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| Thread: Fields of innocence | |
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Lady_Milena
Honorable
Known Hero
Grannie Sweet Cheeks
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posted November 26, 2005 12:01 PM |
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Fields of innocence
Consis, you're right! I totally agree with you - we need a serious conversation to get to know each other! I was thinking about a challenge last night and I decided to look through my diary and select a topic that might not be among the regularly discussed ones. Innocence!
In my diary this one is entered as Lithium. Of course, I made changes to the text to make it fit a board better but the narrative's still quite personal. Hey people just because I put the name Consis at the front doesn't mean this post is meant for him. If you have a story to tell, I'll be happy to hear it.
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Couple of weeks ago I listened to In Bloom, a great hit song by the great band Nirvana. No matter the time or the place hearing a Nirvana tune always brings me back in time to the age when I was 15, a sophomore in high school and a completely, completely innocent girl.
Not to my credit at first I thought in Bloom to be Lithium, a big favorite of mine. So, the word Lithium brought an ironic smile on my face. Back then when I was soaking the culture attibuted to Nirvana (hey some of us used to listen to Take That before that) I meticulously looked for the lyrics and tried to translate them. Now now, in the 9th grade we studied inorganic chemistry. I thought it was so awesome that a band of Nirvana's rank would dedicate a song to a chemical element!!
Recalling my thoughts made me shake my head with what was probably nostalgia or self-pity. Or probably both at the same time. NOW I understand. Nirvana never dedicated a song to a chemical element.
Yeah, at 15 all I was worried about was getting straight As in school (which I did), pleasing my mother (which I tried very hard to do) and making a friend (which I eventually did). I had learned about sex barely 4 years ago and it still was a far-fetched concept. A had already lived through a suicide attempt and two of my friends had confided in me they had been raped. Yet, I believed in romance and true love. I did believe Lithium was only a chemical element, #3 in the periodic table.
Now it is as if another person is listening to the same old songs. Love to a man is a total mystery to me. I know that a boy and a girl, when alone, do not read the Bible together. And I know that Lithium has made all the difference in the lives of millions of people who have never heard of the periodic law. Never ever did I imagine it COULD be something else, a hidden meaning that my mind could not conceive. And to live shielded in such illusion, isn't that a sign of such innocence?
Or is it a sign of naivete?
As a senior in high school I had to finally stick to a major to apply for in University. At 18 work and taxes and employers and career seemed as distant as the Rocky Mountains and I didn't really give it much thought. My mother thought psychology was an unworthy major. My grandparents wanted a MD but I knew blood and surgery was NOT for me. I was long disenchanted with journalism and vet medicine. So, with an university of economics in my hometown, I put 2 and 2 together, deciding to become an accountant! A quiet office, dealing with money, nothing really exciting but a source of income, I thought I had discovered my path in life.
Ah the innocence, oh the naivete.
I've changed so much and I've lost a lot of fluff - evident on the pictures and from my writing. I cannot decide between laughing and crying at my former general line of thinking. In school I dreamed that if I had the money one day, I'd build an animal shelter. I dreamed that my Prince Charming will come on a white horse in white armor to take me away. Now the beggars know they'll get no alms from me and I'm disenchanted with men as much as childen when they learn their parents buy the guys they supposedly get from Santa Claus. I used to believe that love without romance was unthinkable. Naivete long lost, it's a lifestyle for me.
And while listening to the last tunes of In Bloom, a sharp kind of pain seared my heart. The music took me back in time, when I was still in the very beginning of high school and I had no clue such a thing as chiropractic existed or that lithium was a drug, not only a chemical element. I really missed having my universe spin around high school grades and classmates' coteries. I terribly, terribly, terribly missed my innocence.
I suppose I should appreciate what little I have of it now, believing that all animals and children have the right to have food and remain unmolested. And when I hear Lithium, the god that I found, in say, 7 years, am I going to lament the time when I was in high school or my prime now, at 23?
Ah, the innocence.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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So, I have questions for you! You heard my thoughts about I'd like to hear opinions on the following:
- Are innocence and naivete the same thing?
- Is losing innocence becoming cynical? Or is it just the first step in the process?
- What is indeed to be innocent, then not?
- So what is better, to be innocent (idealistic, naive) and look pathetic in the eyes of others or be calloused and cynical but less vulnerable?
- And of course, do you still consider yourself innocent and if not, can you tell of an event that 'cut your teeth'
Thank you for any responses this thread may prompt. :-)
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God does not need exist to save us...
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Wiseman
Known Hero
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posted November 26, 2005 05:00 PM |
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CYNIC, n. A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are,
not as they ought to be.
P.S. I think that Nirvana were a bloody awful band.
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Truth may be out there, but lies are inside your head.
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Valeriy
Mage of the Land
Naughty, Naughty Valeriy
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posted November 26, 2005 07:43 PM |
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I was also quite naive in a sense that I thought people had the same values as I do about honesty and decency. When I was confronted with it obviously not being the case for over a dozen years, I've still somehow thought that it's due to their misunderstanding or not being aware of what they are doing. Only recently it got through to me that they know very well what they are doing and they do it quite deliberately.
Cynicism is an easy way out - a way to make a drama around oneself, get attention, put others down, and justify not living up to your own standards. It's also an easy way out in a suicidal sense - to who you really are, and what you wanted your life to be like.
I think being innocent is more like the court definition - not responsible for something, didn't do it. I use the words 'trusting' and 'naive' instead for a positive worldview that has not clashed with negative aspects of reality.
People beat themselves up for being trusting and naive and 'failing' (getting a whack from life/people in one way or another, be it betrayal or rape). But it's not the way to go, it just means they haven't exercised moderation with their positive qualities. Being trusting is the only thing that can make a trully wonderful relationship work, be it personal or working relationship. Cynics do not have that, they always see the worst, not the best. They are capable of lying to their parner and always need to check up on them. Their relationships are mostly control struggles or manipulation. They don't trust the other person, they have to be in control.
So from what I've learned, it's not worth falling into a drama over even the multiple failures of being naive and trusting. It's a balancing act to master. There are those who will treasure and reciprocate trust. And there are those who will take advantage of it. It must be given selectively. And hey, if I am like I am, I can't be the only one like that, suggesting that I am the only one is yet another drama.
Sure the rate of such people in the general populace doesn't seem to be high in my experience. But there's really no other life to select other than the one we have at the moment, so might as well take it as it is and use those 'naive' values to make a niche in it that matches our dreams. Someone can be cynical all day and cuss the world and people, and call me stupid for being an idealist and trying to live differently in a wretched society. One thing I know for a fact is that after some years of such deliberate 'stupidity' some of my dreams have already come true, and more will follow. Whereas all a cynic has accumulated are a bag of cusses.
So you could call me stubbornly naive. I've learned though, after many years of bad treatment from important people and seeing deliberate harm and dishonesty. Now I use my cynical powers like a radar, and when it's bleeping I just go somewhere else and continue being an idealist. My radar is hyper-sensitive from wealth of such experience, perhaps sometimes I still dismiss ok people when I see a hint of manupulativeness in them.
But when I hear "I will never love again" or "all the people are so cruel", I am cynical and call them drama queens  
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You can wait for others to do it, but if they don't know how, you'll wait forever.
Be an example of what you want to see on HC and in the world.
http://www.heroesofmightandmagic.com
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted December 05, 2005 07:59 AM |
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Well . . .
I think we are very near the same age, you and I, Milena. I also love Nirvana. I'm 30 and thousands of miles to the north in Portland Oregon. A long way yes?
And Valeriy it's good to hear your thoughts as well.
Wiseman, I wish you had more to say. I would read every word with great enthusiasm. You may not know it but I do consider you to be a good quality poster.
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Roses Are Red And So Am I
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Lady_Milena
Honorable
Known Hero
Grannie Sweet Cheeks
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posted December 07, 2005 02:39 AM |
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I wish I was your age, Consis. And before you've said something, I'll just make the point that I'm supposed to get my degree at that age.
In fact, not a long way, considering that post was written in California. Not a long way considering as plans go, I will be living in CA state for the next 6 years and that's one hour away with a plane. And if these plans fall through, next plan in line is in fact Portland, Oregon. There are only 16 schools offering education in the field and more than half of them are in the red states. Don't have that many alternatives. :-)
Val, I noticed your point and your IM. I've been terribly busy but I'll get back to you as soon as I can.
P.S. I will go back to this post to edit it and write it up properly. 
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God does not need exist to save us...
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted December 07, 2005 07:46 AM |
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Edited By: Consis on 7 Dec 2005
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Hmm
That sounds wonderful. If you come to Portland we simply must have a cup of tea or coffee. Not many (none that I know of) Heroes Community people live anywhere near this part of the world. There's a Borders bookstore, not far from where I live, that shares space with a StarBucks cafe. I think it'd be delightful to chat with you over a warm cup, plenty of bustling people, and an entire selection of books to look over if ever you might be interested.
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Roses Are RedAnd So Am I
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bjorn190
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jebus maker
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posted December 07, 2005 09:32 PM |
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Quote:
So from what I've learned, it's not worth falling into a drama over even the multiple failures of being naive and trusting. It's a balancing act to master. There are those who will treasure and reciprocate trust. And there are those who will take advantage of it. It must be given selectively. And hey, if I am like I am, I can't be the only one like that, suggesting that I am the only one is yet another drama.
Sure the rate of such people in the general populace doesn't seem to be high in my experience. But there's really no other life to select other than the one we have at the moment, so might as well take it as it is and use those 'naive' values to make a niche in it that matches our dreams.
Yea. Thats the good thing to do. But its also a compromise. It really sucks that the world is not as good as it might have been if things were different. Makes you wonder what the world is for. It kinda sucks sometimes.
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bjorn190
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jebus maker
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posted December 08, 2005 03:22 AM |
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About that this is the only life we have, yes, that might be true. Baudrilliard writes in "Impossible Exchange" that because we cannot replace our life with another, we are forced to deal with it and the uncertainty attached to being anchored in a world that cannot be exchanged for another.
The twist is that we somehow have been given the ability to become aware of the anchors that keep us in this world; That we are mortal, that things that have happened remain unchangeable, and that we can suffer physical harm. Also, as Liebniz asked, "Why is there anything rather than nothing at all?".
Somehow the only logical conclusion I can come to, is that the world is here so that we can experience love. The three anchors of reality make the moments precious, and even when bad things happen, they show us how beautiful the world was before our loss, and how beautiful it can be again. Our most miraculous moments of love and our deepest abyssal sorrows have only one possible conclusion.
The absolute beauty of love is what I'm here for. And that is what Im always looking for in the everyday matters of existance. I found it once, and I hope to be in that place again some day. Until that time comes, there is always hope and memory, and the comfort that nothing can ever change the moments that took our breath away; the moments that made life worth living.
And theres also a wonderful quote from Hamlet about it being bound to this world, however it may be.
This might sound geeky but once your old enough it's not so geeky anymore.
"To grunt and sweat under a weary life,
But that the dread of something after death,
The undiscover'd country from whose bourn
No traveller returns, puzzles the will
And makes us rather bear those ills we have
Than fly to others that we know not of?
Thus conscience does make cowards of us all;
And thus the native hue of resolution
Is sicklied o'er with the pale cast of thought,
And enterprises of great pith and moment
With this regard their currents turn awry,
And lose the name of action." Full quote here: http://www.artofeurope.com/shakespeare/sha8.htm
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