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Heroes Community > Heroes 5 - Modders Workshop > Thread: [MOD] New Start Skills - all Heroes will allow Ultimate Ability.
Thread: [MOD] New Start Skills - all Heroes will allow Ultimate Ability.
alcibiades
alcibiades


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
posted June 29, 2006 12:16 PM
Edited by alcibiades at 14:58, 02 Oct 2010.

[MOD] New Start Skills - all Heroes will allow Ultimate Ability.

I've made a MOD, that replaces the starting abilities for Heroes, that previously were denied from gaining their Ultimate Skill due to wrong starting ability. This MOD only refers to the new skill tables of this MOD: MOD: Ultimate Ability only requires 4 skills - a separate MOD would have to be made in order to refer to the official Skill trees. (I could make such a mod on request. Please note: The MOD will only work if the map or campaign does not specifically state that the Hero will start with other skills than his or her "usual" skills.

The MOD is available here:
MOD: New Start Skills for Heroes

A total of 12 Heroes have been changed. The changes are usually Sorcery Mana Regeneration > Sorcery Arcane Training, Luck Resistance > Luck Soldier's Luck and Defence Protection > Defence Vitality plus a couple of changes in Enlightenment.

The MOD should work - this shot shows Wizard Maahir starting with Sorcery > Arcane Training instead of Sorcery > Mana Regeneration:


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Zeldor
Zeldor


Known Hero
The Bringer of Pestilence
posted June 29, 2006 08:16 PM

alcibiades:

I would prefer to see their primary abilities boosted instead. There should be some heroes that cannot gain ultimate.

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alcibiades
alcibiades


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
posted June 29, 2006 10:29 PM

Well - I guess we disagree on that, then. That would be another MOD then - this one has as its purpose only to fix the problem with some Heroes being barred from that ability.

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Zeldor
Zeldor


Known Hero
The Bringer of Pestilence
posted June 29, 2006 11:02 PM

If everyone can get it then it is not so ultimate

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Ma_trix
Ma_trix


Adventuring Hero
Carpe Diem
posted June 29, 2006 11:02 PM

I can't agree with you, Zeldor. Why some heroes should be discriminated by taking them chance of achieving ultimate ability? There should be equality (and tollerance of course, but that's different subject )!

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Zeldor
Zeldor


Known Hero
The Bringer of Pestilence
posted June 29, 2006 11:23 PM

Matrix:

Now it is unfair, but I don't think that giving each hero the ability to get ultimate it not good too. I think that all heroes that can't get it should be simply improved [make their hero ability better].

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alcibiades
alcibiades


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
posted June 30, 2006 08:48 AM

Well, first of all, I don't think it's possible to change the Hero special abilities - it's not as easy as changing the skill trees, at least.

Second, I don't like discrimination between the Heroes, and when they included the Ultimate Ability concept in the game, it is inevitably going to be something that people are going to strive for, because it is, well, ultimate. One can then take some different approaches to the whole thing - one could make the requirements for the skill very complicated and possibly concist of a range of rather mediocre skills; or one could make the requirements less complicated and concist mainly of skills relevant for that class.

The first approach might have it's advantages - by making it depend on a range of mediocre skills, you will make certain that the Heroes that actually do obtain it are not overpowered. That seems to be the approach they made in the game - to include crappy and irrelevant skills (like War Machines for Rage Of The Elements and Summoning Magic for Arcane Omniscience). In this case, it doesn't matter too much if all Heroes won't be able to reach the Ultimate Ability - because in the end, it might not even be worth it to get it, because you will be blocked from a range of important skills during the game.

The second approach had the obvious advantage, that it brings the Ultimate Ability more into play - but also has the disadvantage that it makes it so much more powerfull. Thus, if you go for the second approach, which is basically what I did with my mod to change the skill requirements, you also have to make the Ultimate Ability available to everyone - otherwise, it'll simply be too unballanced. Of course, a major disadvantage with this approach is that you risk to be going to have less variation in your approach to the game from play to play.

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MaturanTheRed
MaturanTheRed

Tavern Dweller
posted July 01, 2006 11:21 AM

Actually it is possible to change some of the hero-specialities in GameMechanics\RPGStats\DefaultStats.xdb

Anyways I don't know where to change the simple unit-specalizations.
(zombie lord,...)

Quote:
<HeroSpecializations>
<Knight>
<CavalryCommander_JoustingBonus>0.02</CavalryCommander_JoustingBonus>
<CavalryCommander_JoustingBonusPerLevel>0.02</CavalryCommander_JoustingBonusPerLevel>
<CavalryCommander_HolyChargeBonus>0.01</CavalryCommander_HolyChargeBonus>
<Expediter_HasteBonusPerLevel>0.01</Expediter_HasteBonusPerLevel>
<Wanderer_MPBonusBase>0</Wanderer_MPBonusBase>
<Wanderer_MPBonusPerLevel>0.01</Wanderer_MPBonusPerLevel>
<Wanderer_LevelDivisor>2</Wanderer_LevelDivisor>
</Knight>
<Demonlord>
<Hypnotist_ManaDrainPerLevel>1</Hypnotist_ManaDrainPerLevel>
<Bombardier_FireballSpellpower>1</Bombardier_FireballSpellpower>
<Bombardier_FireballSpellpowerPerLevel4>1</Bombardier_FireballSpellpowerPerLevel4>
<Beater_MPBonusBase>0.05</Beater_MPBonusBase>
<Beater_MPBonusPerLevel>0.01</Beater_MPBonusPerLevel>
<Beater_LevelDivisor>4</Beater_LevelDivisor>
<Furious_InitiativeBonusBase>0</Furious_InitiativeBonusBase>
<Furious_InitiativeBonusPerLevel>0.01</Furious_InitiativeBonusPerLevel>
</Demonlord>
<Ranger>
<CallOfTheWasp_DamageBonusPerLevel>0.02</CallOfTheWasp_DamageBonusPerLevel>
<CallOfTheWasp_ATBReducePerLevel3>0.01</CallOfTheWasp_ATBReducePerLevel3>
</Ranger>
<Necromancer>
<Soulhunter_ManesSummonedPerLevel>1</Soulhunter_ManesSummonedPerLevel>
</Necromancer>
<Wizard>
<Radiant_MirrorProb>0.4</Radiant_MirrorProb>
<Radiant_MirrorProbPerLevel>0.02</Radiant_MirrorProbPerLevel>
<Disrupter_Damage>10</Disrupter_Damage>
<Disrupter_DamagePerLevel3>10</Disrupter_DamagePerLevel3>
<TimeShiftStopFactor>0.05</TimeShiftStopFactor>
<TimeShiftBonusATBPerLevel>0.5</TimeShiftBonusATBPerLevel>
<FeatherMage_InitiativeBonusBase>0</FeatherMage_InitiativeBonusBase>
<FeatherMage_InitiativeBonusPerLevel>0.005</FeatherMage_InitiativeBonusPerLevel>
</Wizard>
<Warlock>
<Poisoner_PlagueProb>0.1</Poisoner_PlagueProb>
<Poisoner_PlagueProbPerLevel>0.02</Poisoner_PlagueProbPerLevel>
<PowerBargain_CostReduce>0.1</PowerBargain_CostReduce>
<PowerBargain_CostReducePerLevel>0.02</PowerBargain_CostReducePerLevel>
<Prudent_InitiativeDisbonusBase>0</Prudent_InitiativeDisbonusBase>
<Prudent_InitiativeDisbonusPerLevel>0.01</Prudent_InitiativeDisbonusPerLevel>
</Warlock>
</HeroSpecializations>

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sfidanza
sfidanza


Promising
Supreme Hero
posted July 07, 2006 05:45 PM

Just a note about the absolute abilities requirements. I don't think the official requirements are "crappy", like the example you cite, alcibiades:
- War Machines for Rage Of The Elements:
a Warlock is weak when attacking a castle, they may even be the weakest. Basically, the usual damage dealers, raiders, blood furies and hydras, are stuck outside, leaving the dragons alone inside the walls, and really exposed. So Catapult as a requirement for an absolute warlock makes sense to me. Besides, Warlocks are about offensive and destruction, and Catapult and Tremors to be effective while laying siege is completely in line with that.

- Summoning Magic for Arcane Omniscience
A wizard is about magic, so at least one of the 4 magic skills should be required for an absolute Wizard. Summoning Magic being the primary school for the Academy, it is the most logical skill that could be required.

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alcibiades
alcibiades


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
posted July 08, 2006 03:15 PM

Sfidanza - well, I can follow your point on War Machines for the Warlock, but still, it's a skill that's way down the line for me when I play - and I'll still hold my point that Destructive Magic is a more likely choice that War Machines. And of course, my prefferences are tinted by my oppinion that War Machines and Summoning Magic are the two most useless skills, that I will avoid at all cost. And so, the mod is made to accomplish my wishes - after all, I made the mod.

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Icynova
Icynova

Tavern Dweller
posted September 29, 2010 09:46 PM

Great. Another broken link.

Can someone please re-post the "NewHeroStartSkills.pak" file?
____________

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alcibiades
alcibiades


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
posted September 29, 2010 10:02 PM
Edited by alcibiades at 14:58, 02 Oct 2010.

I can try to upload the file again when I'm home tomorrow.

Sorry for delay. Link is updated.
____________
What will happen now?

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