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Heroes Community > Heroes 7+ Altar of Wishes > Thread: Bored of the beta: a mini-review
Thread: Bored of the beta: a mini-review [ This thread is 9 pages long: 1 2 3 (4) 5 6 7 8 9 ]
MagniBronzeb...
MagniBronzebeard


Adventuring Hero
posted July 10, 2011 10:23 AM

TBS are all about randomness anyway. I mean, skill is primary factor between win and loss, but randomness will be always present in these games.

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Doomforge
Doomforge

Hero of Order
Mayhem Elemental
posted July 10, 2011 10:24 AM

Quote:
TBS are all about randomness anyway. I mean, skill is primary factor between win and loss, but randomness will be always present in these games.


Not true. See chess. No place for randomness there and it's one heck of a turn based strategy
____________
I regret nothing, I expect nothing.
NONE OF YOU ARE SAFE!

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Avirosb
Avirosb


Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
posted July 10, 2011 10:32 AM

I always role-play a pawn, because when it gets promoted, it's almost like levelling up

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Crayfish
Crayfish


Known Hero
posted July 10, 2011 01:50 PM

Quote:
Quote:
TBS are all about randomness anyway. I mean, skill is primary factor between win and loss, but randomness will be always present in these games.


Not true. See chess. No place for randomness there and it's one heck of a turn based strategy


Sure, but it's super boring.

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Zenofex
Zenofex


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
posted July 10, 2011 02:02 PM

Quote:
Sure, but it's super boring.
There are many, MANY people who will disagree with you.

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Doomforge
Doomforge

Hero of Order
Mayhem Elemental
posted July 10, 2011 02:13 PM
Edited by Doomforge at 14:14, 10 Jul 2011.

Quote:
Sure, but it's super boring.


To each one's liking. Chess inspired people for thousands of years. I personally like them very much and they are never boring to me.
____________
I regret nothing, I expect nothing.
NONE OF YOU ARE SAFE!

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vaeledrin
vaeledrin


Adventuring Hero
posted July 10, 2011 02:17 PM

Screw Chess, it's boring. Go is where it is at.

That's a REAL strategy game! It's a GRAND strategy game!

And there is only one unit type!
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E-Lysander
E-Lysander


Known Hero
Lysander
posted July 10, 2011 02:33 PM

I'm bored with it too. I got bored with the private Pre-Beta, and I'm bored with the public Beta. Will I be satisfied and play Heroes VI as much as I play Heroes II? Doubt it, but who knows, maybe they've completely overhauled some aspects.

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Doomforge
Doomforge

Hero of Order
Mayhem Elemental
posted July 10, 2011 02:43 PM

well, beta has single hotseat/mp map. It's meant to be played a few times just to get feedback
____________
I regret nothing, I expect nothing.
NONE OF YOU ARE SAFE!

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Crayfish
Crayfish


Known Hero
posted July 10, 2011 03:02 PM
Edited by Crayfish at 15:07, 10 Jul 2011.

Quote:
Quote:
Sure, but it's super boring.
There are many, MANY people who will disagree with you.


I know, I can only give my opinion. I respect that chess requires a lot of skill, thought and knowledge. It's just incredibly boring. I may have a high excitement threshold though, parkour/freerunning is the only activity that really holds my interest these days.

Anyway, that's besides the point. When it comes to games, I like them to feel like games. I'm not really in for this "everything must be like an Olympic sport because winning matters!" vibe. I play fantasy games for fun and I guess a bit of escapism. I'm not saying that randomness is essential to that, but certainly it'd need to be a little more fantastic and um... interesting than chess.

Maybe more maps will make a difference, but the more I've played and thought about HVI, the more evident its failings become. At least most things could theoretically be patched in or come in an expansion, so maybe there's some hope.

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Kitten
Kitten


Known Hero
Roar
posted July 10, 2011 03:05 PM

Quote:
I always role-play a pawn, because when it gets promoted, it's almost like levelling up

xD

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vaeledrin
vaeledrin


Adventuring Hero
posted July 10, 2011 03:17 PM

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Sure, but it's super boring.
There are many, MANY people who will disagree with you.


I know, I can only give my opinion. I respect that chess requires a lot of skill, thought and knowledge. It's just incredibly boring. I may have a high excitement threshold though, parkour/freerunning is the only activity that really holds my interest these days.

Anyway, that's besides the point. When it comes to games, I like them to feel like games. I'm not really in for this "everything must be like an Olympic sport because winning matters!" vibe. I play fantasy games for fun and I guess a bit of escapism. I'm not saying that randomness is essential to that, but certainly it'd need to be a little more fantastic and um... interesting than chess.

Maybe more maps will make a difference, but the more I've played and thought about HVI, the more evident its failings become. At least most things could theoretically be patched in or come in an expansion, so maybe there's some hope.


Winning in itself is also escapism. Life isn't a zero sum game for the most part.
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Crayfish
Crayfish


Known Hero
posted July 10, 2011 03:22 PM

Well... sure, but does every single thing have to be defined by its competitive aspect? There are millions of purely competitive activities out there already. Couldn't some games just be fun?

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted July 10, 2011 03:28 PM

Well, PLAYING is escapism, and doesn't everyone play for their own reasons?

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Davy
Davy


Known Hero
posted July 10, 2011 03:49 PM

Quote:
Quote:
I don't think so.
Now we've got 4 upgraded heroes per faction and they all have unique abilities.

And just because there are now might and magic heroes in every faction doesn't mean,that every faction plays the same,nearly all creatures have unique abilities,that sets them apart from all other creatures.And every faction has also different kinds of magic,so not every faction will be able to learn every spell,making them even more unique...

Did you read some biased Ubisoft advertisement or have you actually played the game ? You're so terribly wrong on every aspect.


Ok,maybe I expressed myself wrong,what I wanted to say is that they have their unique abilities,even though if they are not as unique as in H5 and H4.
I just think,that saying,they are all the same is wrong....

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Zenofex
Zenofex


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
posted July 10, 2011 04:46 PM
Edited by Zenofex at 16:47, 10 Jul 2011.

They don't have any unique abilities, just a small number of skill trees aren't available to certain factions and the third tier of Might/Magic skills is not available for the opposite class. These are pretty much all the differences apart from the racial abilities and the unique versions of Heroic Strike.

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vaeledrin
vaeledrin


Adventuring Hero
posted July 10, 2011 05:57 PM

Quote:
Well... sure, but does every single thing have to be defined by its competitive aspect? There are millions of purely competitive activities out there already. Couldn't some games just be fun?


Games can be fun in themselves and have the added benefit of being fun competitively. I don't see why we can't have both as often as possible.  ;P
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Sherekhaan
Sherekhaan


Hired Hero
posted July 10, 2011 06:22 PM
Edited by Sherekhaan at 18:24, 10 Jul 2011.

I miss the randomness when levelling. Heroes 3 was a bit harsh but H6 is just blah, there's no excitment when you level really.

Heroes 5 was just right, there were enough choices that it pretty rare that I didn't like any of the picks, and those few times made it exciting to see what was available, like corssing my fingers for logistics with wizards. They had the H6 skill system for Heroes Online, and it sucked in that, and it will suck in H6 as well.

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perathekojot
perathekojot


Known Hero
posted July 10, 2011 06:55 PM

I agree with Crayfish on all counts. In Heroes 5 you could play same map, differently just buy picking different hero within same faction, not to mention different faction. Add to that randomness while leveling and you get quite a large number of different scenarios. In Heroes 6 it will be a completely different story, I am afraid. And no matter how much all the other aspect of the game are improved this will be a main reason for a short life span for H6.
Also I don't understand fuzz about random element in H5. There were so many of them, that in the end most of the time it balanced well, all in all. You couldn't get lucky with everything: spells, arties, creeps, initative, luck, morale, weeks, diplomacy,... right? Sure there were some games that gave one side some advance, but that wasn't the case with majority of my games. And after 170+ competitive games in Toh, I can safely say that with fan made maps my scores against other players were pretty much true reflection of each other skills in the game.

Can't understand that anybody can sacrifice so many on altar of balance, when in truth balance was not so bad. Not perfect but you could live with it. On the other side they made all skills pale version of what they use to be, made creeping boring and easy, removed most of race differences, unique heroes abilities, reduced number of spells,...

The game so far just seems poor, superficial and lack depth in most of aspects. I sincerely hope I am wrong, or that it will be improved significantly, but I remain skeptic. What I am sure is that simplification is not an answer.


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E-Lysander
E-Lysander


Known Hero
Lysander
posted July 11, 2011 01:56 AM
Edited by e-lysander at 02:03, 11 Jul 2011.

Hopefully in Heroes of Might and Magic VII, we'll see a return to classic formula. I would like them to at least attempt a continuity to the NWC World... maybe even base the game around the NWC Heroes V design documents, and return to 2D sprites, but in HD.

I thought Heroes V felt a little unlike a Heroes game, but Heroes VI just take that and runs with it. It feels more like a typical turn-based strategy game. The inclusion of classic artifacts and Heroes will do nothing to aid this I fear. It seems as though the developers themselves knew just how far-removed the game felt, so then they might have decided to include classic artifacts and heroes, which makes no sense at all. It reminds me of Soul Calibur IV, which featured Star Wars characters. Players were promised a solid explanation for their inclusion, but no such thing was to be found.

It's like they're incorporating aspects of classic games in all the wrong ways; give us back the classic interface
http://gscanner.info/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/heroes_3_2.jpg
that all of the games had until you (Ubisoft) came along, give us back the classic medieval creature looks instead of making things up (and taking obvious influence from Warcraft), and hire Jon Van Caneghem.

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