Edited by Clay_Man at 13:05, 16 Dec 2009.
|
Quote:
As long as you follow the bible's rules, you can call yourself a Christian. When you break them, you are no Christian (and probably have never been )
Which is, of course, pure nonsense.
|
|
Elodin
Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 04:40 PM |
|
|
Quote:
And this is Elodin's trick (and the bible's of course). As long as you follow the bible's rules, you can call yourself a Christian. When you break them, you are no Christian (and probably have never been )
The New Testament defining who a Christian is is not a trick. What is a trick is atheists lying about who is a Christian in order to slur Christianity. Some (I did not say all or most) atheists looooove to lie about religion.
The New Testament clearly says anyone who hates or murders does not know God.
|
|
bixie
Promising
Legendary Hero
my common sense is tingling!
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 04:55 PM |
|
|
Quote:
What is a trick is atheists lying about who is a Christian in order to slur Christianity. [...] atheists looooove to lie about religion.
The New Testament clearly says anyone who hates or murders does not know God
even if god told them to hate and to murder?
____________
Love, Laugh, Learn, Live.
|
|
angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 05:45 PM |
|
|
Quote:
The New Testament defining who a Christian is is not a trick. What is a trick is atheists lying about who is a Christian in order to slur Christianity. Some (I did not say all or most) atheists looooove to lie about religion.
The New Testament clearly says anyone who hates or murders does not know God.
As usual, you avoided to answer to the main point of the post, but instead repeated your "bible defines..." sentences for the hundred time. But maybe real christians have to be that way....
____________
Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
|
|
DagothGares
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
No gods or kings
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 05:48 PM |
|
|
There is no such thing as a real christian.
____________
If you have any more questions, go to Dagoth Cares.
|
|
Elodin
Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 06:24 PM |
|
|
Quote:
Quote:
What is a trick is atheists lying about who is a Christian in order to slur Christianity. [...] atheists looooove to lie about religion.
The New Testament clearly says anyone who hates or murders does not know God
even if god told them to hate and to murder?
Sorry, the New Testament says God says to love everyone and not to murder. Perhaps you are thinking of a differnt religion.
Quote:
Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
Quote:
Mat 19:18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
Mat 19:19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Quote:
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The New Testament defining who a Christian is is not a trick. What is a trick is atheists lying about who is a Christian in order to slur Christianity. Some (I did not say all or most) atheists looooove to lie about religion.
The New Testament clearly says anyone who hates or murders does not know God.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
As usual, you avoided to answer to the main point of the post, but instead repeated your "bible defines..." sentences for the hundred time. But maybe real christians have to be that way....
I thought the main point of post was the ludicrous claim that the Bible and Christians lie about who is a Christian and who is not.
I've never claimed Christians are perfect because we are not. But the Bible says that no Christian will murder or hate others.
Jesus also warned of wolves in sheeps clothing who would pretend to be Christinas to prey on the flock as I have stated before.
Quote:
Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
Mat 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
|
|
bixie
Promising
Legendary Hero
my common sense is tingling!
|
|
posted December 16, 2009 06:51 PM |
|
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
What is a trick is atheists lying about who is a Christian in order to slur Christianity. [...] atheists looooove to lie about religion.
The New Testament clearly says anyone who hates or murders does not know God
even if god told them to hate and to murder?
Sorry, the New Testament says God says to love everyone and not to murder. Perhaps you are thinking of a differnt religion.
i find that statement offensive on so many levels, and you have just made me never want to become a christian ever again...
this is what I can't get, a normal person who decides that he sees images in things, he's called insane and locked up in an asylum. but when a christian sees jesus in a F**king door, or a preacher claims he has a direct link to god, then no-matter what they say, they're loved and routinely given money.
That is absolutely Bogus!
This is why I hate christianity, because of my experience i have met 4 kinds of christians. Nice, relaxed people, Boring churchgoers, these Evangelical nut jobs and people like You Elodin! the nice lot are fine, and are great to have a conversation with. they are normal and nice and wear jumpers and eat cheddar like normal people. but they are outweighed by boring church goers, who are so fussy and stuffy they think their still standing on service for the queen! then you have the bloody evangelicals, PRAISE JESUS! No, lets not, you delusional conman, stop taking peoples money! only in america could you get that kind of idiocy!!!!
and finally there are people like you, Elodin, Whom I shall refer to as Religion-trolls. argument circling, quoting the bible at you, claiming that everyones against you even if the worlds biggest religion is christianity! I'M SICK AND TIRED OF IT!!!!!!!! you people make me want to cave in my dogs skull with a golf-club!!!!!! you're the kind of people who ruin the name of your own religion! why do the "Meanie Dawkinites" say such lies about your religion, YOU GIVE THEM MATERIAL TO THROW AT YOU!!!!!! CAN'T YOU SEE IT, ELODIN, YOU'RE HURTING THE CAUSE THAT YOU SUPPORT BY JUST OPENING YOUR STUPID TRAP!!!!!!!CAN'T YOU SEE IT!!!!!!
____________
Love, Laugh, Learn, Live.
|
| |
|
|
This thread is pages long: 
