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Heroes Community > Heroes 4 - Lands of Axeoth > Thread: There must be no poor looking units in HMM4
Thread: There must be no poor looking units in HMM4 This thread is 2 pages long: 1 2 · NEXT»
chAosKid
chAosKid

Tavern Dweller
posted August 25, 2001 03:35 PM

Poll Question:
There must be no poor looking units in HMM4

Please allow only soldiers in the army and the poor units must go away !!  

---   The Peasants must be out of Haven (according to the demo they are No1 level with the archers) . They make the whole army look miserable. I suggest that the pikeman must be level1 as elite unit (more life and damage but less weekly growth), and please let the peasants work on the plains for food or make them neutral. The reason I don't like the Knight town in HMM2 were that they have peasants. The peasants are like fresh meat for the opponents and cannot offer any help for their own army (also are ineffective and unusable).
  ---  The Bandit in Asylum make the town uncompleted. There are two lines in this town: Orc  (Orc tower)- Medusa (Sanctuary Garden) - Nightmare (Black wood)- Hydra (Hydra pond) and the second is Bandit (Den of thieves) - Minotaur (Labyrinth) - Efreet (Volcanic veil) - Black Dragon (Dragon cave). The first line is OK, but the second is not. The last three creatures are both of might and magic but the bandit is too ordinary. A unit for example called Nightwalker with the same special ability but with another appearance (more funky) will fit better. On the other hand the bandits are not very united to be in towns even in Asylum.
  ---   The Goblins in the Stronghold also contradict to the prime idea of the town. There are nor mighty nor devastating. The look of the goblins in MM7 fits very well - they are like soldiers with armor and sword, and these in HMM4 are poor cowardly creatures who don't know nothing about battle and have no idea for what a heck they fight. Stronghold towns count on battle abilities not on fear.
  ---   I have a general suggestion for the first level creatures. You can have both in your town and they are very similar. The one unit can be as the first creature in HMM3 ( appr.: life 10 dam 2-3 growth 20) and the other can be as the third in HMM3 (life 25 dam 5-9 growth 10). This will give more possibilities in the game and the point is that you have 5 different units in each town rather than 4 (there are 3 real army units and 2 very similar).

No, I don't have the demo !! I was playing it only for a hour, and there was no posibility to get it ((
Some of the creature buildings in the towns were not acctive and they cannot be build, so I don't know all the units.

I have a few suggestions for the units in Haven:
Haven:
Lvl1-   pikeman / archer         (negate first strike - it is also so in the demo / two shots)    
Lvl2-   crusader / executor or (chaos) slayer    (the two opposite towns for the Haven are Necropolis and Asylum - the crusader     is undead slayer with some life spell, bonus and protection vs undead and the executor is spellcaster with melee damage and some order spell aslo with bonus vs chaos creatures)
Lvl3-  zealot / ??              (the zealot or the monk is shooter but he also have healing spell)
Lvl4-  angel / champion

or
Lvl1- pikeman / archer
Lvl2- undead slayer or life protector / chaos executor    (undead slayer - knight with three-head flail and bonus like the crusader in the first suggestion and the chaos executor is mage/warrior with melee damage and some order spell and bonus vs chaos)
Lvl3- zealot / champion   (champion - with bonus like in HMM3)
Lvl4- angel / paladin    (angel - ressurect allies and the paladin strikes twice and has some defensive aura)

These are only suggestions and some of these creatures are not in the game

By the way I have make some changes in the stats of two creatures in the Shadow of Death and after I cracked the game I like much more it now:

 Manticore                Scorpicore
Att    16                      16
Def    14                      15
Dam   20-30                  30-40
Life   100                    150
Speed   7                      13
Basic Growth  1                1
                            Paralyze

   Wyvern                Ancient Wyvern
Att    14                      14
Def    14                      17
Dam   20-30                   25-45
Life  100                      130
Speed  7                       11
Basic Growth  1                1
                            Poison
                 

____________


Responses:
Chaos must prevail
 View Results!

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void
void

Tavern Dweller
posted August 25, 2001 04:03 PM

This is right -- the game is OF MIGHT AND MAGIC -- and the peasants are POOR
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chAosKid
chAosKid

Tavern Dweller
posted August 25, 2001 04:08 PM

I hava an idea for a see monster:
Kraekvar
A mighty creature with 10 tentacles each with his own movement, damage and HP. In the battle the kraekvar may be in the middle of the battlefield and the hero army around him.
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Shadow_Phoenix
Shadow_Phoenix


Known Hero
Shadow Ruler
posted August 25, 2001 04:10 PM

Isn't Kraekvar the name of one of the enemy generals in Fantasy General?

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chAosKid
chAosKid

Tavern Dweller
posted August 25, 2001 04:12 PM

this is right
not kraekvar - kraken
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Thunder
Thunder


Responsible
Famous Hero
posted August 25, 2001 04:14 PM

Yes he is.....

He`s that demoniac hero under the command of that shadow wizarŽd. He`s on the second continent`s final scenario. He can cast panic.

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Sha_Men
Sha_Men


Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jack-Of-No-Trades
posted August 25, 2001 04:17 PM

Welcome ChaosKid...

You find pretty much "common things" to discuss here with...Incubus...
Or not.

I leave my comment about your suggestions for later time...
____________
Catch the vigorous horse of your mind.

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chAosKid
chAosKid

Tavern Dweller
posted August 25, 2001 04:21 PM

Other changes that i will make in HMM3 but i can only change the stats and the growth of creatures not the special abilities are:
Ghost dragon - 40% less physical damage, at least the ghost dragon is not very material. he will take full damage from spells but not from physical attacks - this makes his life 280 hp against creatures
Black dragon - +1 moral only for him. The minotaures in Dungeon have at least +1 moral and the Black dragon +1 more.You cannot help him with spells, no protection, no ressurection and I think this change is more than helpfull(as the angels in Castle but this is only for the Dragon)
Wraith-a 10% chance to make a killed opponent (or 10% of them ) a wraith (as the ghosts in HMM2).
____________

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Dragonhunter
Dragonhunter


Adventuring Hero
Anybody got a Band-aid
posted August 25, 2001 04:32 PM

I never liked the whole peasant thing either. They're good to convert to skeletons and that's about it! The only plus would be huge numbers and being very cheap or even "free"!
To me the goblins are not much better but I would use them before peasants. I don't think they should look the way they did in MM7 'cos that is more like an orc. I think it would be fun if goblins were very cheap to buy but did not always act as they were supposed to. There unruly little creatures!
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void
void

Tavern Dweller
posted August 25, 2001 04:38 PM

You think - like berserkers - there are in Preserve town - level 1 unit with sprite
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DarkRain_CHN
DarkRain_CHN

Tavern Dweller
posted August 25, 2001 04:57 PM

Quote:
By the way I have make some changes in the stats of two creatures in the Shadow of Death and after I cracked the game I like much more it now:

 Manticore                Scorpicore
Att    16                      16
Def    14                      15
Dam   20-30                  30-40
Life   100                    150
Speed   7                      13
Basic Growth  1                1
                            Paralyze

   Wyvern                Ancient Wyvern
Att    14                      14
Def    14                      17
Dam   20-30                   25-45
Life  100                      130
Speed  7                       11
Basic Growth  1                1
                            Poison
                 



You break the balance of the game.
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Dragonhunter
Dragonhunter


Adventuring Hero
Anybody got a Band-aid
posted August 25, 2001 05:05 PM

I think that could add a nice twist. The berserker, while very good would have to be kept away from friendly units or run the risk of hitting his own unit accidentally.
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Preserver
Preserver


Promising
Famous Hero
Elemental Druid
posted August 25, 2001 10:58 PM

Quote:
I think that could add a nice twist. The berserker, while very good would have to be kept away from friendly units or run the risk of hitting his own unit accidentally.
The Berserkers only attack the nearest ENEMY!

And I am not sure they are in the Preserve (Maybe through creature portal)
____________
- The only alert the invaders had was the rustling of leaves on a day without wind -

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bort
bort


Honorable
Supreme Hero
Discarded foreskin of morality
posted August 26, 2001 02:44 AM

You know, some creatures that look poor are actually quite wealthy.  Take Bill Gates for instance.  Looks like a 40 year old graduate student that got evicted from his apartment, but the guy could probably buy Norway if he wanted to.
Besides, what's wrong with poor creatures anyway?  Everybody knows that soldiers are people who didn't have a rich daddy to get them out of the draft.  The lower your socio-economic status, the better fighter you are.

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Shae_Trielle
Shae_Trielle


Honorable
Famous Hero
of Heroes
posted August 26, 2001 03:34 AM

The nature of visuals

You can't not have a poor looking unit in Homm. The nature of such things dictate that there will always be poor looking units in a visual scene. If you had a hundred individually cool creatures to feast your eyes on then went and lined up those creatures next to each other and made comparisons, you'd STILL come up with creatures that look poor. I mean a behemoth looks cool, and a gold dragon looks nice, but put them together, and you'd come away saying that the hemoth looks pretty poor.

It's like saying, I want to see no shadows when the light is on...

*smile*

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Night_Stalker
Night_Stalker


Known Hero
Lord of the Night
posted August 26, 2001 10:36 AM
Edited By: Night_Stalker on 26 Aug 2001

I don't know.

Why they taked them out.. Blizzard always take things out. Like in warcraft3... They just taked out the Banshee,Spiderking,Chimera,Ranger,Shadow Hunter,Cold Wraith,Crusader(on horse),Spirit Walker,Anti-Paladin,Arch Druid, and some others. Orc catapult for instance.. I really loved all this creatures... Now they deleted them? I don't know why Blizzard always deleting their creatures.. I think it's stupid.. Even my personal Letters didn't get in their minds.

It's also very ovious they always deleting the coolest. They just Deleted The only FEMALE HERO! The ranger! God damned!
____________
Humans say they are powerfull. But that stops when facing a monster.

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void
void

Tavern Dweller
posted August 26, 2001 11:02 AM

to DarkRain_CHN

About : You break the balance of the game.

chAosKid send me his copy of Shadow of death with his changes and I think it is more balanced now. You must try to play let's say with creatures from 20 populations from Dungeon vs 20 pop. from Tower and don't use magic. Before the chances were 30% (Duneon) to 70% (Tower) to win and now -- 45% (Dungeon) 55% (Tower). The balace is OK  since you have only 2 Scorpicores with Castle (before-4). And the Wyvern is much cooooolll now
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chAosKid
chAosKid

Tavern Dweller
posted August 26, 2001 11:06 AM

I was thinking that a monster named Ehidna is very cool to be at the place of Scorpicore - it is from greek mythology. It is half winged snake half women and with a halberd will be bloody good looking but I can't change the picture
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Night_Stalker
Night_Stalker


Known Hero
Lord of the Night
posted August 26, 2001 11:09 AM

Echidna?

Mother of Chimera,Nemean Lion,Harpies,Devilin,Cerberus,Hydra,Orthus and many others? LOL! She could rather be a hero. Not unit... Manticore are to cool to miss! They are the Ultimate dragon slayers! They are created by dark magic to slay Good dragons.. So why deleting them? Their special could be Many damage to dragons.
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Humans say they are powerfull. But that stops when facing a monster.

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chAosKid
chAosKid

Tavern Dweller
posted August 26, 2001 11:18 AM

Hail Discordia

I don't worry about the new Homm4 towns since I can change them in the way I want. The 3d0 has made all the changes I wanted before 6 months - tree structure of the towns, walking monsters and heroes in the battles. The skills and artifacts can be surprise
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