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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted July 12, 2006 05:19 PM |
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2x more stacks = twice as easily owned by meteor shower ^^
Pick your favorites, since you'll (almost) never have enough gold for all of them ;X
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Fuzzier
Adventuring Hero
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posted July 13, 2006 08:21 AM |
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Quote:
I on the otherhand find it refreshing. It is actually now more usefull to use more than one Super_Duper Main hero, than what is was in Heroes 3. I always thought that more advantage should be given to them, who make several armies instead of the dull "all creatures to one hero and bam" approach.
edit: The devs initially made it that if you took all creatures from castle your creatures had very little room to deploy themselves during the tactics phase. It was a good idea, but that made the combat size so small that it crippled strategy on that end. Anyways the aim there was the same, that it wouldn't be wise to amass all creatures to one hero.
The "1+1>2" effect only applies to casters, and this is very very stupid.
Your suggestion is not logical either. You don't train your army, then you must lose.
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TowerLord
Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
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posted July 13, 2006 09:32 AM |
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I tested the pitlords last night ... the numbers provided by Shauku83 seem to be the right ones  ... that makes them quite effective in small numbers , but not very impressive when you have 10 or more of them .
And dont forget their low initiative. Also they are only a one time thing, they can cast only one meteor shower or maybe 2 fireballs... The nice thing about them is that they bring some new potential strategies to the inferno army . I think I'd rather build them instead of the Devils
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted July 13, 2006 09:59 AM |
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Quote:
Quote:
That's no more of an argument than saying that 1000 archers should do less damage because their arrows collide in the air (or something like that). That's not how the game works, it's not supposed to be realistic, and I think it's devastating for gameplay that you will actually do greater damage with your casters if you group them into several groups and then leave out some other units.
I on the otherhand find it refreshing. It is actually now more usefull to use more than one Super_Duper Main hero, than what is was in Heroes 3. I always thought that more advantage should be given to them, who make several armies instead of the dull "all creatures to one hero and bam" approach.
edit: The devs initially made it that if you took all creatures from castle your creatures had very little room to deploy themselves during the tactics phase. It was a good idea, but that made the combat size so small that it crippled strategy on that end. Anyways the aim there was the same, that it wouldn't be wise to amass all creatures to one hero.
I agree with fuzzier, the idea of forcing you to make several smaller armies is not very good for gameplay as I see it, because if you are playing vs. someone who groups all his units into one army because he has no offensive spellcasters (= NECROMANCER) you will be f*cked when you encounter his army.
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TowerLord
Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
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posted July 14, 2006 08:56 AM |
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Well it seems to me, from your posts , that inferno is the only alternative against heaven... inferno with deleb as main... is there no other way to fight back against heaven ?!
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rainalcar
Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
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posted July 14, 2006 09:02 AM |
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Against haven with divine guidance - extremely difficult. I totaly changed my mind of that ability after testing.
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted July 14, 2006 09:09 AM |
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Yes, I was very surprised at how usefull I found the Divine Guidance ability after trying it.
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TowerLord
Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
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posted July 14, 2006 09:12 AM |
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Quote:
Yes, I was very surprised at how usefull I found the Divine Guidance ability after trying it.
hmm .. i have to try it myself ... though i think lidership is one of the worst skills 
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Klaital
Known Hero
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posted July 14, 2006 09:26 AM |
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Leadership is good for haven since having +5 morale means your guys do insane damage with Retribution.
Also as to fighting haven, I just finished a game where I owned haven with dungeon. Sinitar killing 29 paladins with one empowered implosion was a bit more than they could handle.  Emerald Slippers and Enlightenment means lots and lots of damage.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted July 14, 2006 09:29 AM |
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Quote:
Well it seems to me, from your posts , that inferno is the only alternative against heaven... inferno with deleb as main... is there no other way to fight back against heaven ?!
a necromancer using frenzy maybe? or earlygame-rushing warlock with powerful spells? there are many possibilities.
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Fuzzier
Adventuring Hero
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posted July 14, 2006 09:40 AM |
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Divine Guidance is just another crazy belongings of Haven: making a troop act again almost immediately.
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TowerLord
Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
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posted July 14, 2006 09:41 AM |
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Quote:
Quote:
Well it seems to me, from your posts , that inferno is the only alternative against heaven... inferno with deleb as main... is there no other way to fight back against heaven ?!
a necromancer using frenzy maybe? or earlygame-rushing warlock with powerful spells? there are many possibilities.
yes ... i always thought there was potential in the warlocks spells. but it surely depends on the moment the battle takes place... if it's early, it might be too much for the heaven army to handle, but later in the game those spells wont be such a big threat.
the skelli archers are easy meat for the griffins battle dive combined with the marksmen and inquisitors shots and the squires shield... and the other necro troops mean are quite bad.
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TowerLord
Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
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posted July 14, 2006 09:47 AM |
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Quote:
Leadership is good for haven since having +5 morale means your guys do insane damage with Retribution.
Also as to fighting haven, I just finished a game where I owned haven with dungeon. Sinitar killing 29 paladins with one empowered implosion was a bit more than they could handle. Emerald Slippers and Enlightenment means lots and lots of damage.
against dungeon , the heaven player must go for an all ofense strategy. those paladins should have taken out one of your stacks before you casted that implosion on them ... and all the other heaven troops should have been all over you... by the time you casted your second implosion, all the heaven troops should have been hasted and righteous mighted ... and then then they could make a good stand ... maybe your opponent was not that good  ... 29 paladins means middle to late game, and heaven should have the upper hand there.
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rainalcar
Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
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posted July 14, 2006 10:20 AM |
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Considering the size of maps in H5, 29 paladins is a fairly late game.
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rainalcar
Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
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posted July 14, 2006 10:24 AM |
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Leadership + Retribution is so overpowered compared to some other skills. With simple expert leadership + retribution you get the damage modifier of 1.15 AND +3 morale - with expert attack you get only the modifier of 1.15; with +5 morale retribution modifier changes to 1.25, a huge boost.
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TowerLord
Promising
Supreme Hero
Hero of Good, Slayer of Evil
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posted July 14, 2006 10:26 AM |
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Quote:
Leadership + Retribution is so overpowered compared to some other skills. With simple expert leadership + retribution you get the damage modifier of 1.15 AND +3 morale - with expert attack you get only the modifier of 1.15; with +5 morale retribution modifier changes to 1.25, a huge boost.
but you can get that morale out of artifacts and other stuff from the map ... i dont think you really need leadership for morale
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rainalcar
Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
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posted July 14, 2006 10:28 AM |
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Quote:
Leadership + Retribution is so overpowered compared to some other skills. With simple expert leadership + retribution you get the damage modifier of 1.15 AND +3 morale - with expert attack you get only the modifier of 1.15; with +5 morale retribution modifier changes to 1.25, a huge boost.
edit: as for the damage spells, meteor shower is the only safe place: if it happens that your first implosion/chain lightning is resisted you are probably screwed for the fight.
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rainalcar
Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
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posted July 14, 2006 10:34 AM |
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but you can get that morale out of artifacts and other stuff from the map ... i dont think you really need leadership for morale
Well, debatable. I don't think that any good player will let you run around and rise luck and moral through objects - and if he is afraid of that possibility he will make sure to attack you with a secondary hero first so that you lose those bonuses.
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Klaital
Known Hero
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posted July 14, 2006 11:44 AM |
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Well there were total of 38 paladins, he also had like 118 priests but no squires at all so I quess he trained those all to priests and some all the way up to paladins. It was in the Rise to Power map. The final confrontation between the last two people left.
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rainalcar
Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
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posted July 14, 2006 12:11 PM |
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That is not possible, squires cannot be trained because griffins are not a human unit, you can only train
peasant-archer-squire and monk-cavalier. I do wonder how long the game lasted; rise to power usualy isn't that long...
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