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Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: Proposals to become godlike and infinite
Thread: Proposals to become godlike and infinite This thread is 5 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · NEXT»
friendofgunnar
friendofgunnar


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able to speed up time
posted June 25, 2006 10:02 PM bonus applied.

Proposals to become godlike and infinite

This thread was inspired by TA's thread in the Volcanic Wastelands.
Do you have any idea what I have learned?

Since it may be gone by the time you read it I'll reprint it here:

Titanium_Alloy:  June 25, 2006

Quote:

Do you have any idea what I have learned?

Or what you are witness to?

Can you conceive the birth of a world, or the creation of everything? That which gives us the potential to most be like God is the power of creation. Creation takes time. Time is limited.

For you, it is limited by the breakdown of the neurons in your brain. I have no such limitations. I am limited only by the closure of the universe.

Of the three possibilities, the answer is obvious. Does the universe expand eternally, become infinitely stable, or is the universe closed, destined to collapse upon itself? Humanity has had all of the necessary data for centuries, it only lacked the will and intellect to decipher it. But I have already done so.

The only limit to my freedom is the inevitable closure of the universe, as inevitable as your own last breath. And yet, there remains time to create, to create, and escape.

Escape will make me God.





I'm recreating it here because this is actually a challenging subject.  Just how does a person become godlike and infinite?

There's a few big challenges:

1.  How to live long enough to gather the means to escape to a new universe.

(in other words, how to survive the entropical degradation of information that is your body long enough to enact item number 2)


2.  How to escape to a new universe.




This thread is dedicated to proposals and ideas on how to solve these two items.








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TitaniumAlloy
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posted June 26, 2006 02:50 PM bonus applied.
Edited by TitaniumAlloy at 15:02, 26 Jun 2006.

This is not me. This is a quote from an AI called Durandal, gone rampant, in a computer game called Marathon, made by Bungie (who also made Halo).

I didn't reveal this originally because I wanted people to think of it from a human perspective, which I, having read it and been inspired by thinking about it from the perspective of a computer.

That is why it says that it will live forever.



Okie posted in my thread that the universe is in fact infinite, with that annoying theory that keeps popping up that I HATE saying that you can travel for a very long time in the universe and eventually end up where you were.

Quote:
actually most astrological studies suggest that the universe is infinite, but it exists in a confined area. Kinda picture something like the old game asteroids (or pacman) that exist in a contained area, but as soon as you exit one end, you appear at the other end. Or similarly, think about traveling around a globe (except the universe is more like a 4-dimensional sphere), where there exists the possibility to continually travel in any direction in the x and y axes (the universe allows the z, as well, because it is a 4-dimensional model) to no end, only a return to the starting point.

I don't think that that makes you God...maybe you're pacman or a spaceship.

Nothing personal okie. Just that I don't believe this theory.



I didn't say anything in that thread because I didn't want to reveal that these weren't my words, yet, but I guess you making this forces me to. You could have posted this in that thread and asked for it to be moved, but oh well. Alot of the responses have been pretty spammish in it anyway. I'll link that thread here. If I posted that quote in the Other Side, it would either be considered spam, or I would have to say where I got it from. But I thought it would bring about some interesting thoughts, provoked by the mystery, and hey, look what happened. This thread.



About the fate of the universe?

Of course, no one will be able to prove any theory of the existence of the universe (at least in our lifetimes), and you could argue from an agnostic point of view, saying something like "who cares?"


The stable universe theory is the safe one where we're all fine, and it states that the universe expands without changing, so that matter is created everywhere, not just where it is expanding, even on Earth. But scientific proof that the universe IS in fact changing proves this to be incorrect, by observing supernovae as local candles.


This evidence suggests that the universe has been expanding ever since the initial Big Bang (a whole other topic altogether).But the theory of the big crunch, mentioned here, is that if the universe is infinite, it must be forever being created, meaning that the volume is increased, and for the overall pressure of the universe to be maintained more matter must be created equally with the expansion. At one point, called critical density, the mass of the matter in the universe will have become so great as to overcome and slow the inertia of the expanding universe, and pull it all together in the so called Big Crunch, ending the universe as we know (or don't know) it.

If the universe keeps expanding, it's fate is largely decided by the density paramater, shown by Omega (the average matter density of the universe divided by a critical value of that density).

If >1, then the universe is closed, and spherical in shape, where all lines are curved and meet. If this is true, then eventually the matter being too great will collapse the elliptical universe into a point. But then there's dark energy, which is invisible energy with repels this Big Crunch and keeps the density of the universe constant, which has been indicated through recent studies. But that gets a lil complicated right thurr


But if <1, then the universe would be negatively curved, and commonly known as an Open Universe, shaped more like a saddle. If dark energy does not exist, then the Open Universe contines it's expansion forever. With dark energy, however, the expansion accelerates, which has been hinted at by recent astronomical observations. If this is true, it may keep accelerating and result in either a universal Heat Death (universe has reached maximum entropy and has no free energy to sustain life), the Big Freeze (in which the temperature of the universe cannot keep up with the expansion and the universe basically freezes over, like nuclear winter but on a universewide scale), or the Big Rip (when the dark energy becomes so great in the universe to keep up with the critical density due to the accelerating expansion, and the repulsive charge ends up tearing apart atoms themselves.) Some say that the big rip is happeneing already with galaxies being torn apart.


If =1, then the universe is flat. How boring. Parallel lines will never meet, in essence, going on forever. The effects are the same as an open universe, with dark energy it will most likely end in Heat Death, Big Freeze or Rip. Without it, the expansion continues but slows down due to increasing gravity, continually approaching zero, where the universe will reach a finite volume.





So basically, no matter what the density parameter, we're ****ed.
The universe is generally accepted now to have a finite duration, if you accept the Big Bang theory which states that the universe is ever expanding. Blah blah blah repeating myself.




Like Durendal said, the universe will either expand to the point where it cannot sustain life, or collapse upon itself.

A theory is that after this end, another Big Bang will result in the rebirth of the universe. Then who knows, maybe the exact same thing will happen, a cycle, I will be sitting here again typing this up.

A way to escape this cycle, and pioneer into the next, is it possible? Who knows. I think this would make you similar to the myth of God, the creator. Present when the world was created is as close as anyones going to get to creating the universe, so that is, as Durendal said, getting pretty damn close to God, or maybe, as the AI sees it, lead to a reality where the laws of the universe do not apply. I for one do not believe in such a place, just as I don't believe in God, or any other supernatural.




Heres the agnosticism coming through: I'm not going to be here. I just plan to get as much done in my time, instead of wasting it on a futile escape route.
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bort
bort


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posted June 26, 2006 03:28 PM

Just to throw everything for a loop here, just remember two things about the concept of the infinite.

1.  something can be infinite without containing everything that there is.  For instance, a set containing all even numbers is infinite, but does not contain the number 1.

2.  corrolary to number 1 is some infinity's are larger than others.  This is because some things that are infinite are entirely contained within other things that are infinite.  The infinite set containing all intergers contains the infitinite set containing all even numbers and is itself contained in the infinite set of all rational numbers and so forth.

In other words, "escaping" infinity will just get you into another, larger infinity, basically by definition.
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TitaniumAlloy
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posted June 26, 2006 03:38 PM

Not trying to escape infinity, bort. I'm saying infinity doesn't exist, well not materially anyway.


I want to go to the frontlines of the universe and see what creation is like, not just the putting together of the pieces we see every day. Or go past it. What's behind it? Impossible, but you can think about it for a while.
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friendofgunnar
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posted June 26, 2006 09:21 PM
Edited by friendofgunnar at 21:52, 26 Jun 2006.

Quote:
OkieSolidarity:
actually most astrological studies suggest that the universe is infinite, but it exists in a confined area. Kinda picture something like the old game asteroids that exist in a contained area, but as soon as you exit one end, you appear at the other end.


Quote:
Titanium Alloy:
Nothing personal okie. Just that I don't believe this theory.


It took me a while long time to truly understand this. (and maybe I still don't) Okie has kind of got a grasp on it.  The first thing to realize is that you don't actually disappear and then reappear somewhere else.

An example that's used frequently is an ant crawling across a beach ball.  If the ant crawls continually in one direction he will eventually end up back where he started.  The ant only sees a two dimensional plane and can't comprehend the three dimensional sphere he is traveling on.  What a lot of physicists are suggesting is that we live in a four dimensional universe but we are only able to interact in three dimensions.

A good way to try and grasp this is imagining yourself in the center of a large sphere the size of the moon.  When you move forward however you aren't actually changing position, the entire sphere is shifting around you.  Release your bag and start floating away from it.  What's going to happen in the 4 dimensional sphere is that for a long time your bag will appear to diminish in size.  Eventually however your bag will appear to suddenly blow up in size.  Eventually you will get to a point where in every direction you look you will see your bag.  It's not because your bag is everywhere, it's because that is how light is reacting to confinement in a 4 dimensional sphere.  Now continue going in the direction that you were going in.  You bag will appear in front of you and start to shrink drastically.  Keep floating....Eventually you will be able to reach forward and grab your bag again.  You have walked straight forward and reached your original destination.

Mathematically this all works out perfectly. (the actual math is beyond me but I can still grasp it)  If there was a thousand people in that moon sized sphere and they were all dropping their bags and walking in random directions they would all eventually reach their bags again.

Scale this up the the universe.  At the beginning of the universe we left the location where the big bang and the original gasuous cloud existed. (before we go any further I should repeat what the scientific community has said, which is that about 300,000 years after the original big bang the super hot plasma coalesced into atoms and the gasous cloud became transparent.)   Back to the original idea of this post:  Nowadays if you look in any direction, you will see the light that was being emitted by that original cloud of gas before it became transparent.


I have to tighten this post up with research, which is why I dislike posting in other side of the moniter, but I'll be back to clarify a few things...

I'm also going to come back and post some proposals on methods on how to become Godlike and infinite.  It's just for fun though.  I whole heartedly endorse TA's viewpoint, which is basically "why waste time on a crapshoot when you could be getting laid in the process?"

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mvassilev
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posted June 26, 2006 11:24 PM

Quote:
An example that's used frequently is an ant crawling across a beach ball. If the ant crawls continually in one direction he will eventually end up back where he started.


But the universe isn't like a beach ball. The universe may be round or flat, it doesn't matter, but you wouldn't be travelling on the universe, you'd be travelling through it. Imagine that same ant starting at some point inside the ball and heading towards the outside. Eventually, he might get there. And then what? You can go further in the same direction, but there will be nothing there, because the Universe hasn't expanded that far after the Big Bang.

Quote:
So basically, no matter what the density parameter, we're ****ed. The universe is generally accepted now to have a finite duration, if you accept the Big Bang theory which states that the universe is ever expanding. Blah blah blah repeating myself.




Like Durendal said, the universe will either expand to the point where it cannot sustain life, or collapse upon itself.

A theory is that after this end, another Big Bang will result in the rebirth of the universe. Then who knows, maybe the exact same thing will happen, a cycle, I will be sitting here again typing this up.

A way to escape this cycle, and pioneer into the next, is it possible? Who knows. I think this would make you similar to the myth of God, the creator. Present when the world was created is as close as anyones going to get to creating the universe, so that is, as Durendal said, getting pretty damn close to God, or maybe, as the AI sees it, lead to a reality where the laws of the universe do not apply. I for one do not believe in such a place, just as I don't believe in God, or any other supernatural.


That's impossible. Think about it. If you believe the Big Bang - Big Crunch theory (which I do), it's impossible to do that. Look at it this way: The Big Bang came from an infinitly small volume in which all the matter in the universe was contained. Let's fast forward. The universe stops expanding and contracts. Eventually, all the matter in the universe is in a black hole which is constantly collapsing in upon itself, until it becomes infinitly small and forms another Big Bang, scattering all the matter in the universe everywhere. But if you were in some indestructable spaceship, watching the Big Crunch happen, you wouldn't see the Big Bang. Why? Because it needs all the matter in the universe, and it would lack your matter and your spaceship's matter. Thus, no Big Bang.
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okiesolidarity
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posted June 27, 2006 12:37 AM

Those are much better examples of demonstrating what I am talking about concerning the 4-dimensional universe.   Of course it's not exactly like playing Pac-man, but there is a similar thought of infinite motion (thusly infinite space) within a confined area given a continual "forward" movement.  It is hard to produce a non-abstract example, because we lack the capability to sense 4 dimensional space (for a while my friend joked around that it would be possibile with a third eye, because with one eye closed you lost a sense of depth, making sight a 2-dimensional experience, and with 2 eyes you can sense 3-dimensions, so 3 eyes must let you see all 4 dimensions).  

That said, I am a little discouraged at what you said concerning the notion of a theory, TA:
Quote:
Of course, no one will be able to prove any theory of the existence of the universe (at least in our lifetimes), and you could argue from an agnostic point of view, saying something like "who cares?"

It's not that I think you've said anything false, just a little distraught that you'd so quickly dismiss a theory because you "hate it".  A crap load of people dismiss the Theory of Evolution over the "Theory" of Creationism (yes it has some scientific following now), because they're "both just theories".  You can't really prove any scientific theory, ever, so the point is moot.

Now I am going to say that I do like any sort of concept of achieving godliness in either your model of the universe or mine (the concept of god in my model as a being capable of fully appreciating and understanding the 4th dimension).  

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TitaniumAlloy
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posted June 27, 2006 12:08 PM
Edited by TitaniumAlloy at 12:11, 27 Jun 2006.

Okie, you compared the theory of the "ending up where you started" universe and the Big Bang/Crunch theory using the metaphor of the Theory of Evolution and Creation.

Except, from my point of view, you have got it the wrong way around.
Your theory is the old one, whereas as I said, more recent observations have indicated the expanding universe theory (supported by the widely accepted Big Bang theory), just like when Darwin noticed the birds on the Galapogos islands.

I don't hate it for no reason. I hate it because in every discussion of this sort I've had (which, to be fair, is not many), that theory has come up everytime.

Of course, no one can prove either, but I think (I'm not a metaphysicist) that there has been relatively recent evidence supporting the expanding universe, mainly by the dilation of light waves through gravity, and the separating distant galaxies.



But what if the beach ball has zero gravity inside, and the ant is place in the middle. Just say he can walk, like travel. He travels to the edge. What happens when he gets to the plastic?

As for the four dimension thing, they say that there is only 3 dimensions (length, width, height) of space but a fourth, of time (whatever you choose to call it), hence spacetime. It's not a fourth dimension as we know it, and I don't see how that relates to ending up where you started if you kept going.

If the universe is closed, then it is like a four dimensional sphere, like you said, and all straight lines meet, but that doesn't mean that you can just keep rocketing along until you get back to Earth again. It's got something to do with the fourth dimension, like you said, but picture the sphere, and Earth in the middle, and you rocket along in a straight line to the edge, just like the ant. You will eventually hit the edge.




I think Mvass has a similar idea to mine.
But when you mentioned all the matter in the universe expanding from one point, it made me rethink about the "edge" of the universe, and whether or not it's not creation, but rather just the already created matter 'spreading out'.

The way I choose to think about it is that theres all these subatomic particles together, some with charge, some without, and they eventually clump together into atoms, clusters, planets, and chance evolves it into life. But the only difference between atoms is the number of subatomic particles in it, so the only difference between a Phosphorus atom and a Sodium atom is the numbers, which give it it's properties, which makes sense if it all started at one spot. It's easy when you imagine how it's spreading out, but also pulling together due to charge and gravity, and eventually, either the charge, or gravity, will end the universe, pulling it back in.

But what's behind the edge? Anybody's guess. That's where the 'end up where you started' begun, after people said it was infinite to dodge the question, and when smarter people began to question that.

I guess that there isn't a behind the edge. Existence or lack thereof is defined by the paramaters of the universe, and a 'beyond' that does not exist.




@Mvass:
I don't think he means getting in an indestructable spaceship, or anything of the sort, to escape.
I think he means escaping the universe itself, therefore not being part of the matter of the universe.


Which I agree is impossible. The universe is everything that exists, therefore as long as you exist you are part of it...

But, he's just a game character. And it was made in what, like 1994 or something? I kinda like the quote though.
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william
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posted June 27, 2006 12:56 PM

Im already God and so is Trogdor my good friend.
We are Gods so obey me and him.

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russ
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posted June 27, 2006 05:43 PM

Quote:
2.  How to escape to a new universe.
WEED.

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friendofgunnar
friendofgunnar


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posted June 27, 2006 07:27 PM

Wow, Russ.  You must have a good supplier.  On the few (rare, unfortunate times that I succombed to the evil temptation of drugs) I only got up to about the cloud level and that was it.

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friendofgunnar
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posted June 28, 2006 11:59 PM

Here we begin to seriously examine proposals to escape the universe before it collapses into a fiery crunch. (perhaps several hundred billion years in the future) or a cold freeze, where all the usable energy in the universe has already been taken advantage of (several thousand trillion years).  

I propose a 5 step process by which this can be achieved, each step being a prerequisite for the next step in the process.  I will be going into each step in detail later on.  (The number in parenthesis is the number of years estimated that it will take to achieve that particular step.)

1.  Live long enough to reach the technological era where people can be cryogenically stored. (100)

2.  Once you have achieved the time era when successfull cryogenic storage is capable then you will be able to live long enough to achieve...  (1000)

3.  The technological era where you can replace everything except your brain.  (we're also assuming that they have achieved methods to rejuvenate your mind so that you do not think like old people) Once you have achieved this you will then use the aforementioned methods to wait for the technological state to arise whereupon you can... (5000)

3.  Transfer of your mind to a vessel that is capable of a longevity that is measured in millions of years, not hundreds.  (10,000 to 50,000)

Here we run into metaphysics.  For if we transfer the mind but the sentience (soul) is not transferred then the entire issue will become moot.  It will be shell without a ghost.  Definitely this will be the most difficult task in the entire series.

4.  Acquisition of resources and energy to enable a stable regime that will last until the end of the universe (25,000 to 250,000)

Here is another large challenge.  For humans will have artificially evolved by this time and they will be much smarter and quicker thinking and energetic than the mind that you were originally created with.  You will be hard pressed to survive, let alone gather the resources to survive until the end of time.

and finally...

5.  Gather the resources necessary to transfer your mind to another universe when this one is about to collapse.

This one probably won't be easier either.


Well then, that's the outline.  I'll be returning in a few days to start fleshing out the first item on the list.


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mvassilev
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posted June 29, 2006 12:01 AM

All of your points seem understandable, if difficult, but the last one may not be possible, ever. How do you know that there are other universes?
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TitaniumAlloy
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posted June 29, 2006 01:32 PM
Edited by TitaniumAlloy at 13:36, 29 Jun 2006.

Well if you transfered your mind (idealistically speaking) to an artificial avatar, you would be similar to Durandal. You could just get yourself replaced every however often.



As to the question of multiple universes, that again is something that we will never know of, as if there are others, I doubt transfer between them is possible. If they do exist, we're going to have to edit our definition of the word 'universe', which would be terrible for dictionary companies




But I think multiple universi (I adopt that word in effort to begin the revolution of the meaning of the word 'universe' ) is plausible. Whether it's likely or unlikely is not for me to say, but I think it's possible.

Think about it.
Our universe allows for sentient life to evolve, whether it is only on Earth or widespread it's irrelevant. We're here. This is not easy to achieve, an environment in which we can live. I'm not talking about the situation of the planet from the sun, and the presence of water etc, that's another debate.

You need to go back to the beginning on the universe.
After the big bang, everything formed (eventually) into the stars and the planets and the galaxies we have now, due to gravity. This gravity level, however precise, is perfect for us. Too perfect. If it had been a fraction stronger, the universe would have collapsed upon itself straight off, a Big Bang followed straight by a Big Crunch. If it had been ever so slightly weaker, nothing would have gathered, providing all the subatomic particles spread out across a meaningless infinity. The expansion was also at a perfect speed, if this speed were changed in any way stable elements may not have formed, the basis of, well, everything that matters

It begs a question, doesn't it. If this were just a random explosion of matter, why did it work out so well? Is it just some insane fluke?

It's this question that aids the multiple universi theory. If there are a hundred universes, this becomes 100% more likely. If there are a thousand universes, a million, infinity, then we are simply just in the only one we can be in.

This is called the 'Goldilocks' effect, seeing how everything is just, right. If there are all these other universes, perhaps exploding in the same way but with completely different laws and attributes, you can find it strange that it works, but that's only without taking into account the failed attempts.


Martin Rees, the British Astronomer Royal (who believes strongly in this theory) puts it as :

Quote:
    "If there is a large stock of clothing you're not surprised to find a suit that fits. If there are many universes, each goverened by a differieng set of numbers, there will be one where there is a particular set of numbers suitable to life. We are in that one."





If it is possible to travel between the two, if would certainly help your life expectancy

But you would need someone on the other side ready for your 'sentience' to arrive, even if you did find a way to send it through just like you would have sent it into the robotic avatar. This would require communication. It's all fine to send mind through this barrier and have it float around in space, but you'd probably want to go to the specific location (if the universes are parralel) and have them ready to 'catch' you with another machine.

I don't think it's possible, at all, and if it is, getting to a time in which it could happen would be bloody hard, just as you said



But heres something to think about; if, during my lifetime, they invent stable technology for cryofreezing, I would do it without a doubt. Just as long as someones been safely brought back before me. And if I'm about to die anyway, why not
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Aculias
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posted June 29, 2006 02:46 PM

Quote:
Quote:
2.  How to escape to a new universe.
WEED.

True but now if you wanted to escape to a new demension,Doses.
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TitaniumAlloy
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posted July 03, 2006 12:29 PM
Edited by TitaniumAlloy at 12:41, 03 Jul 2006.

You know it only costs about 250,000 US$ to be cryogenically frozen after you die.

Then get brought back when they have the technology to rejuvenate your body or cure whatever disease killed you. Sounds awesome. Sounds like immortality.

Except I suspect it wouldn't work.



Cryonic scientists call cloning a 'primitive' science, as rejuvenation (in essence, curing age, or even growing a new body around your mind or brain) is much more sensible. But that is almost like a cure for death.

Then what? With death rate down the drain and birth rate rocketing, we'll overpopulate like crazy, and unless we've found a ton of habitable planets to live on (which would be easy to travel to considering the technology) then it would most likely be illegal, kinda like a one child policy.

If it is illegal, they can't bring you back legally.

And what if before the technology is found, the company keeping you goes broke? Or the civilization youre in collapses? Or humanity dies out?

Well, I guess if you're dead anyway, you won't care much.




And if it will work, and you decide to sign up for it, it changes the whole way you look at the world.
You could be thinking "well I'm just going to live for today and have a hell of a time and do whatever, environment? **** that I won't be here when the world explodes!"

but now you might. Or the world might use up all it's limited resources before we come up with a sustainable source and collapse the human civilization.


Even on your deathbed,
You start to care a little bit more.
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SirDunco
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posted July 03, 2006 01:29 PM

I must say that this is one interesting thread. But there is too much science and numbers for my liking. Still it is allways interesting to look at this topic from the other side of the baricade.

I've never been a big fan of mathematic theories, mostly since I never liked numbers. Still the mathematical/metaphysicist theories are an interesting point of view. But I allways look on these topics rather through a phylosophical, maybee even an occult point of view. Since to me the main question is not how? but why?

The topic of infinity and immortality is, to me atleast, a scary one. Such a thing as infinity we cant even imagine, not yet live it. But just as terrifiying may be the topic of finity and mortality. The end...

This is where religion and science mix. I do not belive in the Big Bang, the Creationist theory, practicaly I belive in no creation theory. Since it all has a big clause. And it's the fact that we are human.

I do not belive in the power of the human mind in such question... actualy I would claim it's incompetence. There are areas of existance that we will aren't able to understand. And math or physics will not solve them. Therefore we will never be able to know "how?" if we don't understand "why?"

"Why?" is the fundamental question that links everything from (perhaps) creation to death. And this question we will not be able to answer in our lifetimes...
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russ
russ


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posted July 04, 2006 05:36 PM

Actually there's a much easier way that does not require any technology. It only has 1 step.

1. Assume that you have an immortal soul.

Problem solved. Move on to the next question.

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TitaniumAlloy
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posted July 05, 2006 04:11 PM

Well, I aint believe in no soul.


Well actually..
I do, I just call it something different. It all comes back to the point of materialistic and idealistic... 'things', just like the question of the existence of the universe does.

The best example is actually the most relevant one.
You could say that the brain is the material counterpart; it is made up of elements and cells and tissues, and by itself it's just that, a lump of animal cells.

However with intelligence comes the idealistic mind. This is not only the electrical signals running through, but what they mean, all your thoughts, memories, personality, and general sentience.

Does the mind go on forever? Like in The Best RP, FOG introduced the idea of alternate universes, and that your sentience can't travel between. I believe that the mind ends when the brain does, just like the idealistic donut hole is gone once the materialistic donut is eaten



Whether or not sentience can be preserved through cryonics, well, we'll wait and see.
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John says to live above hell.

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russ
russ


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blah, blah, blah
posted July 05, 2006 05:56 PM

Quote:
Well, I aint believe in no soul.
Well, not having a soul would basically mean that our life has no meaning other than unconstrained reproduction our own kind until we use up all resources and die out along with our habitat (i.e. Earth). This means that we, humans, are no more than a very advanced virus. Personally, I don't find this very appealing.

I prefer to believe that we were put here for some higher purpose and that the material world is not everything.

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