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Heroes Community > Heroes 7+ Altar of Wishes > Thread: Collaboration of H6 Ideas.
Thread: Collaboration of H6 Ideas. This thread is 3 pages long: 1 2 3 · NEXT»
Mytical
Mytical


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
posted November 25, 2007 10:38 AM
Edited by Mytical at 11:00, 28 Nov 2007.

Collaboration of H6 Ideas.

This thread is about various ideas of H6.  While the community one is great, either everything is taken or it is a bit confusing (to some, like me).  Any insights, criticisms, help, or thoughts on our efforts will be gladly accepted.  Also, people should feel free to post their own concepts here.  When we near the end of this, we will take everything and put it to a community vote.  Whichever is the most popular with the community is what we go with.   Also, as stated in the other thread, this is a side mission, but anything here that is liked is free to be used if somebody wishes for that project.  Again, though I have a vision of what I'd like to see for H6 (and some are quite radical and off the wall), even if nothing I write is selected, and somebody else who posted here is..at least I contributed something.

Now, Elvin is helping me currently, as is Ceres, and they will be posting here (I hope) their additions to this project.  It is a massive project just in what I have in vision, so it will take a LOT of time.  Only wish I could code and such to show you what I see, I hope my discriptions will be enough.


First, lets talk about the magic system, and number of skill slots.  I would like to see more types of magic, and more skill slots.  Maybe even a skill tree like system instead of a skill wheel system.  So, the question is...what magic should their be.


So far I have suggested 5 schools.
Light, Dark, Mind, Summoning, Destructive

Paraform has suggested a 10 class magic system.  Fire, Water, Air, Earth, Dark, Light, Mind, Nature, Steel, and Magic.  

Elvin has suggested a 5 school system.  Elemental, Light, Dark, Summoning, Adventure.  The relivent posts have the details on these schools.  Both very intreguing suggestions.  

Daystar has suggested the two hero class system.

Skill Tree suggested, with some disagreement.

Watcher83 suggested a skill spell tie in that requires 2 specific skills to get some spells.
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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
posted November 25, 2007 01:17 PM

Quote:
Light - However, I don't see light as purely blessing, cursing, ect, but also able to be used offensively.  I am not just talking about Divine Vengence or such either.  Spells like Holy Wrath (Direct damage to any enemy unit regardless of town it is affiliated with), Smite (increased damage for a unit unlike bless it doesn't make them do max damage, it increases min-max damage.  Would however stack with bless).  It should also have at least one speed boosting spell (not just init).  Maybe Divine March or something.  Would loose regeneration and Ressurection however.

Somehow I see creation as a part of light. Light is healing, protection, holyness and therefore holy wrathful Could also have summons from creatures of light as angels in case you want to remove them from town About the creation with summons staying after combat you could just attack weak neutrals and summon to boost your army..
And no resurrection in light..?

Quote:
Dark - it is fine as is, however counters for the new spells that light has now would be acceptable.  Would loose Puppet Master and frenzy however.

Since it loses mind spells it could gain back some death spells.

Quote:
Summoning - would add more temporary creature additions (wolves, mechanical, undead) though raise dead would still retain undead after combat.  Though it would loose phantom forces, most of its creatures would now have some solid hitpoints, and most creatures teir 1-5 would be able to be summoned.

Yeah I'd like the idea of other summons but with different abilities and traits yet retain these annoying obstacles If nothing else this school needs some darker summons.

I guess we'll need a compromise
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-Bliz

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Mytical
Mytical


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
posted November 25, 2007 01:25 PM

Hmm very good points.  Yeah, I think creation should be removed, so I will edit my post.  And compromise is fine with me, and remember this is a collaberation, so comprimise will be a requirement
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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
posted November 25, 2007 04:08 PM
Edited by Elvin at 17:17, 25 Nov 2007.

Of course I had written a proposal in my secrets of mana thread so let's see what can come out of this.

My initial thought was the number of schools with 4 as a fine line between simplicity and complexity. One more would work fine, we'd just have to see who gets what and how the distribution works.

I have always liked elemental magic but the H3 way placed too much of an emphasis on them and many spells did not really suit a particular element - I'd prefer them being in one school. Also H5 offered another interesting feature, spells outside elemental school(destructive here) are linked to an element as plague is earth and therefore blocked with rune of immunity(earth). I'd like to combine that so having an elemental mastery could give additional properties to spells from another magic type.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Elemental magic: It deals with the four elements exclusively but does not focus on their destructive side. Spells like a mud field that works as the H3 slow but with an area of effect, geyzer that may launch a unit to another tile, gust of wind for displacing units within a radius towards a direction of your choice, purifying rain as anticursing and mild healing, air shield versus ranged units etc could also be in. The amount of innovative spells here can make it so much easier for balancing with the other spells while not requiring the obligatory light to counter dark magic as in H5.
Quite a different approach, we'll see how it goes.

I'd keep the current masteries of fire, water and air with earth magic being the heavy damage dealer and having a fixed area of effect for each spell. The area of effect could change but only with advancing your elemental magic. Example meteor shower has a 3x3 effect which becomes 4x4 with expert elemental magic. The effects for the others are given as stun, freeze and say ignite(rather than armour decreasing) but with specific additions according to spell. Air can give an extra displacement tile to air spells, water heals more and makes units more vulnerable to lightning with rain spells and fire giving an attack reducing property(say -2 attack each time you are attacked) in fireshield or spells of similar nature. With this in mind chain lightning could become an aoe that not only hurts units but also soaks them for the next lightning spell to come if you have the water mastery. Or the mudfield having increased effectiveness with water. That way masteries can affect spells from another element as well.

Light magic: A blend between the H5 light and H4 life magic, this school is about protection, resurrection, blessings as well as healing and the bane of the undead. I never liked the ward spells as they could be a potentially useless spell but healing spells are a distinct light flavour and I'd like to see some back again. A mass healing like divine interception that could be a mass resurrection with no hp reduction - I always hated how it resurrected heroes only. Guardian angel was a brilliant spell and I was also fond of regeneration, martyr and divine shield(?). Holy word is a pathetic excuse for lvl 5, I'd make it lvl 2 or 3 and change it to sacred wrath  which would damage evil units(double that to undead) and would also give a bonus to friendly unit's damage if having master of wrath. Naturally prayer would also have to be in as an aoe with the master of blessings giving it extra area of effect.
As for the abilities. I believe a healing mastery would be needed as it is a light trademark - it improves the healing power and area of effect for some as regeneration. Master of wrath for the damaging(evil), hasting and stat increasing spells and master of blessings that is mostly protection, prayer, encouraging spells. Healing unlocks a passive resurrection skill for the living units(after combat) and also increases resurrection power. Master of fire gives a small fire percentage to some buffing spells of the wrath category, master of air gives a bonus to haste.
Maybe the summoning of light units should be left for summoning only but it might not be a bad idea.

Dark magic: As you guessed the same idea is used here, dark also includes death. This domain deals with cursing, darkness, spirit raising and debuffing. There are various types of cursing so I will refer to those that are stat decresing from now on. Death should include more effects than just the ones we have. I could easily imagine a wail of the banshee to decrease enemy morale and initiative, a fear spell that makes a unit skip its first turn and have a chance for that each turn, raising different types of undead from enemy stacks, draining life or mana, infection that makes a unit more vulnerable to physical attacks, a darkness domain that gives bonus to dark units and weakens the living, bad luck etc.
First we must have a sickness mastery, one that decreases stats and causes damage. A darkness mastery associated with slow, fear and mind spells(not puppet master ) and a spirit specific one. That summons dead reinforcements from fallen troops, summons powerful avatars(grim reaper, banshee). A conjuration mastery strengthens your spirit affinity.
Considering that you want a separate mind school darkness could gain evil domain spells o disabling. Also I think it's better to keep sumoning undead through dark rather than summoning.

Summoning magic: Something similar with the one we have now spiced up with some nature and illusion.
In this direction we have various summoning spells apart from the classic summon elementals(again elemental mastery strengthens specific elements), phantom forces, creating obstacles or (fire)traps, entangle, banish which affects magical energy and can in turn dispel magical properties  as it can banish summoned units. It would be fun to have a summon similar to those of final fantasy, have a guardian attack with a varying effect and disappear.
For this I would have a conjuration ability that boosts summoned unit numbers(strengthens the spirit mastery in dark), illusion that gives incorporeality to illusion spells(but also strips it from enemies that use illusion) and gets them to act faster and an environment mastery that increases number of mines, strengthens entangle, increases area of effect to obstacle spell. I could envision water mastery boosting entangle and master of blessings summoning 'blessed' troops that deal an extra holy damage or are better protected from curses.

Adventure magic: The adventure spells are obligatory, I just would add some more in an adventure only part of the guild. Basically as it is now but you wouldn't always get summon boat in lvl 1, you might get view mines etc. As it is there are too few adventure spells and there is absolutely no randomness. Scouting spells, scrying(towns, mines, heroes, resources), teleporting. Naturally I would (slightly)boost again dimension door(no movement speed decreased) and town portal for which you would be able to choose your destination at the cost of your remaining movement speed. Yes, summon units helps with that but takes away all the fun of using the spell. The problem with them was that you could use them repeatedly in H3. I'd also add the retreat from battle option to town portal

--------------------------------------------------------------------

About the guild:

Having one specialized school makes things a bit linear and less creative so I'll keep the H5 way with some modifications. Humans should be more about light with the rest random - the death affinity would seem a bit out of place. Undead mainly dark and summoning with a touch of elementalism. Demons dark and summoning(dark summons preferably) with a tendency for fire spells from destructive(better chance for inferno than chain lightning). Wizards summoning and elementals with a touch of light - heck what kind of wizards would they be otherwise? Warlocks with elementals and dark primarily, then summoning. And of course rangers with light, summoning and a bit of elementalism. For a magic-only race the guild would be totally random.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Of course that still leaves some randomness right? Damn straight it should but this way each school is more sufficient against abuses such as those we see in H5's dark spells. There are dispels, there are counters, skills interact with each other so having more than one school can be a benefit.

What I would like removed is that half initiative reduction from mass spells(overpowering on endgame) and the level cap slightly lowered so that more skill picks are possible - as it is it's insane to try and reach level 30.

Also a refresh option in the guild - You pay a small amount to change the available spells - so that some people that pursue only one magic type do not lose because they got the wrong spells. I'd like a research skill from enlightenment that allows spell research. That would either give a new spell after some days.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

The guild lvl 1 has 5 spells, two of which being selected from the town's primary schools and one from the secondary. Three in the case of the knight as he has only one. [for instance 2 light, 2 summoning, 1 elemental for ranger]
The second has 4 with one for each primary, one randomly chosen between the two and the last of the secondary. [here that's 1 light, 1 summoning, 1 of either and 1 elemental]
The third has 3 with each representing the three schools. [1 light, 1 summoning, 1 elemental]
The fourth has 3 with the same format.
And the fifth 2 spells from the primary schools only. [1 light, 1 summoning]

Instead of the library I would rather have an annex of your choice so that you know what will come out of it.
____________
A lot like squirrels. Squirrels are pretty much the crocodiles of the trees.
-Bliz

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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
posted November 25, 2007 05:06 PM
Edited by Elvin at 17:16, 25 Nov 2007.

Strictly speaking summoning has little to do with illusion, you could say that you conjure an illusion but it's still weak. Not that I would mind but sometimes it's good to try a different approach.
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A lot like squirrels. Squirrels are pretty much the crocodiles of the trees.
-Bliz

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Daystar
Daystar


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Back from the Dead
posted November 25, 2007 05:28 PM

I'll put in the thought of 2 hero classes:
Ranger/Herbalist
Knight/Cleric
Overlord/Warlock
Alchemist/Wizard
Revenant/Necromancer
Cultist/Heretic
Planeswalker/Elementalist
Barbarian/ -

etc.
____________
How exactly is luck a skill?

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sith_of_ziost
sith_of_ziost


Promising
Supreme Hero
Scouting the Multiverse
posted November 25, 2007 09:39 PM

Well, this seems like a good thing coming. There are so many Homam VI Threads floating around, so this unification seems good. I can help in any way possible. I am good for abilities, skills, creature names, stuff of the technical sort. I'd like to say at Daystar I am extremerly wary whether Wizards of the Coast copyrighted planeswalker for MTG. But, If they didn't, I want it to look and be good. Maybe with this thread, the Joint Forum Project will see it as a library, if they're stuck.

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Mytical
Mytical


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
posted November 26, 2007 06:17 AM
Edited by Mytical at 08:15, 26 Nov 2007.

This is sort of freeform sith_of_ziost, so anything you want to contribute is more then welcome.  Don't worry if it conflicts with something else here, as I said when the project is done any conflicting things will be put to a community vote.  I will update the master post with a synapsis of everything, though it will probably eventually become unweildy and I will then move to the next post of mine (or have elvin help out).  All ideas are welcome, should be willing to be discussed, and realise there probably will be critics.  Hopefully we can keep it to constructive criticism (gah my spelling stinks).

Expect more from me after I update the master post.  Updated, please if I have forgotten anything, or you wish to suggest changes let me know.

Now lets talk about skills.  Personally in many ways I like the skill tree idea better then the skill wheel idea.  Being limited to 6 'main skills' with perks is just too limiting.  Not being offered certain skills except rarely is also a bit hard to swallow.  So I would like to propose a skill tree.  When you get a level up, you get 1 point to put anywhere you like.  I know some people think oh like WoW.  Hate to tell ya, but this idea was around before WoW was.  Dark Allience (the game) for one, and even that was not the first place to have it.

I suggest starting with 3 main branches.  Might, Magic, Racial.  Yes there would still be a path to an ultimate, and yes it would still make you take skills that would not be so great for the hero, but there is a price to pay for power.  Anyhow, back on track.

With the skill tree, in order to 'buy' certain skills you must have the one above it, but if you have the one above it there is no other limitation (IE even as a mage you can focus on all might skills if you so choose).  Each hero starts with 3 points, which are automatically placed in the main skills.   Each skill under those takes diffent number of points (skills take 3 to master, 'perks' still take one, ect).  You can still get basic, expert, master for the main skills, 1 point at a time of course.  For instance, lets take a sample (and simple) Might tree.

                       Might - 1 point.
(all the next would have 3 points to max. 1 pt basic, 2 expert, ect)
Attack, Defense, War Machines, Logistics, Leadership, Luck

Under say War Machines there would be skills that take at least 1 point in War Machines.  However, if you want every skill under this skill you can have every one, as long as you are willing to spend the points.  (Ie there is no 3 'perk' limit, 1 for each skill level.  You can have basic war machines and have all three under it, but to get the ones under them you'd need 2, and for the ones under them 3 however.)

Tent, Balista, Catapult

And so on.

So if you are willing to spend the points you can have every skill and perk of a certain type.  For instance lets say for the above example you want Expert War_Machines > Ballista, Tent, Catapault, Tripple Ballista, Racial skill (like gob support for stronghold or remote control for wizard), Brimstone Rain for 9 points you could get all of them.  Keeping in mind for TB and Racial you'd have to have advanced war machines, and for brimstone rain you'd have to have expert.

Edit : Added automatic point in magic skill.  Since the initial skills just allow you to purchase things under them, and offer no bonuses, do not see sense in charging for them.  The only reason that it exsists is to separate might skill from magic skills.
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watcher83
watcher83


Supreme Hero
Child of Malassa
posted November 26, 2007 10:25 AM

concerning magic skills
I think it should  be like this:
each skill influences the others
let's say you start with light magic
this should let you cast only strictly classic light magic spells
(bless, heal, ressurection)
then you choose a second skill - let's say attack
attack + light allows you to learn and cast divine vengeance, smite etc
if you choose defense then you get stoneskin, endurance, deflect missile etc
if you choose death you could get vampiric spells (life drain, vampirism)
if you choose logistics you get haste, slow, summon ship etc
if you choose leaqdership you get mirth, rally call, devotion aura
if you choose destructive you get word of light ....

and so on....

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Mytical
Mytical


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
posted November 26, 2007 11:14 AM
Edited by Mytical at 11:38, 26 Nov 2007.

Interesting idea.  And with a point system over a random skill selection choice, that would open up some interesting possibilities.  Personally I would like to hear more of this idea.

Also to 'streamline' the masterpost...I am going to repost my own magic school ideas here, and put only a short version on the first post.


Light - However, I don't see light as purely blessing, cursing, ect, but also able to be used offensively.  I am not just talking about Divine Vengence or such either.  Spells like Holy Wrath (Direct damage to any enemy unit regardless of town it is affiliated with), Smite (increased damage for a unit unlike bless it doesn't make them do max damage, it increases min-max damage.  Would however stack with bless).  It should also have at least one speed boosting spell (not just init).  Maybe Divine March or something.  

Dark - it is fine as is, however counters for the new spells that light has now would be acceptable.  Would loose Puppet Master and frenzy however.


Mind - Puppet Master and frenzy would move here, as would phantom forces.  It would have such spells as Precise Shot, Illusionary Terrain (negatives to movement, init, and ranged damage for enemy), and other spells that specifically affect the mind.

Summoning - would add more temporary creature additions (wolves, mechanical, undead) though raise dead would still retain undead after combat.  Though it would loose phantom forces, most of its creatures would now have some solid hitpoints, and most creatures teir 1-5 would be able to be summoned.

Destructive - remains pretty much as is, but the power scales a bit more for large army end game battles.  A heroes level would also help with the damage of these spells. (the only spell school that does so, all the others just use SP).  For example, does it really seem logical that a level 12 (no expertise or perks) that has say 15 sp does the same damage as a lvl 25 (no expertise or perks) that has 15 SP?  Even if you include perks (and they have the same perks) they still do the same damage.  Wha...??
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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
posted November 26, 2007 12:34 PM

You know a while ago I had thought it would be best to have a point buy skill system. H5 has made things a bit erratic with the starting skills having too much of a significance and potential to scr*w up if you are unlucky. My original idea was that according to the skill's chance to pop up(common, rare etc) it should cost more or less points.

That might have worked but some time later I say the opposite. There is strategy in picking the right skills and avoiding others. With the right choices you get what you want most of the times and the rest of the time you have to improvise. It's just more fun this way, there is no chance to see the same hero all the time nor geeky players memorizing complex strategies that they can perform each time.
What I WOULD like is that there is not such a gap among skill effectiveness. Take sylvan's warmachines. Usually you won't get them but if you do and get flaming arrows as well you enter crazy imbalanced creeping mode. There is little in the matter of choice, it owns.
Same with demonlords. Yes warmachines is a common skill but it's a totally different thing if you get them at lvl 4 or 8.

I'd prefer if things were evened out so that you cannot gain a great advantage just because of luck. I don't say that it's an instant win, far from it but it gives an edge.
____________
A lot like squirrels. Squirrels are pretty much the crocodiles of the trees.
-Bliz

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sith_of_ziost
sith_of_ziost


Promising
Supreme Hero
Scouting the Multiverse
posted November 27, 2007 05:10 AM

The skill point system has a lot of potential. I especially like the removal of the three-skill limit. Seems very workable.

I think there should be racial spells (like warcries for orcs). For example, the dungeon would have castable invisibilty or the Ranger Casting something like Avenger's Force (lowering initiative from a critical avenger's strike). Stuff like that. I'd like to work on this and post some racial spells tomorrow.

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Mytical
Mytical


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
posted November 27, 2007 08:22 AM
Edited by Mytical at 09:39, 27 Nov 2007.

The floor is still open for debate on the tree skill vs tree wheel variation.  I will get to my side of the discussion in a minute.  Remember I keep an open mind, and besides which it would be put to a community vote anyhow.

Next personally I want to talk about ultimates, but to do so we need to discuss towns first.  Much speculation would have to be considered, but here are some directions that 'seem' to be where they are going.

1st there will continue to be a human town, probably still haven, with few if any changes in the line up.  While I would like to see some shaking up of the lineup, doesn't look like it is going to happen.

Next is Inferno.  Most likely the Dark Messiah, leading the army.  Make the Soverin (gah spelling) seem like a boy scout.  Most likely again, little or no change in line up.

So first lets discuss ultimates with the towns that they are probably going with.  Starting with haven.

Unstoppable Charge (I think, don't play haven much).  When compaired to say Ulitmate Luck, not so hot.  Personally I think the towns ultimates should be as balanced as possible.  Though I have some suggestions, mine tend to be Overpowered. Here they are, but I expect better ones soon from others.

Haven seems to be about leadership (morale) more then most things.  So I think it might be a mirror to the Undead's Ultimate.  Where the undead give morale/luck penalties to their enemies I think Haven would give it's own troops morale and luck bonuses. As many points as the Undead's ultimate takes, Haven's should give.  And I think that the 50% cap should be lifted to 75%.  Not quite as good as Ultimate Luck for luck, but since they have a huge morale bonus, it would offset it.  Maybe too much so however.  Perhaps Divine Insperation could be the name of the special.

Sylvan and Fortress would remain the same.  In a case where Fortress met Haven, Haven would still get 75% chance of morale, but always have bad luck (unlike Sylvan the two do not cancel each other out).

Necromancer's special probably would have to be improved.  Don't ask me how though.

Dungeon - Well I probably don't have to tell anybody that their ultimate is terrible.  Then again their racial isn't really anything to write home about either.  However, right now it's about the ultimate.  Empowered Spells are all nice and good, but where as the Wizard's currently teaches every spell there is, I think the Dungeon's should give them additional spell power, without raising the cost, and stack with Empowered Spells.  It would increase the duration and damage of all spells x 2, and if the warlock invoked Empowered spells that would increase the damage for destructive magic further.  So whatever the normal formula it is calculated normally then once calculated it is x 2: Say a spell has duration of level*sp  The formula would then be (level*sp)*2. (where level is expertise level)

Wizards - though perhaps one of the weaker now, all spells is great, I don't know how to change it to balance with the other suggestions however.

Stronghold - Ultimate Rage seems to be pretty potent.  So personally I'd leave it be.

Inferno - Honestly have no clue.  Ultimate is ok, even if not on par with some..wouldn't know how to improve or change that.

Still there could be some good changes that could be proposed.  Town changes/ideas are welcomed.  Personally soon I will be unveiling a couple of new towns, some classic ones with a small twist.  I may just link other threads that have town ideas however.  Keeping with the vein of the way H5 ended..and the Dark Messiah most of my current ideas dont work.


The skill tree (selected skills) vs the Skill Wheel (sometimes random skill) debate.

As it exsists now, too much in the game relies on luck.  The right skills showing up, luck and morale 'runs', sometimes even which creatures are guarding which resource producers.  Personally I would like to make it a little less about luck (good or bad).  With a point skill tree system, in my opinon it becomes more strategic, less luck.  Sure memory mentors are good, and even could stay in the game (to give you back points you've spent), but if you get a bad streak they could cast you a lot of money to get the skills you want (especially when trying for those 2% skills).

However, there is a point to what Elvin stated.  Some skills do make some factions just too powerful.  For those factions, perhaps they would have different more balanced skills and perks.  For instance instead of Flaming Arrows for Sylvan, something else could be offered to ensure that they do not become too powerful.  Thus keeping a bit of strategy over blind (good/bad) luck.
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Moonlith
Moonlith


Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
If all else fails, use Fiyah!
posted November 27, 2007 02:30 PM

Racial spells would be a very bad idea unless you want to aim the H4 spell system way. If you need racial-only spells, give them as castable abilities to creatures in the lineup, such as an ogre unit casting a warsong ability. I can easily see them doing so from the backline to encourage their allied troops.

That aside you can think of ways to make certain spells more likely to appear in the mage guild of specific factions.

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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
posted November 27, 2007 04:07 PM

Yeah much like the H3 towns had better chances to get some spells. Oh and about the morale cap being raised I disagree. Units getting morale every second action is powerful enough on its own, how could the spellcasters keep up? In much the same way I disagree about luck cap at 10 because in the end the effects from a luck decreasing artifact can be totally nullified and you still having 5 luck..
____________
A lot like squirrels. Squirrels are pretty much the crocodiles of the trees.
-Bliz

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Moonlith
Moonlith


Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
If all else fails, use Fiyah!
posted November 28, 2007 12:07 AM

I don't know who gave the suggestion back somewhere else but it was about making the Luck and Morale points give a 5 % chance rather than a 10 % chance, and I rather like that. Luck and Morale skills would give +2, +4, and +6, so they still give a 30% chance. In that sort of system, needless to say, it would harder to obtain the maximum 50% luck / Morale.

That aside, maximum luck shouldn't be raised universally, but I'm definately using a racial skill for Sylvan that increases the maximum possible luck from 10 to 20 points. Doubtfull it can be filled up to the brim, but in my opinion, Sylvan is Defensive and Luck oriented, their damage potential coming from archery and lucky attacks.

Just my two cents

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Mytical
Mytical


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
posted November 28, 2007 07:02 AM
Edited by Mytical at 09:56, 28 Nov 2007.

Both good suggestions, but how then do you see Haven's Ultimate as being?  As is, you must admit, it is a little..underpowered.
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alcibiades
alcibiades


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
posted November 28, 2007 09:16 AM

Quote:
I don't know who gave the suggestion back somewhere else but it was about making the Luck and Morale points give a 5 % chance rather than a 10 % chance, and I rather like that. Luck and Morale skills would give +2, +4, and +6, so they still give a 30% chance. In that sort of system, needless to say, it would harder to obtain the maximum 50% luck / Morale.


That would be me I think.

Anyway, to stay on topic:

Quote:
(...) how then do you see Haven's Racial as being?  As is, you must admit, it is a little ... underpowered.


Eh, when we are talking Haven's racial skill here, are we talking Counterstrike, or are we talking Training? Because I don't see Training as being particularly underpowered ...
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Mytical
Mytical


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
posted November 28, 2007 09:55 AM
Edited by Mytical at 10:58, 28 Nov 2007.

Actually, their Ultimate.  Trying to balance the ultimates as much as possible.  Some may be still somewhat more powerful then the others still however.  Just trying to get all the Ultimate skills as close to balanced as we can it.

Also Edited my post so as to cause less confusion.
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watcher83
watcher83


Supreme Hero
Child of Malassa
posted November 28, 2007 10:49 AM
Edited by watcher83 at 10:51, 28 Nov 2007.

for the knight class
5 classic light spells: lv1 - bless; lv2 - bind wound; lv3 - regeneration; lv4 - prayer; lv5 - ressurection;

if you learn attack
lv1 - bloodlust; lv2 - battle fury; lv3 - righteous might;
lv4 - divine vengeance; lv5 - war frenzy;

if you learn defense
lv1 - hard skin; lv2 - endurance; lv3 - deflect missile; lv - magic immunity; lv5 - sanctuary;

if you learn logistics
lv1 - haste; lv2 - fly; lv3 - instant travel; lv4 - teleportation; lv5 - town portal;

if you learn leadership
lv1 - mirth; lv2 - divine guidance; lv3 - benediction; lv4 - moral ward; lv5 - vengeance;

if you learn dark magic
lv1 - devour; lv2 - mire; lv3 - life drain; lv4 - cloud; lv5 - vampirism;

if you learn destructive
lv1 - smite; lv2 - holy bolt; lv3 - holy nova; lv4 - exorcism;
lv5 - word of light;

if you learn summoning
lv1 - holy fist; lv2 - bind wounds; lv3 - summon falcon spirit;
lv4 - summon griffin spirit; lv5 - summon gold dragon;

if you learn sorcery
lv1 - incantation; lv2 - absorb mana; lv3 - mana burn;
lv4 - mark of light; lv5 - mana implosion;

if you learn enlightment

lv1 - aura of light; lv2 - aura of vengeance; lv3 - aura of steel;
lv4 - martyr; lv5 - spell shackle;

if you learn luck
lv1 - evasion; lv2 - deflect spell; lv3 - incorporeality; lv4 - lucky blow; lv5 - critical hit;

if you learn war machines - you are able to cast some magic spells on your war mchines

for the other classes some other day


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