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Heroes Community > Heroes 5 - Temple of Ashan > Thread: strategics of advance heroes
Thread: strategics of advance heroes
syberpuppy
syberpuppy

Tavern Dweller
posted March 06, 2007 01:34 AM

strategics of advance heroes

hey guys...

I'm new at this forum, but not at the game, I've just finished compiling a list of advancement strategies for the heroes of every castle type in h5, taking into consideration the armies capabilities and the heroes- i think the strategy im heading for in each hero is obvious from the skills but if not, feel free to ask.

I do have a pdf ready but because i don't have anywhere to upload it into, I'll just post it here as text... enjoy

Wizard

Power (Special) Route:

Artificer->Mark of the Wizard(*)-> Magic mirror(**) -> Arcane Omniscience -> Consume Artifact
Summoning Magic -> Master of Conjuration -> Banish -> (*)Wall of Fog(M)
Enlightenment -> Scholar -> Wizard's Reward -> Graduate(M)
Sorcery -> Arcane Training -> Counterspell -> (**)Erratic Mana(M)
Attack -> Archery -> Flaming Arrows -> (*)Cold Steel(M)

Logistics > Pathfinding -> March of the Golems -> (*)Teleport Assault


Alternatives:
Destructive Magic -> (**)Sap Magic -> (*)Fiery Wrath -> Master of Ice



- No other root is advised in wizard towns  
Warlock

Power Route:

Elemental Chains -> Empowered spells -> Elemental Vision -> Dark Ritual(***)
Destructive Magic -> Master of Ice -> Master of Fire -> (***)Secrets of destruction
Sorcery -> Magic Insight -> Mana Regeneration -> Erratic Mana
Luck -> Soldier's Luck -> Warlock's Luck -> Magic Resistance
Enlightenment -> Intelligence -> Arcane Intuition -> Dark Revelation
Logistics -> Scouting -> Teleport Assault -> (***)Death March

Alternatives:
Summoning Magic -> Master of Life -> Master of Conjuration -> Exorcism



Special Route:

Elemental Chains -> Empowered spells -> Elemental Vision(**) -> Dark Ritual(***) -> Elements' Rage
Logistics -> Scouting -> Teleport Assault -> (***)Death March(****)
Luck -> Soldier's Luck -> Warlock's Luck -> (****)Tear of Asha Vision(M)
Enlightenment -> Arcane Intuition -> Dark Revelation -> (**)Wizard's Reward(M)
War Machines -> Catapult -> Tremors -> Plague Tent(M)

Destructive Magic -> Master of Ice -> Master of Fire -> (***)Secrets of destruction

Knight

Power Route:

Training -> Benediction(*) -> Retaliation Strike(**) -> Expert Trainer(***)
Logistics > Pathfinding -> Familiar Ground -> (***)Death March
Leadership -> (**)Divine Guidance -> (*)Aura of Swiftnes(****) -> Diplomacy
Light Magic -> Master of Blessings -> Guardian Angel -> Master of Wrath
Attack -> (***)Retribution -> Tactics -> Archery
Enlightenment -> Intelligence -> Arcane Intuition -> Scholar

Alternatives:
Defense -> Vitality -> Stand Your Ground -> (****)Last Stand
Destructive Magic -> Master of Fire -> (***)Fiery Wrath -> Master of Ice


- Special root is not advised in haven towns

Deamolord

Power Route:
 
Gating -> Hellfire(*) -> Mark of the Damned(**) -> Consume Corpse(***)
Logistics > Pathfinding -> Swift Gating -> (***)Teleport Assault
Destructive Magic -> Master of Fire -> (*)Searing Fires -> Master of Ice
Enlightenment -> Intelligence -> Scholar -> Arcane Exaltation
Dark Magic -> (**)Weakening Strike -> Master of Mind -> Dark Renewal(****)
Luck -> Soldier's Luck -> Swarming Gate -> (****)Dead Man's Curse


Alternatives:
Defense -> Evasion -> (*)Hellwrath -> Stand Your Ground
Leadership  -> Recruitment  ->  Gate Master  ->   Diplomacy



Special Route:
Gating -> Hellfire(*) -> Mark of the Damned(**) -> Consume Corpse(***) -> Urgash's Call
Logistics > Pathfinding -> Swift Gating -> (***)Teleport Assault(M)
Dark Magic -> (**)Weakening Strike -> Master of Mind -> Dark Renewal(****)
Luck -> Soldier's Luck -> Swarming Gate -> (****)Dead Man's Curse(M)
Attack -> Battle Frenzy -> Excruciating Strike -> Power of Speed(M)

Sorcery / Enlightenment / Destructive Magic -> Master of Fire -> (*)Searing Fires  

Necromancer

Power (Special) Route:

Necromancy -> Banshee Howl(M) -> Eternal Servitude(**) -> Necromancer's Mark(***) -> Howl of Terror
Logistics -> Pathfinding -> Death March -> Silent Stalker (M)
Enlightenment -> Scholar -> Lord of the Undead -> (***)Dark Revelation(****)
Attack -> Battle Frenzy -> Cold Steel -> (**)Power of Speed (M)
Dark Magic -> (****)Corrupted Soil (M) -> Master of Mind -> Master of Pain

Summoning Magic -> Master of Life -> Master of Conjuration -> Haunted Mines

Alternatives:

Light Magic -> Master of Blessings -> Twilight -> Master of Wrath



Ranger



Power Route:

Avenger -> Imbue Arrow(*) -> Deadeye Shot(**) -> Rain of Arrows(***)
War Machines -> Ballista -> (*)Imbue Ballista -> (***)Triple Ballista
Enlightenment -> Intelligence -> Arcane Intuition -> Know Your Enemy  
Logistics -> Scouting -> Silent Stalker -> Familiar Ground(****)
Destructive Magic -> Master of Fire -> Master of Ice -> Mana Burst
Luck -> Soldier's Luck -> Elven Luck -> (***)Dead Man's Curse

Alternatives:
Attack -> Battle Frenzy -> Nature's Wrath -> (*)Flaming Arrows
Defense -> Vitality -> Last Stand -> (****)Stand Your Ground
Summoning Magic -> Master of Earthblood -> Wall of Fog -> Master of Life



Special Route:

Avenger -> Imbue Arrow(*) -> Deadeye Shot(**) -> Rain of Arrows(***) -> Nature Luck
Logistics -> Scouting -> Silent Stalker -> Familiar Ground(****)
Defense -> Vitality -> Last Stand -> (****)Stand Your Ground (M)
Luck -> Soldier's Luck -> Elven Luck -> (***)Dead Man's Curse(M)
Attack -> Battle Frenzy -> Nature's Wrath -> (*)Flaming Arrows(M)

Enlightenment -> Intelligence -> Arcane Intuition -> Know Your Enemy  

Runemage

Power Route:

Runelore -> Refresh Rune(*) -> Greater Rune(**) -> Fine Rune(***)
Logistics > Pathfinding -> Snatch -> (*)Swift Mind
Enlightenment -> Arcane Intuition -> Tap Runes -> (***) Mentoring(****)
Leadership -> Diplomacy -> Runic Attunement -> (****)Empathy

Summoning Magic -> Master of Life -> Runic Armor -> (**) Exorcism(*****)
Attack -> Tactics -> Offensive Formation -> (****) & (*****) Retribution

Alternatives:
Sorcery -> Arcane Training -> Distract -> Magic Insight
Destructive Magic -> Master of Fire -> Ignite -> Master of Ice

Defense -> Protection -> Defensive Formation -> Preparation


Special Route:

Runelore -> Refresh Rune(*) -> Greater Rune (**) -> Fine Rune(***) -> Absolute Protection
Logistics > Pathfinding -> Snatch -> (*)Swift Mind(M)
Defense -> Protection -> Defensive Formation -> Preparation(M)
Destructive Magic -> Master of Fire -> Ignite -> Mana Burst(M)
War Machines -> Ballista -> Runic Machines -> (**)Triple Ballista(M)

Enlightenment -> Arcane Intuition -> Tap Runes ->  (***) Mentoring(****)

Short Explanations:

- Stars sign (i.e. "(**)") before the name of a skill means that the skill has a perquisite (other then its direct one in the same skill type), that perquisite will have the same stars sign after the skill name.
The example above shows that we need to acquire the "Yyyy Yy Yyyyyyy" skill in order to acquire the "Xxxxxx Xxx Xxxxx" skill.

- The M sign (M) after the name of a skill means that the skill is the direct perquisite to the "Master Skill" the most powerful and hard to achive skill of that hero type (i.e. "Arcane Omniscience"), the skill usually located at the end of the first skill row, in the special route of each hero type.
The example above shows that we need to acquire the "Xxxxxx Xxx Xxxxx" skill in order to acquire the "Master Skill".

- Arrow sign (-> before the name of a skill means either that the skill has the skill before the arrow sign as a perquisite or that it is recommended to take it in that order for some reason.
The example above shows that we either need, or want, to acquire the            "Yyyy Yy Yyyyyyy" skill before acquiring the "Xxxxxx Xxx Xxxxx" skill.

Example:
 
Yyyy Yy Yyyyyyy(**)   ->
Zzzz Zzzzzz  -> (**)Xxxxxx Xxx Xxxxx(M) ->


Power Route- This advancement route describes the way to exert the most power out of your hero and army, often abandoning the almost unattainable "Master Skill" for easier and, in most cases, more powerful skills.

 You can also customize the power route by switching some of the skill types with the also powerful skill types in Alternatives.

Special Route- Here described the way to acquire the "Master Skill" and separated below is the recommended changeable skill type.

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Pomo
Pomo


Famous Hero
The lone peasant
posted March 06, 2007 02:47 AM
Edited by Pomo at 05:30, 06 Mar 2007.

Well not meaning to flame, but I'm not sure how useful something like this is, because usually you won't have that many level-ups anyway, so you need to decide between different skills, not just take everything - also the best skill choice can vary quite a lot against different opponents.

I didn't read through absolutely everything in detail, but you seem to almost uniformly indicate perks over the basic abilities, which are in many cases more useful.

Why put expert trainer on your main knight hero? You can just get a secondary hero to have a few levels with expert trainer and expert counterstrike. Edit: Retribution I guess, otherwise no reason

Also destructive magic as an alternative skill path for knight?!!??! No spellpower, no knowledge, no destructive in guild, no perks etc designed to help it... just no.

Edit: the required path for the ultimate skill is already available online, you should look at the skill wheels over at celestial heavens.
____________
linkTouched by His Noodly Appendage

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Darkeye
Darkeye


Promising
Famous Hero
of the Deep
posted March 06, 2007 04:20 PM
Edited by Darkeye at 00:06, 09 Mar 2007.

Yes, expert trainer is a waste on your primary hero. It doesn't contribute to much useful abilities either. You'll need it to get Power of Speed, but then you already have expert dark magic without mass slow (as weakening strike blocks master of mind). You end up with neither expert mass slow or haste.

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alcibiades
alcibiades


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
posted March 06, 2007 06:11 PM

Quote:
Yes, expert trainer is a wate on your primary hero.


Eh - you don't consider Retribution a useful ability?
____________
What will happen now?

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syberpuppy
syberpuppy

Tavern Dweller
posted March 07, 2007 02:53 PM

Quote:
Well not meaning to flame, but I'm not sure how useful something like this is, because usually you won't have that many level-ups anyway, so you need to decide between different skills, not just take everything - also the best skill choice can vary quite a lot against different opponents.

I didn't read through absolutely everything in detail, but you seem to almost uniformly indicate perks over the basic abilities, which are in many cases more useful.

Why put expert trainer on your main knight hero? You can just get a secondary hero to have a few levels with expert trainer and expert counterstrike. Edit: Retribution I guess, otherwise no reason

Also destructive magic as an alternative skill path for knight?!!??! No spellpower, no knowledge, no destructive in guild, no perks etc designed to help it... just no.

Edit: the required path for the ultimate skill is already available online, you should look at the skill wheels over at celestial heavens.



Thirst of all although you wont have all the skills you'll still have most so the skills i wrote are the skills you want to drive to, also , even with all the planing, you don't always have full control on the skills you'll be offered, and the order of the skills and skill types does have some relevance to the preference.

As for the perks i do agree they are of less importance normally but you can design a powerful strategy around some, like the ranger's Imbue triple Ballista (and some gremlins) combined with destructive or summon magic (though very hard to achieve).

Retribution is a very powerful skill combined with leadership (as attack is given for knights) and doesn't hard to achieve.

I agree destructive magic is a poor choice and is there only to fill the knights empty variety of choices (and is last for that).
about the "why is that skill there" you don't always have choices so im writing all the skill progression for a already chosen skill (like the very useless Consume Artifact skill).

About the ultimate skill... its more for me (though it's most cases a waste of time) but still there are different order and additional skill type in the ultimate skill route.

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grow
grow


Adventuring Hero
posted March 08, 2007 10:38 PM

bottom line- you cant say what the best skills and there abilities would be for the obvious reasons you already know why

luck is more or less always a good thing to have but just for an example that you cant say anything is "best"...

youd have say expert luck + warlocks luck and being theres plenty of artifacts it not rare to run into somebody with ones that lower it to negative and then you got regular damage at best


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Darkeye
Darkeye


Promising
Famous Hero
of the Deep
posted March 09, 2007 12:09 AM

Quote:
Eh - you don't consider Retribution a useful ability?
Nope - I don't fancy any of the knight abilities, but Expert trainer like estates is a secondary hero ability (Expert trainer does at least something useful when training troops).

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pomo
pomo


Famous Hero
The lone peasant
posted March 09, 2007 02:23 AM

Well I do think that retribution is useful, at 5 morale you get +25% damage, so if you have the points it's very decent. Better than expert attack by itself. Are you thinking of retaliation strike? That said, you do need a lot of stuff to make it worthwhile, so I wouldn't consider it imperative.

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Darkeye
Darkeye


Promising
Famous Hero
of the Deep
posted March 09, 2007 10:06 PM
Edited by Darkeye at 22:11, 09 Mar 2007.

Yes, I was thinking about Retaliation strike, not Retribution.
Retribution is worth the "Expert trainer" to get it (forgot about the skill tree). But to get Power of Speed when you should have Expert Light and Master of Wrath is useless, especially as it demands "Weakening strike".

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syberpuppy
syberpuppy

Tavern Dweller
posted March 10, 2007 01:15 AM

Quote:
bottom line- you cant say what the best skills and there abilities would be for the obvious reasons you already know why



well... you're right, the list can't be absolute or even close because what you need depends on the map and the enemies primarily, but it's not so constant either (it has alternatives, and the order most of the time counts for importance) and it's basically a guideline making it easier (at least for me) to plan a strategy instantly, especially when you have no time to plan, like when you train 7 new heroes to 15th level instantly, using the MUCH too powerful runemage's skill "mentoring".

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